Accord Type-R - thoughts/alternatives?
Discussion
Mods- If possible I wanted this left in at least the Jap Chat section (rather than Honda) as I am also after suggestions of anything else I may have overlooked- cheers.
I owned a DC2 Integra for a couple of years (sold last April) as my daily driver- absolutely loved it, really was fantastic. I kept my Mitsubishi Starion for occasional use throughout this period, but due to wanting to free up some cash for something else (and partly due to lack of use of the Starion) I decided to sell the DC2 and return the Starion to daily use.
Fast-forward 10 months, and although I’m still only doing relatively small mileage in terms of commuting/running about, I am really starting to take issue with both the frequency & cost of Petrol station visits in the Starion. This isn’t helped by now having to do a 30mile round trip once a fortnight, on roads that whilst great fun to drive, really only return the lowest of low MPGs.
Also, this increased mileage (small though it might be) is obviously not going to be doing the Starion any favours in the long term. My thoughts are- get a new daily driver that is still going to be fun, interesting, and not too costly to maintain (exactly as the Starion is), yet somewhat more friendly on petrol when simply plodding to & from work.
My first thought was to get another DC2- mine had a few modifications and despite being run solely on V-Power cost me around 30% less on petrol than the Starion does. I loved the engine- I never found it particularly lacking in torque when sat in commuter traffic, and it only seemed to gulp the fuel when properly enjoying it. Perfect.
However, I have a long standing urge for TVR Chimaera ownership in the near future, so I have set my budget firmly at £3,000 (ideally less). The Starion can then go back to being a weekend toy, hopefully until such time as I can get the TVR.
So with that £3K budget effectively ruling out another DC2 (I would want one as good as my last one), I am now seriously considering an Accord Type-R. I love the looks, I’ve heard excellent things regarding the chassis, and I would imagine it should be at least as economical as my DC2 was. As a bonus, the idea of having 4-doors is rather appealing- as are the other ‘toys’ that the Accord has over the DC2.
I have also considered selling the Starion, adding those funds to the pot and going for an S2000. But whilst I don’t need the extra doors/seats day to day, I think there would be enough times that it would quickly annoy me- even if only having the back seats to chuck bags on etc.
I don’t want to go down the ‘mundane commuter car + toy’ route as I may well keep the Starion, and my mileage is small/interesting enough that my DC2 was rarely a chore.
So I guess my main questions are-
-Is the ATR going to feel special enough (after the DC2 & Starion) to keep me interested?
-Are there any obvious alternatives that I have overlooked (Japanese or otherwise)? Other cars I’ve considered include BMW E36 (328), Mondeo ST200 (old shape), Honda CRX (Mk2), Alfa GTV (V6), and many other things- all pretty much dismissed for either being not really interesting enough (first 2), as rust prone as my Starion (CRX), or no better on fuel (the Alfa).
But I am genuinely open to suggestions.
The Accord just seems to tick the most boxes, and I loved the engine in my DC2 (particularly the noise!) so much that another Type-R is massively appealing. I appreciate that I sound like I want to have my cake and eat it, but the DC2 fitted all of these criteria so I figured there must be others?
Apologies for the length of the post and I look forward to hearing peoples thoughts. This isn’t a speculative thing- I have the cash ready to go and will be straight out to view if the right car comes along, but having had no experience of the ATR I wanted to get a better idea of what to expect so I don’t waste a sellers time.
Likewise, if there are any ATR owners on here from around the Oxfordshire area who fancy showing off their pride & joy I would be a willing audience!
Thanks in advance
I owned a DC2 Integra for a couple of years (sold last April) as my daily driver- absolutely loved it, really was fantastic. I kept my Mitsubishi Starion for occasional use throughout this period, but due to wanting to free up some cash for something else (and partly due to lack of use of the Starion) I decided to sell the DC2 and return the Starion to daily use.
Fast-forward 10 months, and although I’m still only doing relatively small mileage in terms of commuting/running about, I am really starting to take issue with both the frequency & cost of Petrol station visits in the Starion. This isn’t helped by now having to do a 30mile round trip once a fortnight, on roads that whilst great fun to drive, really only return the lowest of low MPGs.
Also, this increased mileage (small though it might be) is obviously not going to be doing the Starion any favours in the long term. My thoughts are- get a new daily driver that is still going to be fun, interesting, and not too costly to maintain (exactly as the Starion is), yet somewhat more friendly on petrol when simply plodding to & from work.
My first thought was to get another DC2- mine had a few modifications and despite being run solely on V-Power cost me around 30% less on petrol than the Starion does. I loved the engine- I never found it particularly lacking in torque when sat in commuter traffic, and it only seemed to gulp the fuel when properly enjoying it. Perfect.
However, I have a long standing urge for TVR Chimaera ownership in the near future, so I have set my budget firmly at £3,000 (ideally less). The Starion can then go back to being a weekend toy, hopefully until such time as I can get the TVR.
So with that £3K budget effectively ruling out another DC2 (I would want one as good as my last one), I am now seriously considering an Accord Type-R. I love the looks, I’ve heard excellent things regarding the chassis, and I would imagine it should be at least as economical as my DC2 was. As a bonus, the idea of having 4-doors is rather appealing- as are the other ‘toys’ that the Accord has over the DC2.
I have also considered selling the Starion, adding those funds to the pot and going for an S2000. But whilst I don’t need the extra doors/seats day to day, I think there would be enough times that it would quickly annoy me- even if only having the back seats to chuck bags on etc.
I don’t want to go down the ‘mundane commuter car + toy’ route as I may well keep the Starion, and my mileage is small/interesting enough that my DC2 was rarely a chore.
So I guess my main questions are-
-Is the ATR going to feel special enough (after the DC2 & Starion) to keep me interested?
-Are there any obvious alternatives that I have overlooked (Japanese or otherwise)? Other cars I’ve considered include BMW E36 (328), Mondeo ST200 (old shape), Honda CRX (Mk2), Alfa GTV (V6), and many other things- all pretty much dismissed for either being not really interesting enough (first 2), as rust prone as my Starion (CRX), or no better on fuel (the Alfa).
But I am genuinely open to suggestions.
The Accord just seems to tick the most boxes, and I loved the engine in my DC2 (particularly the noise!) so much that another Type-R is massively appealing. I appreciate that I sound like I want to have my cake and eat it, but the DC2 fitted all of these criteria so I figured there must be others?
Apologies for the length of the post and I look forward to hearing peoples thoughts. This isn’t a speculative thing- I have the cash ready to go and will be straight out to view if the right car comes along, but having had no experience of the ATR I wanted to get a better idea of what to expect so I don’t waste a sellers time.
Likewise, if there are any ATR owners on here from around the Oxfordshire area who fancy showing off their pride & joy I would be a willing audience!
Thanks in advance
Cheers for the suggestions, a chap at work has the Celica 190- I've been in it several times and by all accounts they are very good cars but for me they are just lacking that something that the Type-R Hondas have.
If I'd never had a DC2 I would imagine I'd be more than happy with the Celica (the 190 at least), but having had an Integra it just doesn't really do anything for me.
The Primera GT is a very good shout (and if I were on a tighter cost/mpg budget would get serious consideration), but again I just don't think it would excite me enough.
Whilst fuel economy is the main motivation for swapping- 28-30mpg on a commute (as with the DC2) will be more than enough improvement for me. If I've missed something serious fun that will do more than that then great, but fun & exciting are still my main priorities!
I think that's why the ATR appeals so much.
If I'd never had a DC2 I would imagine I'd be more than happy with the Celica (the 190 at least), but having had an Integra it just doesn't really do anything for me.
The Primera GT is a very good shout (and if I were on a tighter cost/mpg budget would get serious consideration), but again I just don't think it would excite me enough.
Whilst fuel economy is the main motivation for swapping- 28-30mpg on a commute (as with the DC2) will be more than enough improvement for me. If I've missed something serious fun that will do more than that then great, but fun & exciting are still my main priorities!
I think that's why the ATR appeals so much.
I have been in same boat as you had a dc2 and loved it but it had to go due to expanding family. I now have a stunning red ATR and it does the job of family bus and play thing. Not too bad on fuel on long trips out. Did 200 mile to half a tank last week. But round town and play time can be thirsty. But that's half the fun.
Only down dude I have found is parts they don't go wrong often but are a mare to find and not cheap.
Take your time have a look round as good ones are hard to find. They are getting rare now.
Over all ticks all the boxes and is a joy to drive fast or slow.
Only down dude I have found is parts they don't go wrong often but are a mare to find and not cheap.
Take your time have a look round as good ones are hard to find. They are getting rare now.
Over all ticks all the boxes and is a joy to drive fast or slow.
shakindog said:
I have been in same boat as you had a dc2 and loved it but it had to go due to expanding family. I now have a stunning red ATR and it does the job of family bus and play thing. Not too bad on fuel on long trips out. Did 200 mile to half a tank last week. But round town and play time can be thirsty. But that's half the fun.
Only down dude I have found is parts they don't go wrong often but are a mare to find and not cheap.
Take your time have a look round as good ones are hard to find. They are getting rare now.
Over all ticks all the boxes and is a joy to drive fast or slow.
Thanks for the info Shakindog Only down dude I have found is parts they don't go wrong often but are a mare to find and not cheap.
Take your time have a look round as good ones are hard to find. They are getting rare now.
Over all ticks all the boxes and is a joy to drive fast or slow.
As someone who has owned both, how would you compare the cost of parts etc, and the fuel economy between the ITR & ATR?
And yes it actually seems more diffcult to track down a decent Accord than an Integra at the moment.
I didn't really have any problems with the dc2 it had brakes and tyres that's about it.
Only problems I've had with the ATR is front pipe and crank pulley which are a pita to get hold of till I found out about vtech direct in Cheshire.
Fuel wise ripping aboutnin the dc2 would do a tank in 200 miles.on a long run 350. The ATR about 300 ripping about but very good on long runs taking it steady.
Only problems I have found so far is back seats don't fold at all. It eats front tyres and keeping it on cam between 3rd and 4th is a dark art.
There are some good ones about its just finding one took a while to find a good one in red took me 3 months.
Only problems I've had with the ATR is front pipe and crank pulley which are a pita to get hold of till I found out about vtech direct in Cheshire.
Fuel wise ripping aboutnin the dc2 would do a tank in 200 miles.on a long run 350. The ATR about 300 ripping about but very good on long runs taking it steady.
Only problems I have found so far is back seats don't fold at all. It eats front tyres and keeping it on cam between 3rd and 4th is a dark art.
There are some good ones about its just finding one took a while to find a good one in red took me 3 months.
shakindog said:
I didn't really have any problems with the dc2 it had brakes and tyres that's about it.
Only problems I've had with the ATR is front pipe and crank pulley which are a pita to get hold of till I found out about vtech direct in Cheshire.
Fuel wise ripping aboutnin the dc2 would do a tank in 200 miles.on a long run 350. The ATR about 300 ripping about but very good on long runs taking it steady.
Only problems I have found so far is back seats don't fold at all. It eats front tyres and keeping it on cam between 3rd and 4th is a dark art.
There are some good ones about its just finding one took a while to find a good one in red took me 3 months.
Thanks for that, good to hear.Only problems I've had with the ATR is front pipe and crank pulley which are a pita to get hold of till I found out about vtech direct in Cheshire.
Fuel wise ripping aboutnin the dc2 would do a tank in 200 miles.on a long run 350. The ATR about 300 ripping about but very good on long runs taking it steady.
Only problems I have found so far is back seats don't fold at all. It eats front tyres and keeping it on cam between 3rd and 4th is a dark art.
There are some good ones about its just finding one took a while to find a good one in red took me 3 months.
I knew about the rear seats but I don't think that will be an issue for me, and I fully expect it to eat front tyres so hopefully won't be too much of a shock!
I'm also noticing what you mean about finding a good one- not helped that I really want one in black! I've just got sick of keeping red cars red after both my Starion & my E30...
I've spotted a couple in the last day or so that I've contacted the sellers about, neither are too close to me but I've kind of accepted thats how it's going to be. Could be an expensive trip to view with the Starion!
What is the general opinion of the gearbox synchro issues Shakindog?
Also, what do they sound like with standard induction/exhaust? The sound of a good Type-R is a big part of the appeal for me (my DC2 had a Mugen manifold, Kakimoto exhaust, & 5Zigen back box and sounded glorious!) so I wouldn't be against spending some of my £3K budget on a 'decent' cat-back exhaust system, if I can find one that comes suitably recommended.
Not had syncro issue with mine yet think it may have been done iirc.those out there should have all common faults manifest themselves and been repaired as the ATR getting a bit long know the tooth. Still fun I find.
I have a k¬ panel filter on mine with the airbox mod and induction roar is loud.saving up for a custom cat back stainless steel system so will choose how loud but I am thinking loud. They not cheap though if you want to keep it a twin exit system between 4 and 500 quid.
Just keep looking there some good ones left but finding one that's not been taxi'd to death is difficult.
As far as I know they made them in red black and silver. Black being the nicest looking after red.
It'll be worth the travelling is you find one already done your laughing
I have a k¬ panel filter on mine with the airbox mod and induction roar is loud.saving up for a custom cat back stainless steel system so will choose how loud but I am thinking loud. They not cheap though if you want to keep it a twin exit system between 4 and 500 quid.
Just keep looking there some good ones left but finding one that's not been taxi'd to death is difficult.
As far as I know they made them in red black and silver. Black being the nicest looking after red.
It'll be worth the travelling is you find one already done your laughing
shakindog said:
Not had syncro issue with mine yet think it may have been done iirc.those out there should have all common faults manifest themselves and been repaired as the ATR getting a bit long know the tooth. Still fun I find.
I have a k¬ panel filter on mine with the airbox mod and induction roar is loud.saving up for a custom cat back stainless steel system so will choose how loud but I am thinking loud. They not cheap though if you want to keep it a twin exit system between 4 and 500 quid.
Just keep looking there some good ones left but finding one that's not been taxi'd to death is difficult.
As far as I know they made them in red black and silver. Black being the nicest looking after red.
It'll be worth the travelling is you find one already done your laughing
Im off to look at a Black one tomorrow, completely stadard and appears mechanically sound with a load of stuff recently done (including belts & stuff), just a few cosmetic blemishes which is something I can look into sorting later on.I have a k¬ panel filter on mine with the airbox mod and induction roar is loud.saving up for a custom cat back stainless steel system so will choose how loud but I am thinking loud. They not cheap though if you want to keep it a twin exit system between 4 and 500 quid.
Just keep looking there some good ones left but finding one that's not been taxi'd to death is difficult.
As far as I know they made them in red black and silver. Black being the nicest looking after red.
It'll be worth the travelling is you find one already done your laughing
Regarding the exhaust etc, I've looked at a few systems but I will likely take it to the Type-R specialist that looked after my DC2 and see what they recommend- just love the sound of a well sorted Type R!
Thanks again for the info, I'll keep this thread updated with how I get on.
Wadeski said:
Prelude Motegi?
Nissan 200SX?
156 Twinspark?
The 200SX I'd discounted as the one I like (S13) is just too similar to the Starion (RWD/Turbo), and I prefer the rarity of the Starion.Nissan 200SX?
156 Twinspark?
The Alfa 156 I am a big fan of (a friend has the sport wagon with the twin spark engine), but a big part of the appeal to me is the Alfa V6 engine- which of course would be rather heavy on fuel.
The Prelude Motegi is a bloody excellent suggestion!
I remember looking at these years ago and they had since completely slipped my mind.
Hi
I ran an Accord Type-R on a 51 plate, from new, for 3 years and 75,000 miles
Loved it, great chasis, bulletproof engine.
I never had any gearbox issues, although I am mechanically sympathetic (I also ran a TVR at the same time)
The only thing that annoyed me was the off-cam performance, you get 60% power or 100% power but nothing in between really. But if you are used to the ITR then you shouldnt be worried about this. The 2.2 unit is great and i much prefered it to the CTR that was made to a price.
Mine didnt eat tyres too badly, i was always in the red zone, but the tyres appeared to do about 12-15k.
I think you will enjoy it for a while, 12 months later youll start thinking about selling it.
I also found that "at the time" in 2001 the Scooby 215hp model had been released for just 17995 and i always struggled as they caught me out of the zone, and shot off when i had to change down.
On the other hand I had a great race against a 225Hp Audi TT and kicked his butt over a long drive.
Anyway, have some fun with it
I ran an Accord Type-R on a 51 plate, from new, for 3 years and 75,000 miles
Loved it, great chasis, bulletproof engine.
I never had any gearbox issues, although I am mechanically sympathetic (I also ran a TVR at the same time)
The only thing that annoyed me was the off-cam performance, you get 60% power or 100% power but nothing in between really. But if you are used to the ITR then you shouldnt be worried about this. The 2.2 unit is great and i much prefered it to the CTR that was made to a price.
Mine didnt eat tyres too badly, i was always in the red zone, but the tyres appeared to do about 12-15k.
I think you will enjoy it for a while, 12 months later youll start thinking about selling it.
I also found that "at the time" in 2001 the Scooby 215hp model had been released for just 17995 and i always struggled as they caught me out of the zone, and shot off when i had to change down.
On the other hand I had a great race against a 225Hp Audi TT and kicked his butt over a long drive.
Anyway, have some fun with it
LancerG said:
Hi
I ran an Accord Type-R on a 51 plate, from new, for 3 years and 75,000 miles
Loved it, great chasis, bulletproof engine.
I never had any gearbox issues, although I am mechanically sympathetic (I also ran a TVR at the same time)
The only thing that annoyed me was the off-cam performance, you get 60% power or 100% power but nothing in between really. But if you are used to the ITR then you shouldnt be worried about this. The 2.2 unit is great and i much prefered it to the CTR that was made to a price.
Mine didnt eat tyres too badly, i was always in the red zone, but the tyres appeared to do about 12-15k.
I think you will enjoy it for a while, 12 months later youll start thinking about selling it.
I also found that "at the time" in 2001 the Scooby 215hp model had been released for just 17995 and i always struggled as they caught me out of the zone, and shot off when i had to change down.
On the other hand I had a great race against a 225Hp Audi TT and kicked his butt over a long drive.
Anyway, have some fun with it
Cheers for the info!I ran an Accord Type-R on a 51 plate, from new, for 3 years and 75,000 miles
Loved it, great chasis, bulletproof engine.
I never had any gearbox issues, although I am mechanically sympathetic (I also ran a TVR at the same time)
The only thing that annoyed me was the off-cam performance, you get 60% power or 100% power but nothing in between really. But if you are used to the ITR then you shouldnt be worried about this. The 2.2 unit is great and i much prefered it to the CTR that was made to a price.
Mine didnt eat tyres too badly, i was always in the red zone, but the tyres appeared to do about 12-15k.
I think you will enjoy it for a while, 12 months later youll start thinking about selling it.
I also found that "at the time" in 2001 the Scooby 215hp model had been released for just 17995 and i always struggled as they caught me out of the zone, and shot off when i had to change down.
On the other hand I had a great race against a 225Hp Audi TT and kicked his butt over a long drive.
Anyway, have some fun with it
Well after 11 hours & approx 500 miles round trip I am back home with a stunning Pirates black ATR
First impressions are that it does just feel like a slightly bigger DC2- just with more comforts! This one has a Mongoose cat-back exhaust and it sounds like nothing I've ever heard- I thought my DC2 with Mugen/5Zigen exhaust was as good a sound as I had heard but this is honestly even better, and not just on V-tec either. Hit 3,000 rpm and the sound really is something else!
The car is immaculate and a credit to it's former owner, the interior is so much more pleasent than the Integra's, whilst still having the amazing seats, steering wheel, and gear change. It's suprisingly low seated as well, which I wasn't expecting from a saloon car, but it's all the better for it.
The seller was a top chap (and serial ATR / jap car owner) and despite the distance I had to go I honestly wish all car purchase/sales could be that straight-forward.
I'll get some pics up tomorrow hopefully- but I'm off out for another drive now!
Squirrelofwoe said:
Cheers for the info!
Well after 11 hours & approx 500 miles round trip I am back home with a stunning Pirates black ATR
First impressions are that it does just feel like a slightly bigger DC2- just with more comforts! This one has a Mongoose cat-back exhaust and it sounds like nothing I've ever heard- I thought my DC2 with Mugen/5Zigen exhaust was as good a sound as I had heard but this is honestly even better, and not just on V-tec either. Hit 3,000 rpm and the sound really is something else!
The car is immaculate and a credit to it's former owner, the interior is so much more pleasent than the Integra's, whilst still having the amazing seats, steering wheel, and gear change. It's suprisingly low seated as well, which I wasn't expecting from a saloon car, but it's all the better for it.
The seller was a top chap (and serial ATR / jap car owner) and despite the distance I had to go I honestly wish all car purchase/sales could be that straight-forward.
I'll get some pics up tomorrow hopefully- but I'm off out for another drive now!
Congrats mate, sounds lovely. I can imagine a decent exhaust would make a big difference to the sound too, less restrictive.Well after 11 hours & approx 500 miles round trip I am back home with a stunning Pirates black ATR
First impressions are that it does just feel like a slightly bigger DC2- just with more comforts! This one has a Mongoose cat-back exhaust and it sounds like nothing I've ever heard- I thought my DC2 with Mugen/5Zigen exhaust was as good a sound as I had heard but this is honestly even better, and not just on V-tec either. Hit 3,000 rpm and the sound really is something else!
The car is immaculate and a credit to it's former owner, the interior is so much more pleasent than the Integra's, whilst still having the amazing seats, steering wheel, and gear change. It's suprisingly low seated as well, which I wasn't expecting from a saloon car, but it's all the better for it.
The seller was a top chap (and serial ATR / jap car owner) and despite the distance I had to go I honestly wish all car purchase/sales could be that straight-forward.
I'll get some pics up tomorrow hopefully- but I'm off out for another drive now!
BTW they can be remapped, mainly to take out flat spots but also to move the on-cam changeover point, however this mainly just makes more noise lower down, rather than much more power. Worth thinking about with that exhaust tho, just change the intake at the same time.
I read somewhere that a Hondata ECU can make a huge difference to the H22A block, making it much smoother in the process.
I would have gone for one a few years ago but couldn't justify the price as I got my primers really cheap. It's still on the'to own' list though.
Get some pics up OP.
I would have gone for one a few years ago but couldn't justify the price as I got my primers really cheap. It's still on the'to own' list though.
Get some pics up OP.
LancerG said:
Congrats mate, sounds lovely. I can imagine a decent exhaust would make a big difference to the sound too, less restrictive.
BTW they can be remapped, mainly to take out flat spots but also to move the on-cam changeover point, however this mainly just makes more noise lower down, rather than much more power. Worth thinking about with that exhaust tho, just change the intake at the same time.
This has a K&N Typhoon fitted (which I imagine helps the sound somewhat!) but I'm not sure I'm too fussed about getting the change-over point moved (for now anyway) as this is till going to be my daily driver and at the minute it feels pretty much spot on.BTW they can be remapped, mainly to take out flat spots but also to move the on-cam changeover point, however this mainly just makes more noise lower down, rather than much more power. Worth thinking about with that exhaust tho, just change the intake at the same time.
The sound even at 3,000rpm is such that I can see other road users giving me disapproving looks, and makes me grin like a kid all over again!
On cam it sounds like the end of the bloody world!
But I love the fact it's such a nicer place to sit than the Integra (mine has air-con, the optional arm-rest and 6-cd changer too) and when grinding out city-centre traffic and at lowish revs the engine is quieter than anything else I've owned.I'm off on Mothers Day duties shortly but will get some pics up later- it hasn't stopped raining since I bought the car though so the pics I have arn't the best. Then when it gets another good clean next weekend so I'll take some better ones taken!
Gassing Station | Japanese Chat | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff