New Home Cinema - Ideas? Budget £5k

[dkatwa]

Hi. I have a room, 12 feet square. I am looking to put a home cinema in.
Must have is a plasma/ LED 3D of 65 or 70 inches (not projector as want to view normal TV too)
Need decent speakers
Blu Ray player

I have a Denon AVR4306 Amp but would like to get a newer Amp that has additional functionality, such as 3D upscaling (if there is such a thing)


Any ideas?

[PhilboSE]

dkatwa said:

Hi. I have a room, 12 feet square. I am looking to put a home cinema in.
Must have is a plasma/ LED 3D of 65 or 70 inches (not projector as want to view normal TV too)
Need decent speakers
Blu Ray player

I have a Denon AVR4306 Amp but would like to get a newer Amp that has additional functionality, such as 3D upscaling (if there is such a thing)

Any ideas?

First choose your TV because that will be the most expensive thing and will let you know how much budget you have left.

Personally I rate the Panasonic P65VT50, these seem to be available at around £2800. But you'll need to view some and make up your own mind about what you like the look of.

I don't think spending huge money on a Blu-ray player is justified, I would go with a Panasonic or Sony at around the £150-£200 mark. You get nice integration with the TV if you stay with the same manufacturer.

With the left over money I'd split it roughly 50:50 between the receiver and the speakers. For the receiver, something like an Onkyo, Pioneer or Yamaha. The Yamaha RX-V673 at £500 has had some very good reviews, the excellent Pioneer VSX-LX55 is right on the money at £1000. Listen to a few to see if you have a preference.

Speakers are more personal in terms of style and size and sound, but the B&W MT-50 get good reviews, or there's always a decent Kef bundle at the same price.

In terms of upscaling, these days you have multiple devices that can all upscale the video source:
- Blu-ray player (when playing DVDs)
- AV receiver
- TV

Some years ago the receivers had the best upscaling capability (if you paid for it), but now the TV (especially the VT50 series) and even the Blu-ray players can do excellent quality upscaling to 1080p from any source. If the TV has a good reputation (e.g. the VT50) then I would let that do all the upscaling. Receiver manufacturers seem to agree as they are making much less of a play about their upscaling capabilities these days.

I don't think upscaling is treated any differently for 3D work, but again I'd be inclined to let the TV do that. The Blu-ray will output 3D discs in 1080p anyway, so you're only talking about 3D content from Sky. I'd have the receiver set to pass through direct to the TV for that source.

[dkatwa]

Thanks PhilboSE. Much appreciate your detailed email.
My shortlist is as follows:
TV Sharp Aquos LC-70LE741E LED HD 1080p 3D Smart TV £2,499
Speakers KEF KHT 3005 SE w £800
NAS
Amp Denon AVR 3313 £619
Blu Ray Sony BDP-S790 £200
TV Stand £350
Cables £250
Fitting £500


Total £5,218

Thing is, I read that specialist music shops know which combination of TV/AMP/ Speakers etc is good and work well. I am not an audiophile and have no clue. However, given the budget, I think it would be good to get a system that gels and produces optimum performance for the price.
The only place I know that has the Sharp on display is John Lewis, Oxford Street. I could wander over there this weekend. I am undecided between Sharp (not seen any), Samsung (appears a bit too bright) and Panasonic (looks lovely. In fact, my current Plasma is a Panasonic).
Agree with you that the TV will decide the remaining budget and like your choice of Panasonic.
Also, what NAS would you recommend? And do I need a media server??

[PhilboSE]

The TV is all about the picture, so chose one you like the look of.

Matching amp to the speakers is far less important than in the hi-fi world. Sure different amps make different sounds as do speakers, again you just have to give them a try. Or not. I think that you could buy a good amp "on spec" and the same for the speakers, and get a good result. Most shops are now box-shifters and will sometimes sell you what they make the most margin on, rather than what is really best, so I wouldn't take what they say as gospel. If you buy a TV, amp and speakers based on what gets good reviews you will really struggle to go badly wrong.

Your NAS box will be the media server, if you get one. Just check it's DLNA and UPnP certified.

[OldSkoolRS]

I really wouldn't buy speakers based on a review: For example M&K speakers seem highly thought of on many forums and reviews, yet I find them very shrill (even though I do have a set in my conservatory, they aren't so bad at lower levels, but I wouldn't want them for my main system). Make sure you get some demos of speakers, ideally bring the shop's demo set home against a credit card deposit. I've done this myself a few times since it's easy to be impressed in a shop when they crank up the volume if you don't listen that loud at home, plus the room can make a big difference to the sound anyway.

You could probably buy your amp based on recommendation/reviews since there probably isn't much difference in sound terms at this price range, more a question of looking at which features you require. Unless you're really considering adding extra front height and/or wide speakers and two subwoofers then don't get taken in by 9.2 badges.

Just a final comment: IMHO it isn't a Home Cinema without a projector, just a big telly.

[dkatwa]

Interesting comments...thanks....
I like the sound of taking the speakers home and trying them at home. Thing is, do I take 1/2/3 sets home and try them? or just the ones that are shortlisted in the shop?
As for NAS - yes, will make enquiries and potentially include that in my list.
I do have a bigger lounge (5m squared) but it is a bit too big for a cosy 'home cinema' set up. A project/ screen would look good in it though!

[pb1695]

In my room, which is similar in size, I have just bought a Yamaha RX 673 and a B&W MT50 package. I tried the Yamaha with Kef and Monitor Audio Mass speakers but the B&W's blew them away IMO of course.

The system is partnered with a Sony 55KDLHX723, which although is very good, I wish i had chosen the Panasonic in hindsight as the Sony keeps developing problems with the backlighting resulting in grey lines across the screen.

I use a PS3 for blu ray, I like the versatility of gaming, blue ray etc. and have an Apple TV for movies along with Sky+

Other than the TV, I am really happy with the sound and other equipment.

[dkatwa]

thanks PB1695. The MT50s have been recommended too, so will give them a try. As for TV, I would like the biggest screen I can get. Likely 65 or 70 inchs. Your choice of Amp is good too - I may go with Denon as I already have one but will see what the shops recommends. the Sony S790 blu ray sounds like a bargain at £200
any ideas on speaker cables? average £/ ft for a decent one???

[OldSkoolRS]

I just took the speakers home that I'd shortlisted. I did it a few times as initially I was trying to replace floorstanders with something more compact and discrete, but most of the 'lifestyle' options (some 4-5 years ago now) just didn't fill my room as well. The shop was fine since I'd bought other equipment over the years they knew I wasn't just a 'tyre kicker'. Eventually I found something (more expensive than I'd first planned of course) that I was happy with and still have now.

A few years later they actually came to my house with a selection of projectors to do a home demo, so that I could see which was best (and even if it was worth upgrading, so they knew they weren't guaranteed a sale).

This is why I only tend to buy less critical items 'blind' and online. The savings soon get forgotten about if the system is crap once set up, plus the dealers I use have been good at 'looking after me' anyway: I bought a JVC X35 projector before Christmas as a package with some other calibration equipment and got a cracking deal. The dealer brought various projectors to one guy's house so there were three of us there for the demo and we all bought (different) projectors so it was worth the dealer's time too.

[dkatwa]

Thanks OldSkoolRS. I must admit,I do the usual thing..check out at stores and buy cheapest online....no wonder Comet etc went broke..shame...
this time,it will be different..I will go to a specialist and get them to demo to me...with the promise of buying from them if I a suitably impressed....

[Crackie]

dkatwa said:

any ideas on speaker cables? average £/ ft for a decent one???

Something like this is fine imho http://www.amazon.co.uk/s/ref=nb_sb_ss_i_0_13?url=... so £0.80 pence per meter. 2.5mm/14AWG cross section.

[dkatwa]

Thanks Crackie


Out of interest,I heard that it is better to have two subs to balance out the sound. Any views from anyone?

My current Denon can cope with two and I will ensure the new one can too.....

[Blue62]

dkatwa said:

Thanks Crackie


Out of interest,I heard that it is better to have two subs to balance out the sound. Any views from anyone?

My current Denon can cope with two and I will ensure the new one can too.....

I think 2 subs would be overkill, especially in a room with those dimensions. Incidentally, you can watch normal telly through a projector, you just need a freesat (or freeview) box, but you'd be pushing your budget a little once you've bought a screen and paid install costs. I have a cinema set up and went Denon amp and Blu Ray, I personally think it's worth spending on a decent BR, especially if you want 3D. From memory they cost around £2k combined.

[OldSkoolRS]

It depends entirely on the room response and seating position, but there are occasions where two subs give a smoother response due to peaks and nulls. However, it is a lot of effort to set two subs up since just plonking two in a room isn't a guarantee to sound better without the work. I've got a problem where my single sub is the perfect distance from me that I suffer a 35Hz null (measured). I'm buying a new sub and even the 18" 3000 watt option still won't get rid of this null, so I may have to buy a second (possibly smaller) sub to position where it can 'fill' in this null at my seat for a more even response.

Of course buying two subs might mean getting smaller and cheaper ones rather than a single good one, so that's another variable. Upto a certain point probably better to buy one good sub especially if you are reasonably free as to where you can place it since location, location, location also applies to subs.

[marctwo]

dkatwa said:

any ideas on speaker cables? average £/ ft for a decent one???

I've seen this recommended over at AV forums many times and I use it myself:

http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/CASPEAK79.htm...

[dkatwa]

Thanks for the comments. I will check out a setup at the local specialist
Comprises Denon 3313 Amp, blu ray (likely Denon), KEF 205T and Panasonic/ Samsung TVs.

Will likely decide this weekend. to be honest, I am sure it is swings and roundabouts as regards the kit but I will go with whatever sounds good in the shop

[OldSkoolRS]

Best of luck, be interested to hear how you get on.

TIP: Don't listen to stuff that's above your budget. I went to a shop recently to help set up a projector and afterwards he put a film clip on and the speakers sounded fantastic. Shame the centre speaker alone was over £2k. Same make as I have now, but much further up the ladder.

[dkatwa]

thanks OldSkoolRS.....
i could go a bit over budget, as long as the sound hits the spot, so to speak....

[Number86]

Hang on.

You want a 65" TV in room that is 12 square feet?

As far as the other stuff. Any amp that does the stuff you want, and is powerful enough will be fine. Speakers are your own preference. I bought I set of Mordaunt Shorts, which IMO, where vastly superior to a similar priced pair of KEF's.

[dkatwa]

Number86...well spotted....!

12 feet by 12 feet....there, now I can get a big TV!

Not considered your speakers yet..will have a delve....any speaker that has an exotic name must be good no?