CTR EP3 to Mk4 Golf R32

[burger81]

So has anyone made this move?

Its something I am seriously considering as my CTR is getting a bit long in the tooth and I fancy something with a bit more power, a few more toys that I can still use day to day.

So has anyone any experience of a mk4 R32? Running costs, tax, tyres? Is the haldex tempermental or is it relatively reasonable to maintain and look after?

Any thoughts would be interesting....

[martin mrt]

Mk4 R32 will feel like a tank compared to an EP3 CTR, i remember jumping from my R32 into my mates CTR years ago and they were worlds apart in terms of refinement

R32s like a drink, low 20s in town high 20s-low 30s on a run, tax will be the same as the civic, servicing costs are very modest to be honest

Haldex can be temperamental, the service intervals is 20k and 40k for filters IIRC but i am not 100% sure. Controllers can suffer water ingress, as can the looms, this is bad news as its not a cheap repair, best to take vag com with you when viewing a car to check if you can access the haldex system via OBD port

Front discs are expensive from the dealer .

Standard front shocks wear at an alarming rate and knock when worn, my car had 3 sets in under 30k through warranty, timing chains can stretch and can be checked on vag com again, this is one to watch out for as my old one snapped the chains at less than 60k with FVWSH, VERY expensive to rectify so be careful

Cooling fans pulsing when aircon is on "auto" means the control module has packed up, £400 for new fans or £50 with a DIY resistor set up, theres a guide online

Springs snap at the pigtails on the rear

1st and 2nd gear selector fork on the O2M box can fail at any time, get all gears except 1st 2nd, box out job to repair. Never drive it if this happens, or it will kill the rest of the box

Coil recall at VW check i this has been done and book it in for free replacements if not

Other than that its pretty much regular mk4 issues to look out for

[burger81]

Blimey you make it sound like it has quite a few niggly problems to watch out for!!

I suppose it will be at least a 9 year old car (last ones 54 plate??) so there are issues that you need to know about.

Would you recommend to stay away from high milers? Or is that not an issue like most cars if its looked after well?

[wheedler]

And i thought I was the only on here who has no praise for the r32,guess someone will come here in a minute and say something about the "exhaust note"

[TommyBuoy]

http://www.pistonheads.com/doc.asp?c=52&i=2657...

Pretty much sums it up for me.

Driven both and prefer the Civic (Although I have an S2000 so that might be a little bias)

It is a little more comfortable though and seems a little more refined, but then if that's what you want there are far better cars out there.

P.S Exhaust note is different, but I wouldn't say any better

ETA: To be a little more fair, it's got a torque punchy engine (but then is should have with the displacement / stroke etc) and the 4WD is a benefit to some. I also think it has a slightly better 'image' than the Civic but that's my opinion.

Edited by TommyBuoy on Wednesday 27th March 11:38

[burger81]

The reason i look at the R32 is the prices are not bad to get into a nice Mk4, which will have a few more toys, still be a bit pokey and will have a great noise.

Downsides are running costs, insurance goes up.

I just feel like a change from the civic, but there isn't much choice out there around the 6-8k range. Old S3's are interesting but they come with very high mileage now.

Hmm.....

[aka_kerrly]

burger81 said:

Blimey you make it sound like it has quite a few niggly problems to watch out for!!

I suppose it will be at least a 9 year old car (last ones 54 plate??) so there are issues that you need to know about.

Would you recommend to stay away from high milers? Or is that not an issue like most cars if its looked after well?

I think Martin is just being realistic with his worst case scenario information.

Like your existing Civic the R32 is a performance orientated vehicle so brakes, suspension do take a beating and are higher quality so do cost a bit more than standard off the shelf items.

Here is a useful guide for you - http://www.r32oc.com/topic/573-r32-mk4-buyers-guid...

main thing you will find is:

Civic - 197hp @ 7400rpm and 145lb-ft torque @5900rpm
Golf - 241BHP @ 6250RPM and 236lb-ft torque @2800RPM

So the driving characteristics may look different on paper but the VR6 is surprisingly Vtec like in that it loves a good rev and combined with a 6speed box and 4wd they are a lot quicker point to point than people realise.

[TommyBuoy]

Is it a hatch that you need / want?

In my opinion, for the money, the EP3 would be the hatch I'd go with.

The only other car I'd be looking at is a Leon - 6 - 8K will get a very good 'older' shape, or a slightly leggy 'newer'.

[TommyBuoy]

aka_kerrly said:

burger81 said:

Blimey you make it sound like it has quite a few niggly problems to watch out for!!

I suppose it will be at least a 9 year old car (last ones 54 plate??) so there are issues that you need to know about.

Would you recommend to stay away from high milers? Or is that not an issue like most cars if its looked after well?

I think Martin is just being realistic with his worst case scenario information.

Like your existing Civic the R32 is a performance orientated vehicle so brakes, suspension do take a beating and are higher quality so do cost a bit more than standard off the shelf items.

Here is a useful guide for you - http://www.r32oc.com/topic/573-r32-mk4-buyers-guid...

main thing you will find is:

Civic - 197hp @ 7400rpm and 145lb-ft torque @5900rpm
Golf - 241BHP @ 6250RPM and 236lb-ft torque @2800RPM

So the driving characteristics may look different on paper but the VR6 is surprisingly Vtec like in that it loves a good rev and combined with a 6speed box and 4wd they are a lot quicker point to point than people realise.

Just to add, the Gold has 241PS, which is around 237BHP. If you like 0-60 times, the golf is arounf .2 secs quicker. It's a nice looking car, but it's not as involving.

[aka_kerrly]

TommyBuoy said:

Is it a hatch that you need / want?

In my opinion, for the money, the EP3 would be the hatch I'd go with.

The only other car I'd be looking at is a Leon - 6 - 8K will get a very good 'older' shape, or a slightly leggy 'newer'.

But he already has a EP3 which is "long in the tooth" as he describes.

I see your point regarding the Leon Cupra R as they are stonking good value and proven to be only marginally slower than the Audi S3 which it shares a lot of parts with but lacks the 4wd.

I'd also consider a Focus ST and Megane R225 Sport if you want a hatch but there are also so many other coupes/estates/salons that fall into your budget

[TommyBuoy]

^ I suppose this comes down to what the OP actually needs a car to do and whether N/A or FI is a consideration.

Forgot all about the ST for some reason, I suppose the VXR is another hot hatch too.

[aka_kerrly]

TommyBuoy said:

^ I suppose this comes down to what the OP actually needs a car to do and whether N/A or FI is a consideration.

Forgot all about the ST for some reason, I suppose the VXR is another hot hatch too.

Agree, if the OP can consider coupes and salons/estates then a whole host of cars like monaros, s4, etc

[rallycross]

Mk5 Gti a nicer place to be at that price than the old mk4 R32 and you have plenty of tuning scope with the 2.0T.

[burger81]

As asked its defintely a hatch i am sticking after, 3 doors too.

I originally wanted a Focus RS MKII but in reality that was a pipe dream as they are still way out of my price budget and would take an age to save up for, and considering my CTR is on 145k miles i can't wait that long!

And that rules out the ST for me because i would always be thinking wish it was an RS.

The R32 also appeals as i don't think it really needs modding to make it look nicer or go faster, as it suits my needs as it is.

[TommyBuoy]

Sounds like you've made your mind up on an R32!

I agree with you - no need to mod them in any way - they look good as they are.

As above, MK5 GTI is a good shout as well.

Have you driven an R32 - if you like it, get one - no point in spending cash on a car to then regret it everytime you see the one you wanted!

Good Luck.

[burger81]

I have just done a bit more looking into the fuel costs, and i was obviously not expecting them to be great, but i was surprised at how bad they are and how much it costs to fill a tank (£70-75). I thought it would be a lot closer in comparison to my CTR.
I know thats not why you buy an R32 for - to worry about fuel costs, but i was still a little surprised.

Just shows how good an all rounder the CTR is really. Maybe re-think time again!!!

Why is trying to pick a car that fits all needs so hard?

And i fear going for a test drive will just sucker me in with the noise....

[Krikkit]

Can you really not get past a Focus ST having a bigger brother? Fantastic cars that make such a lovely noise.

Probably not much better than the R32 on fuel though.

[rb5er]

Go for some test drives.

Focus ST would be my hot hatch choice in that price range.

[Baryonyx]

burger81 said:

So has anyone made this move?

Its something I am seriously considering as my CTR is getting a bit long in the tooth and I fancy something with a bit more power, a few more toys that I can still use day to day.

The Golf will feel like a battleship after driving the EP3. Even in a straight line, I would be surprised if it as quicker in a straight line. On any twisty section it wouldn't see which way the Civic went. Less fun to drive too. They are a nice place to sit, and an 'interesting' if flawed GT cruiser. But I don't think they are even in the same league as the EP3.

[BUG4LIFE]

Has the Mk1 FRS been mentioned?...or an DC5 Integra?