Exciting 2+2, £20k budget; Cerbera/996/Camaro/what car?

[aww999]

Hi everyone,

After years of enjoying cars on a fairly tight budget whilst studying, I am now able to consider spending a much larger sum on something really special. Mainly using it for fun, with occasional short commuting on a sunny day, so MPG not a major concern. I have nevr been in a position to consider a "nearly-new" car before (all mine have been at least 15 years old!) so I am concerned about how much I might lose on depreciation on some of my options. Hopefully I can get some advice, comments and suggestions? My requirements are:

4 seater or 2+2 but the back seats will only be for under-fives
Manual gearbox, might consider an automated manual but definitely no autos
Fast! (To me this means 0-60 in 5s or so)
Exciting, both to look at and to drive. I have other sensible cars, including a V8 barge, so no Audi/BMW/Merc

I've come up with the following ideas:

TVR Cerbera: I should be able to get a really nice V8 for this money, I think the performance of the 4.2 would be fine but wonder if the 4.5 might hold value better? Low depreciation, high maintenance demands - I am a pretty decent mechanic but don't wish to be under the bonnet every weekend when I could be out for a drive.

Porsche 996C2: Again, plenty of choice at this budget. I am not sure if it would feel particularly quick though, and might be too civilised to feel "special".

Porsche 996TT: Huge performance, and 4WD would mean I could use more of it more often given the constraints of our climate - meant to feel a bit dull to drive though? Not sure on running costs either, most within budget seem to be high milers.

Chevrolet Camaro RS: I have always loved american V8 cars, with a particular soft spot for Camaros. The 68/69 models are in my top ten cars ever, but I just don't have the spare time to look after a classic car and have any time left to drive it! There is a beautiful 2010 model in the classifieds, with a 6.2 V8. Pros: Sound *awesome*, reliable, simple to maintain. Cons: LHD is a problem given how much overtaking I like to do, concerned about large depreciation given the age of the car (eg it still has a long way to fall!) and it weighs as much as my LS400 so may not feel particularly sporty.

Ford Mustang: Again, I love the old ones but I am looking at newer ones. Lots of choice of spec available, I had a GT350 as a rental a few years back, and thought back then it would have been great with a manual box and ~450bhp. Same pros/cons as the Camaro really.

I think the Camaro is the sensible choice here, but I can't get the Cerbera out of my head. I like raw, basic, noisy cars, but I don't want to buy into a PITA moneypit. Help!

[RobM77]

It sounds like we have very similar taste in cars. Sadly most people don't want the sort of thing we like, so there's almost no choice at any budget. I've ended up with two cars to satisfy my requirements, and it's a solution I'm very happy with indeed; I've done this for 11 years now with a budget starting at around £20k (an old 325i and a Caterham), rising to my present £40k budget (a 320d and a 2-11) so this may be something you'd like to consider. My reasons are that I'm lucky or unlucky (however you look at it), to have driven quite a big variety of cars (road and race), and the result is that the difference between, for example, a 330ci and a 320i is very small for me now and almost insignificant. Therefore I tend to look at the layout, weight and type of car rather than the performance, so concentrating on driving enjoyment and handling rather than speed, which I'm somewhat numbed off to.

Here's an outside choice, a Maserati Gransport:

http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/m...

Do bear in mind that lifting kids into the back of a car like a Cerbera etc can be tricky. I don't have kids, but I do play a couple of fairly large musical instruments and am keen on cycling and kayaking, so this has moved me further towards the 2 car choice, so I have something four door for practical stuff and then something interesting for times when I'm driving on my own or down twisty roads.

If I had a total budget of £20k, then personally I would look for an Elise S2 111S, one of the very best road cars I've ever driven, or perhaps an early 111R, both eminently useable everyday, and then something four door for the rest of the time, such as a BMW 3 series or a Mercedes C class.

Edited by RobM77 on Tuesday 2nd April 12:10

[Yiliterate]

That sort of budget could get you in to a decent Maserati 4200, with a nice little war chest for 'unforeseen eventualities':

http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/m...

Also worth considering a Monaro if you don't want to go down the BMW/Merc/Audi route (and again with a few quid in your back pocket):

http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/v...

[Ecosseven]

A few suggestions.

Porsche 928 GTS
Vauxhall Monaro
Jaguar XKR with manual conversion
Imported Hyundai Genesis Coupe V6 (the new RWD model)

[aww999]

Thanks guys. Rob: I have run two cars for a long while, but since having a kid I just never get chance to use the two-seater. I loved my Fury but it just sat in the garage for months at a time, so I need something that we can all go for a jaunt in.

I always thought the Maserati was an odd combination of hefty GT car with screaming V8, and apart from the very newest ones the styling does nothing for me - aka a waste of a Ferrari engine! So, thanks, but no thanks

[Fantuzzi]

Another vote for the Gransport. EVO rated it very highly, couldn't fault it.

Just out of interest why have you thought of going down a different route? getting A shed for the kids and toy for fun, just as you said it would mainly be for fun.

Exige perhaps?

[Yiliterate]

aww999 said:

I always thought the Maserati was an odd combination of hefty GT car with screaming V8, and apart from the very newest ones the styling does nothing for me - aka a waste of a Ferrari engine! So, thanks, but no thanks

On the flip side, try finding that Ferrari engine in a Ferrari body for less than £15k!

[RobM77]

aww999 said:

Thanks guys. Rob: I have run two cars for a long while, but since having a kid I just never get chance to use the two-seater. I loved my Fury but it just sat in the garage for months at a time, so I need something that we can all go for a jaunt in.

I always thought the Maserati was an odd combination of hefty GT car with screaming V8, and apart from the very newest ones the styling does nothing for me - aka a waste of a Ferrari engine! So, thanks, but no thanks

Point taken. You could try changing the weekend car for something more practical than the Fury? You still can't take the kids though, so I can see your point there.

If it was just one car for me then I'd be be forced into looking at a 911 I think, although you're quite right, they are rather refined and numbed off from the experience of driving. The safety of a Cerbera would worry me with kids in the back, having seen a crashed one a few years ago. Good thread though - I'll be keeping an eye on it as it's a tough question and one I've often asked myself.

Another outside choice might be a Mercedes CLK AMG Mind you, at your price point it'd be hard to argue against a BMW E90 M3 of a similar age with above average miles.

Edited by RobM77 on Tuesday 2nd April 12:26

[Type R Tom]

BMW M6?

[aww999]

I replaced the Fury with an old MR2, which at least has doors and a windscreen! It's done twenty miles since its MOT in September and will be going in the classifieds once I fix a brake wobble . . .

I will probably keep my LS400 if I go for something wild like a Cerbera, and we also have a Focus for *really* boring stuff So I guess I am looking for "hardcore car with extra seats" rather than "daily driver with some extra oomph".

[aww999]

BMW do make some excellent 4-seat sports cars, but I worry that all the technology on board makes them an expensive proposition over the long term. Plus the woeful fuel economy of the latest M5/M6 is bad enough for me to curtail its use, which rather defeats the object.

[Fantuzzi]

aww999 said:

I always thought the Maserati was an odd combination of hefty GT car with screaming V8, and apart from the very newest ones the styling does nothing for me - aka a waste of a Ferrari engine! So, thanks, but no thanks

Not really a screamer, made in same factory with Ferrari but very different 'style' engines, Ferraris are of course Flat cranks where as the Maseratis are cross plane.

[LuS1fer]

In terms of running costs, the Americans can both be run on pocket money and as the Camaro has over 400hp, overtaking should never really be an issue. For Mustangs, you'd need to find an aftermarket supercharged 4.6 or a stock 5.0.

American cars actually depreciate very slowly indeed after their initial drop. A 2005 Mustang in good condition with low miles is still worth £14-15k.

TVRs would scare me after watching Wheeler Dealers.

[BRMMA]

I had a similar dilemma and went with the Gransport, absolutely love it and all being well will keep it for quite a few years

[Yiliterate]

aww999 said:

So I guess I am looking for "hardcore car with extra seats" rather than "daily driver with some extra oomph".

Kinda points in the direction of a rally rep...

http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/m...

[billzeebub]

996 C2S/C4S

[RobM77]

BRMMA said:

I had a similar dilemma and went with the Gransport, absolutely love it and all being well will keep it for quite a few years

What have the running costs been like?

[CrisW]

http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/a... - Might find a v12 for £20k

http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/f... - not manual but still

http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/m... - not sure about white cars and does have four doors

http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/p... - sure the obvious choice

http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/n... - spend a little money on the interior removing the ugly gauges. Perhaps the only car which will appreciate.

[BRMMA]

Only had it a month so not incurred anything yet, mpg is <20 though. Looking through the previous owners receipts though it would appear a bad year can be about £5k and a very good year about £1.5k

[aww999]

Oooh, Skyline GTR, good call! It would have to be an R32, and as close to unmodified as I could get. This one looks great:

http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/n...

Hopefully a standard one would avoid the extreme servicing/maintenance/upgrade costs that can be prevalent with these . . .