Mileage 'correction'

[mike01606]

Searched the forum for a thread on this and whilst it comes up a lot in topics, it seems a bit of an elephant in the room in mileage sensitive supercar world. Maybe this thread will be deleted....

What do people believe is the real story here?

I had previously thought that clocking would be pretty difficult to pull off, particularly on older cars as generally they did few annual miles, had a service/MOT history and significantly multiple owners.
For a car to be seriously clocked it would need to be done regularly and then by multiple owners.

I can see that with insurance often being on limited miles and people doing euro runs there would be the temptation to take miles off occasionally but an I being really naive here and it is rife? Do you actually believe the mileage when you buy a car?

Edited by mike01606 on Tuesday 9th April 21:43

[Mosi]

I know of too much of this sort of stuff going on tbh.

I was banned for life from a certain car forum because I became quit vocal about it and there were a number of members involved in it with top end cars.

Difficult to ever prove if people are careful about it, get their paperwork in order, and just do yearly 'haircuts' so its really hard to prove.

I fear that much of it goes on.

[jeremydb9]

Just been discussed on the Aston forum
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=126...

Seems more common than you might like to think!

[Slarti]

I bought my f430 with 40k on the click, safe in the knowledge that I've probably bought an honest car.

[andrew]

as long as there are people who value a car based upon mileage rather than condition, then there will be cars losing miles

[Rocco1]

I know of many one owner prestige cars that have lost 20/30000 miles when traded in and no questions asked

[sone]

I was offered a 2 year old 458 and the present owner offered to correct the mileage for me to the tune of 7k miles on a car worth the thick end of 200k. Ffs you'd think people with that sort of money would know better.

[toohuge]

Rocco1 said:

I know of many one owner prestige cars that have lost 20/30000 miles when traded in and no questions asked

May I ask why you/why the original owners don't report this kind of behaviour?

Chris

[Rocco1]

toohuge said:

May I ask why you/why the original owners don't report this kind of behaviour?

Chris

The original owner is the instigator,he will have the mileage corrected before a main agent service and 12 months later same again. If the car goes in for warranty work the mileage again will be corrected and so on.
When the car gets sold it would be very difficult to prove the mileage was corrected
The dealer will know but it has a full main agent history
I reported a dealer in Netherlands who is selling a Diablo 6.0 knowing the car has covered around 20000 miles yet being sold showing 7500 miles and he maintains the mileage is correct,yet Lamborghini's records paint a different picture
So sad but this goes on and on

Edited by Rocco1 on Wednesday 10th April 00:44

[toohuge]

I see, I misunderstood. I thought you were saying that the dealer took in a px at x mileage and listed it at y.

Clocking before each service/MOT is unavoidable.

Chris

[70proof]

what i don;t understand is if it gets a main dealer service and via the gearbox etc the technician notices a discrepancy with the odometer reading, are they not duty bound/legally obliged to raise it as an issue or at least mention it on the report, advisory etc???

iirc clocking is still an illegal activity??

[Slarti]

70proof said:

what i don;t understand is if it gets a main dealer service and via the gearbox etc the technician notices a discrepancy with the odometer reading, are they not duty bound/legally obliged to raise it as an issue or at least mention it on the report, advisory etc???

iirc clocking is still an illegal activity??

On an related note. If it's possible to check on a possible discrepancy by looking at the gearbox then why don't pre-purchase inspections pick this up?

[topjay]

They just do the gearbox as well or wipe it, if done before anything recorded each time like service/mot impossible to tell. Buy on condition, i would prefer one used and looked after than a low mileage one that looks like it had a tough life.

[sone]

Slarti said:

70proof said:

what i don;t understand is if it gets a main dealer service and via the gearbox etc the technician notices a discrepancy with the odometer reading, are they not duty bound/legally obliged to raise it as an issue or at least mention it on the report, advisory etc???

iirc clocking is still an illegal activity??

On an related note. If it's possible to check on a possible discrepancy by looking at the gearbox then why don't pre-purchase inspections pick this up?

I'm not sure it's that clear cut. I believe the readouts give information on the amount of time a certain gear has been selected etc but not specifically how many miles the car has done. I had a readout for my car and took it too another delaer who's only comment was that it looked about right no more specific than that. What is important is brake and clutch wear in my opinion, and if the car is still on it's origonal clutch then that gives a little more comfort that the mileage is true.

[70proof]

Slarti said:

70proof said:

what i don;t understand is if it gets a main dealer service and via the gearbox etc the technician notices a discrepancy with the odometer reading, are they not duty bound/legally obliged to raise it as an issue or at least mention it on the report, advisory etc???

iirc clocking is still an illegal activity??

On an related note. If it's possible to check on a possible discrepancy by looking at the gearbox then why don't pre-purchase inspections pick this up?

i had a main dealer who had nothing to do with my car do a PPI for me prior to purchase..... i assume there was no discrepancy, and if there was, i'd have been informed of this.....

do you really think a selling agent is going to reveal a problem if one is discovered during prep....

[70proof]

topjay said:

They just do the gearbox as well or wipe it, if done before anything recorded each time like service/mot impossible to tell. Buy on condition, i would prefer one used and looked after than a low mileage one that looks like it had a tough life.

agree, if a car has had a significant haircut, it should be possible to tell from condition, unless its had a super detail, and even then.... signs of wear on the steering wheel etc etc etc....

if everything can be wiped, then its a joke really, as anyone determined enough could hide the evidence.

[Magic919]

70proof said:

iirc clocking is still an illegal activity??

If only it was that simple. Currently you can clock your cars as often as you like. It becomes fraud once you start passing these readings off as true.

[Slarti]

sone said:

I'm not sure it's that clear cut. I believe the readouts give information on the amount of time a certain gear has been selected etc but not specifically how many miles the car has done. I had a readout for my car and took it too another delaer who's only comment was that it looked about right no more specific than that. What is important is brake and clutch wear in my opinion, and if the car is still on it's origonal clutch then that gives a little more comfort that the mileage is true.

I meant when a buyer pays an *independent 3rd party* to inspect a car. However, it appears that it isn't mileage that is stored in the gearbox but usage stats.

[Rocco1]

Mileage correction technicians really know their onions,information is not only stored in the gearbox

[traxx]

I remember my old 430spider came up for sale a while back on PH with less miles on it than when I had sold it 2 years earlier

..... then again perhaps the advert was wrong