RE: New traffic laws in force today
Friday 16th August 2013
According to accepted motorway stereotyping you could be forgiven for thinking the new powers for the police to issue fixed penalties for 'careless driving' have been drafted specifically with drivers of premium German saloons and SUVs in mind.
Phone calls could get a lot more costlyWe detailed the scope of the new police powers in our story when they were announced back in June and the DfT has issued an updated press releaseto confirm their enactment.
New traffic laws in force today
Tailgating? Middle lane hogging? On the phone? Points don't mean prizes
Yes, as those DRLs blaze relentlessly into your mirror, the driver's elbow on the window sill cupping phone to head with two empty lanes to his inside you can at least rest assured he's from today liable to three points and a £100 fine. If there's anyone around to enforce it of course.
Phone calls could get a lot more costly
This has prompted a fresh round of discussion on the topic in the mainstream media and among pressure groups. You can probably anticipate much of what's being said, Brake's deputy chief exec Julie Townsend saying, "We hope today's changes will help to improve driver attitudes and behaviour. But we are concerned penalties still aren't nearly high enough to deter all bad drivers and reflect the potentially appalling consequences of bad driving." Brake is asking the government to increase fines to between £500 and £1,000.
The Institute of Advanced Motorists meanwhile broadly supports the moves, albeit with caveats. "If the police target the worst and most persistent offenders this could be good news for road safety," says IAM chief exec Simon Best. "If, however, it just becomes another numbers game with thousands of careless driving tickets issued then the impact will be limited. The IAM believes that driver retraining courses have a much bigger potential to actually improve poor driving than simply issuing a standard fine and should always be offered as the first stage of prosecution."
[Sources: DfT, Brake, IAM]
Discussion
Aside from those with four rings on the radiator grill, the main culprits for tailgating round here, particularly on the A14, are the hauliers. All running on the limiter, less than a car length apart. Is there any hope that at least an initial enforcement blitz might happen?
I admit to being particularly sensitive over tailgating having been punted round a roundabout by an HGV early in my driving career.
I admit to being particularly sensitive over tailgating having been punted round a roundabout by an HGV early in my driving career.
I welcome the move but as the IAM says - will this really change attitudes to driving?
Perhaps a warning for your first offence (for tailgating or lane hogging) is better than an instant fine. For your 2nd offence you get a hefty fine, for your 3rd offence a heftier fine and points etc......
Perhaps a warning for your first offence (for tailgating or lane hogging) is better than an instant fine. For your 2nd offence you get a hefty fine, for your 3rd offence a heftier fine and points etc......
kING WHEEL RUTS ON THE M40!
This should be a matter of common sense on both the motorist and the Police, but you just know that it's going to decend into farce.
Upping the fine for using a mobile whilst driving, brilliant. That's fine, I support that totally. It's a black & white case.
It's this bit that's got me worried:
Overtaking and pushing into a queue of traffic (Source: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-23713732)
Now. I would see this as either deliberately travelling in the wrong lane (for example: A lane you know to be a right turn only) and then jinking into the left lane at the last second.
However, most drivers nowadays, even in the 9 years i've been driving, seem to regard this as any attempt to use the full available length of a multilane carriageway before merging in turn at the obstruction (as most roadworks sign post you to do!). There's always a long snake of cars in the inside lane, tutting and preventing acceptable merging.
So will your fate if attempting to use the full available space on the road network be a gamble now based on if plod sees you as "overtaking and pushing into a queue of traffic"?? Conversely, what of the people who will obstruct you from using the full space of the road network to stop you merging in turn because they feel you're cheating them.
Or maybe this is just a Bristol phenomenom of stupidity and doesn't happen anywhere else in the country....
Upping the fine for using a mobile whilst driving, brilliant. That's fine, I support that totally. It's a black & white case.
It's this bit that's got me worried:
Overtaking and pushing into a queue of traffic (Source: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-23713732)
Now. I would see this as either deliberately travelling in the wrong lane (for example: A lane you know to be a right turn only) and then jinking into the left lane at the last second.
However, most drivers nowadays, even in the 9 years i've been driving, seem to regard this as any attempt to use the full available length of a multilane carriageway before merging in turn at the obstruction (as most roadworks sign post you to do!). There's always a long snake of cars in the inside lane, tutting and preventing acceptable merging.
So will your fate if attempting to use the full available space on the road network be a gamble now based on if plod sees you as "overtaking and pushing into a queue of traffic"?? Conversely, what of the people who will obstruct you from using the full space of the road network to stop you merging in turn because they feel you're cheating them.
Or maybe this is just a Bristol phenomenom of stupidity and doesn't happen anywhere else in the country....
Hmmmm
Will the M1 be different from Monday? At the moment it appears to function in reverse:
Congested outside lane and empty inside lane...
Huge stream of cars sat behind a small Peugeot partner van doing 55mph in the outside lane yesterday. He was totally oblivious to the two empty lanes to his left
Will the M1 be different from Monday? At the moment it appears to function in reverse:
Congested outside lane and empty inside lane...
Huge stream of cars sat behind a small Peugeot partner van doing 55mph in the outside lane yesterday. He was totally oblivious to the two empty lanes to his left
MNut said:
I welcome the move but as the IAM says - will this really change attitudes to driving?
Perhaps a warning for your first offence (for tailgating or lane hogging) is better than an instant fine. For your 2nd offence you get a hefty fine, for your 3rd offence a heftier fine and points etc......
No no no! First offence should be £1000. Second another grand and 6 points. Particularly for 'phones. There has been plenty of publicity about the use of 'phones etc. Time for a bit of action. Only problem is - no police on the motorways etc.Perhaps a warning for your first offence (for tailgating or lane hogging) is better than an instant fine. For your 2nd offence you get a hefty fine, for your 3rd offence a heftier fine and points etc......
You hear this warning for first offence stuff too often. You have a loved one killed by a drunk driver. Oh, it's his first offence slap his wrist? You would agree, no?
Audi driver taigates you and because he is on the 'phone runs up the arse of your p&j and writes it off. First offence... etc
I hate tailgating and middle lane hogging, but they are so endemic that this is just going to be an excuse for the police to stop and fine whoever they feel like.
It would take a massive change in driver behaviour for it to be even possible to consistently maintain the proper distance on a rush hour motorway.
I'll be very surprised if this had any noticable effect on driving standards.
It would take a massive change in driver behaviour for it to be even possible to consistently maintain the proper distance on a rush hour motorway.
I'll be very surprised if this had any noticable effect on driving standards.
I think this is an excellent move.
There are loads of clueless and inconsiderate drivers on our motorways.
It is very frustrating on a fairly busy motorway when the first and second lane is full of people doing exaclty the same speed, increasing congestion in the third lane and slowing down the entire motorway. Perhaps the move to impose fines will increase awareness of proper motorway etiquette and encourage people to move over.
Also how often do you drive down a quiet motorway to find people dawdling along in the middle lane, only to have to go from inner lane, to middle, to far and back to inner lane again to overtake them? Most of the time even when you overtake them in this way and slot back into the inner lane with your indicator on, they keep dawdling along, away with the fairies.
Also those people who wait until you are almost passing them in the third lane and drift out without indicating at the last minute forcing you to slam on, and then drift along passing traffic in the middle lane around 1 mph quicker than the traffic they are overtaking...
I must admit, I don't tend to find tailgaters a problem, though I do tend to be travelling quicker than most other cars. Those that do in heavier traffic are easily dissuaded with a few flicks of your brake light. The only time I find tailgaters much of an issue is when you are in a 50 mph average speed check zone doing 53mph on cruise control and some bellend (usually in an A3) comes zooming up and sits 6 inches from your bumper, only to be left for dust when you are back a national speed limit zone and you resume normal cruising speed...
There are loads of clueless and inconsiderate drivers on our motorways.
It is very frustrating on a fairly busy motorway when the first and second lane is full of people doing exaclty the same speed, increasing congestion in the third lane and slowing down the entire motorway. Perhaps the move to impose fines will increase awareness of proper motorway etiquette and encourage people to move over.
Also how often do you drive down a quiet motorway to find people dawdling along in the middle lane, only to have to go from inner lane, to middle, to far and back to inner lane again to overtake them? Most of the time even when you overtake them in this way and slot back into the inner lane with your indicator on, they keep dawdling along, away with the fairies.
Also those people who wait until you are almost passing them in the third lane and drift out without indicating at the last minute forcing you to slam on, and then drift along passing traffic in the middle lane around 1 mph quicker than the traffic they are overtaking...
I must admit, I don't tend to find tailgaters a problem, though I do tend to be travelling quicker than most other cars. Those that do in heavier traffic are easily dissuaded with a few flicks of your brake light. The only time I find tailgaters much of an issue is when you are in a 50 mph average speed check zone doing 53mph on cruise control and some bellend (usually in an A3) comes zooming up and sits 6 inches from your bumper, only to be left for dust when you are back a national speed limit zone and you resume normal cruising speed...
Edited by Alfa159Ti on Friday 16th August 11:30
Interested to know which lane is the middle lane on a 4/5/6 lane section of Motorway (IE certain sections of M25/M1?
Problem that worries me slightly is the Nearside lane is often rutted from Lorry wheels making your car tram line, so you get a smoother ride in the next lane. So how would this be perceived on a near empty motorway in the evening? could it be argued as to why you're not in the nearside lane?
Recently I've noticed cars driving around the motorway with a green P on the rear windscreen indicating they are a new driver? There they are happily sitting in the middle of the motorway! Surely if they had recently passed their test they would have told to keep left?
Makes you wonder if they have ever taken a driving test in the UK?
I've no issue with the phone fines, the amount of high end cars I see with drivers not bothering to engage hands free Bluetooth is a joke and I hope the hammer comes down hard on them. Truck drivers too. I see a fair amount of Skip lorries and Cement mixer lorries with drivers all using mobile phones to communicate with the depot, not many of them use hands free kits!
But all in all, I welcome the new rules.
Problem that worries me slightly is the Nearside lane is often rutted from Lorry wheels making your car tram line, so you get a smoother ride in the next lane. So how would this be perceived on a near empty motorway in the evening? could it be argued as to why you're not in the nearside lane?
Recently I've noticed cars driving around the motorway with a green P on the rear windscreen indicating they are a new driver? There they are happily sitting in the middle of the motorway! Surely if they had recently passed their test they would have told to keep left?
Makes you wonder if they have ever taken a driving test in the UK?
I've no issue with the phone fines, the amount of high end cars I see with drivers not bothering to engage hands free Bluetooth is a joke and I hope the hammer comes down hard on them. Truck drivers too. I see a fair amount of Skip lorries and Cement mixer lorries with drivers all using mobile phones to communicate with the depot, not many of them use hands free kits!
But all in all, I welcome the new rules.
Edited by fatboy18 on Friday 16th August 11:38
V8 FOU said:
No no no! First offence should be £1000. Second another grand and 6 points. Particularly for 'phones. There has been plenty of publicity about the use of 'phones etc. Time for a bit of action. Only problem is - no police on the motorways etc.
You hear this warning for first offence stuff too often. You have a loved one killed by a drunk driver. Oh, it's his first offence slap his wrist? You would agree, no?
Audi driver taigates you and because he is on the 'phone runs up the arse of your p&j and writes it off. First offence... etc
^This.You hear this warning for first offence stuff too often. You have a loved one killed by a drunk driver. Oh, it's his first offence slap his wrist? You would agree, no?
Audi driver taigates you and because he is on the 'phone runs up the arse of your p&j and writes it off. First offence... etc
While it might be someone's 'first offence' doesn't mean it's the first time they've been on the phone etc. it's just the first time they've actually been caught. Most people doing this are just far too stupid or plain ignorant to think they're doing any harm so need to be stamped on hard.
"Yes, as those DRLs blaze relentlessly into your mirror, the driver's elbow on the window sill cupping phone to head with two empty lanes to his inside you can at least rest assured he's from today liable to three points and a £100 fine. "
If their lights are blazing into your mirror, and the inside two lanes are clear, perhaps it means you're in the outside lane and they are simply trying to overtake you without having to resort to an undertake?
If their lights are blazing into your mirror, and the inside two lanes are clear, perhaps it means you're in the outside lane and they are simply trying to overtake you without having to resort to an undertake?
fatboy18 said:
I've no issue with the phone fines, the amount of high end cars I see with drivers not bothering to engage hands free Bluetooth is a joke and I hope the hammer comes down hard on them. Truck drivers too. I see a fair amount of Skip lorries and Cement mixer lorries with drivers all using mobile phones to communicate with the depot, not many of them use hands free kits!
But all in all, I welcome the new rules.
BristolLee said:
Overtaking and pushing into a queue of traffic (Source: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-23713732)
I really hope this leads to a day when people finally use the whole length of all available lanes and merge in one by one "red arrows" style like grown ups, rather than the infuriatingly childish behaviour some drivers have of driving an inch off the bumper of the car infront to prevent the so called "inconsiderate b*stard" from mergin in, what do they want us all to do? Queue in the inside lane round the whole motorway network just in case there's a lane closure somewhere up ahead?hmmm... I appear to have an issue to work with this one, I may just go and lie down in a dark room for a bit.
BristolLee said:
Overtaking and pushing into a queue of traffic (Source: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-23713732)
Now. I would see this as either deliberately travelling in the wrong lane (for example: A lane you know to be a right turn only) and then jinking into the left lane at the last second.
However, most drivers nowadays, even in the 9 years i've been driving, seem to regard this as any attempt to use the full available length of a multilane carriageway before merging in turn at the obstruction (as most roadworks sign post you to do!). There's always a long snake of cars in the inside lane, tutting and preventing acceptable merging.
So will your fate if attempting to use the full available space on the road network be a gamble now based on if plod sees you as "overtaking and pushing into a queue of traffic"?? Conversely, what of the people who will obstruct you from using the full space of the road network to stop you merging in turn because they feel you're cheating them.
Or maybe this is just a Bristol phenomenom of stupidity and doesn't happen anywhere else in the country....
I'm also concerned what constitutes "passing a queue of traffic and pushing in". If everyone used both lanes and then merged in turn it would help the traffic flow better and result in much safer (and less political) merging. 100 cars in the left lane rather than 50 cars in both lanes increases the inevitable ripple effect of people driving too close causing problems further back!Now. I would see this as either deliberately travelling in the wrong lane (for example: A lane you know to be a right turn only) and then jinking into the left lane at the last second.
However, most drivers nowadays, even in the 9 years i've been driving, seem to regard this as any attempt to use the full available length of a multilane carriageway before merging in turn at the obstruction (as most roadworks sign post you to do!). There's always a long snake of cars in the inside lane, tutting and preventing acceptable merging.
So will your fate if attempting to use the full available space on the road network be a gamble now based on if plod sees you as "overtaking and pushing into a queue of traffic"?? Conversely, what of the people who will obstruct you from using the full space of the road network to stop you merging in turn because they feel you're cheating them.
Or maybe this is just a Bristol phenomenom of stupidity and doesn't happen anywhere else in the country....
Anyone else seriously miffed the fine for driving without insurance is only £300? That's a bargain compared to most premiums & positively incentivising for poor younglings whom are well into four figures!
Glad about the hogging/tailgating thing though woopa!
VeeFource said:
I'm also concerned what constitutes "passing a queue of traffic and pushing in". If everyone used both lanes and then merged in turn it would help the traffic flow better and result in much safer (and less political) merging. 100 cars in the left lane rather than 50 cars in both lanes increases the inevitable ripple effect of people driving too close causing problems further back!
Well, thank feck for that. I was wondering if it was just me! Im wondering what the criteria will be for judging if you are hogging the middle lane? Will the police have to follow you for a marked mile before they act, or will it be by their judgement? I think that one will be really hard to enforce and therefore be the least implemented of the new laws. And yet for me, it is THE most annoying habbit of modern motorway driving.
How about, rather than trying to enforce a law for middle lane hogging, just allow motorist to over and undertake.
I know there will be a flurry of responses to this saying how it will increase the number of accidents because people will have to look over both there left and right shoulders (clearly something the human body was never designed to do!!!), but you have to think that if the Americans can cope with it, then surely we British can too
How about, rather than trying to enforce a law for middle lane hogging, just allow motorist to over and undertake.
I know there will be a flurry of responses to this saying how it will increase the number of accidents because people will have to look over both there left and right shoulders (clearly something the human body was never designed to do!!!), but you have to think that if the Americans can cope with it, then surely we British can too
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