Can you really become a lawyer if you are not a brstr/slctr?
Can you really become a lawyer if you are not a brstr/slctr?
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Somewhatfoolish

Original Poster:

5,104 posts

217 months

Wednesday 21st August 2013
quotequote all
A lawyer told me the other day that you can become a lawyer by getting a law degree and persuing an academic path rather than practicing. Furthermore if you do that there's none of the pesky requirements to not be a dodgy fellow.

Is that actually correct?

P.S. I told her in reply that I have heard that the overwhelming majority of what I would consider "real" lawyers tend to hold the academics in contempt. Is that correct either?

Benbay001

5,895 posts

188 months

Wednesday 21st August 2013
quotequote all
Somewhatfoolish said:
A lawyer told me the other day that you can become a lawyer by getting a law degree and persuing an academic path rather than practicing. Furthermore if you do that there's none of the pesky requirements to not be a dodgy fellow.

Is that actually correct?

P.S. I told her in reply that I have heard that the overwhelming majority of what I would consider "real" lawyers tend to hold the academics in contempt. Is that correct either?
A lawyer is a solicitor, right?

tbc

3,017 posts

206 months

Wednesday 21st August 2013
quotequote all
The academic route is probably the way to go unless you have a relative who is a solicitor, barrister.

A law degree is useless nowadays unless you plan to go on to do your expensive exams afterwards and they are a long way from what they were 10-20 years back.

Speaking from experience I work with a few people who did law degrees without going on to become lawyers.

How do i put it nicely, they are thick as st. You couldn't hold an intelligent conversation with them if you tried.

Siscar

6,315 posts

160 months

Wednesday 21st August 2013
quotequote all
It depends what you mean by being a lawyer. 'Lawyer' isn't a term that really means anything specific in the UK.

Zeeky

2,954 posts

243 months

Wednesday 21st August 2013
quotequote all
A lawyer is someone who practises or studies law. An undergraduate law student could quite properly be referred to as a lawyer.

An academic cannot practise law unless he or she is also qualified as a solicitor or barrister (Scotland might be slightly different).

Academics sometimes advise practitioners on the law.


Siscar

6,315 posts

160 months

Wednesday 21st August 2013
quotequote all
Zeeky said:
A lawyer is someone who practises or studies law. An undergraduate law student could quite properly be referred to as a lawyer.

An academic cannot practise law unless he or she is also qualified as a solicitor or barrister (Scotland might be slightly different).

Academics sometimes advise practitioners on the law.
Most people would look on a lawyer as someone who practises law, not someone who is studying it. But in the UK it doesn't have a specific meaning, in the USA it does, but not here.

I have had some legal training, I used to give employment advice, I could have called myself a lawyer, there is nothing to stop me whilst I couldn't call myself a solicitor or barrister because those are specific. If an academic wants to call themselves a lawyer there is nothing to stop them, but it doesn't really mean anything.

anonymous-user

85 months

Wednesday 21st August 2013
quotequote all
Many but not all academics who teach or research law are qualified as barristers or solicitors, and some practise law part time, but it is possible to pursue an academic career without a professional legal qualification. To make progress in academia nowadays, you really need a doctorate in your field.

In the UK the term lawyer usually embraces solicitors and barristers (called advocates in Scotland). The term can also embrace Legal Executives, Notaries, and Patent Agents/Trademark Attorneys.

Edited by anonymous-user on Wednesday 21st August 22:36

anonymous-user

85 months

Wednesday 21st August 2013
quotequote all
Somewhatfoolish said:
P.S. I told her in reply that I have heard that the overwhelming majority of what I would consider "real" lawyers tend to hold the academics in contempt. Is that correct either?
No. Several members of my chambers are academics. It is fair to say that academic law and practical law can be far apart, but legal academics are generally esteemed by practitioners, and a small number of eminent academics have quasi-authoritative status when cited in Court.

I add that being an academic is not a soft option. In a research led university, the workload is high, and the pay is not that great.

Siscar

6,315 posts

160 months

Wednesday 21st August 2013
quotequote all
Increasingly companies have legal departments the inhabitants of which often call themselves lawyers despite them having no specific qualification requirements.

harry010

4,423 posts

218 months

Wednesday 21st August 2013
quotequote all
Siscar said:
Increasingly companies have legal departments the inhabitants of which often call themselves lawyers despite them having no specific qualification requirements.
Trevor Howarth of Stobart is a good example of this.

ging84

9,548 posts

177 months

Wednesday 21st August 2013
quotequote all
Zeeky said:
A lawyer is someone who practises or studies law. An undergraduate law student could quite properly be referred to as a lawyer.
if i buy one law text book that i read or intend to read, can i start calling myself a lawyer?
i think might do even if you say no

Siscar

6,315 posts

160 months

Wednesday 21st August 2013
quotequote all
ging84 said:
Zeeky said:
A lawyer is someone who practises or studies law. An undergraduate law student could quite properly be referred to as a lawyer.
if i buy one law text book that i read or intend to read, can i start calling myself a lawyer?
i think might do even if you say no
If you want to. After all, as I keep saying, it doesn't have a defined meaning in the UK

Zeeky

2,954 posts

243 months

Wednesday 21st August 2013
quotequote all
OED lawyer * n a person who practises or studies law...

The term is usually used to refer to practioners but it is not incorrect to refer to academics as lawyers.

Somewhatfoolish

Original Poster:

5,104 posts

217 months

Wednesday 21st August 2013
quotequote all
ging84 said:
if i buy one law text book that i read or intend to read, can i start calling myself a lawyer?
i think might do even if you say no
I'm going to call myself a lawyer too because I intend to read it after you have

renmure

4,949 posts

255 months

Wednesday 21st August 2013
quotequote all
Somewhatfoolish said:
ging84 said:
if i buy one law text book that i read or intend to read, can i start calling myself a lawyer?
i think might do even if you say no
I'm going to call myself a lawyer too because I intend to read it after you have
I will read it after you at Starbucks. I will study to be a Barista


Stuartggray

7,703 posts

259 months

Thursday 22nd August 2013
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My Grandfather studied to be a lawyer after being a fighter pilot in WWI. He ended up as a QC with his own office in Edinburgh.

XCP

17,747 posts

259 months

Thursday 22nd August 2013
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Was he a KC first?

3Dee

3,206 posts

252 months

Thursday 22nd August 2013
quotequote all
So this is not true then?

From the 'www.lawyer-guide.co.uk'

"...The term lawyer is given to a licensed legal practitioner who is both a solicitor and a barrister."

??? How confusing!

Edited by 3Dee on Thursday 22 August 10:02

CYMR0

3,940 posts

231 months

Thursday 22nd August 2013
quotequote all
XCP said:
Was he a KC first?
Doubt it. Even if he took his Bar Finals in 1946 he would only have had five years' call when the King died.

3Dee

3,206 posts

252 months

Thursday 22nd August 2013
quotequote all
It is definitely a confusing area, certainly to the layman.

Take for instance a professional who is not a solicitor, but has many years training in, and experience of practising in a specific area of 'Law' I suppose, such as Will advice and creation, conducting Probate duties etc.

would he/she be able to legitimately claim he/she is a 'Lawyer'?