Invalidated my entire new car warranty - is that legal?
Discussion
Ok So I know I am going to get flamed but TBH I deserve it....
I put petrol in my Diesel XC90 - yes I am an idiot. 2/3 of a tank of unleded onto 1/3 diesel.
I drove for a less than a mile, felt the engine miss, knew exacly what I had done and pulled over straight away.
I called Volvo assist and they towed it to the dealer I bought the car off. (Not local).
The dealer want £6000 to replace the entire fuel system.
I think this is a little OTT and have asked them to drain the tank, flush and reprime the system and see what happens.
After a lot of persuasion they say they will do this but they will invalidate the entire warranty - not just the engine - the entire car's warranty (which is 4 months old).
I am waiting to find out when they can do it and then whether it works - research elsewhere tells me I have probably got away with it but we shall see.
Given I have potentially damaged the engine I accept that I lose the engine warranty, but the rest - how is that fair? Or legal?
My learning from this so far is:
1) Don't put petrol in a diesel car (idiot).
2) If you do - do not call the "insert manufacturers name" assist. Call one of the many mobile drain and flush companies who (if you have not fubared your engine) will get you on your way with any warranty in tact. (Google "petrol in diesel" to get a list!)
3) Most car insurance (including mine) specifically excludes damage by misfuelling).
Turns out wrong fueling happens 400 times a day (Telegraph 2005) so I am clearly not alone - there are enough idiots like me out there to warrant an entire industry to help us out.
I put petrol in my Diesel XC90 - yes I am an idiot. 2/3 of a tank of unleded onto 1/3 diesel.
I drove for a less than a mile, felt the engine miss, knew exacly what I had done and pulled over straight away.
I called Volvo assist and they towed it to the dealer I bought the car off. (Not local).
The dealer want £6000 to replace the entire fuel system.
I think this is a little OTT and have asked them to drain the tank, flush and reprime the system and see what happens.
After a lot of persuasion they say they will do this but they will invalidate the entire warranty - not just the engine - the entire car's warranty (which is 4 months old).
I am waiting to find out when they can do it and then whether it works - research elsewhere tells me I have probably got away with it but we shall see.
Given I have potentially damaged the engine I accept that I lose the engine warranty, but the rest - how is that fair? Or legal?
My learning from this so far is:
1) Don't put petrol in a diesel car (idiot).
2) If you do - do not call the "insert manufacturers name" assist. Call one of the many mobile drain and flush companies who (if you have not fubared your engine) will get you on your way with any warranty in tact. (Google "petrol in diesel" to get a list!)
3) Most car insurance (including mine) specifically excludes damage by misfuelling).
Turns out wrong fueling happens 400 times a day (Telegraph 2005) so I am clearly not alone - there are enough idiots like me out there to warrant an entire industry to help us out.
- Sigh**
doogz said:
You should probably have figured this part out before phoning them. Not sure how you thought this would play out.
Hope you get it sorted though, does seem a bit harsh that an electrical fault in a years time won’t be covered because you once put the wrong fuel in the tank.
Absolutely, but as a newbie to the black stuff I did not even know these companies existed. Hope you get it sorted though, does seem a bit harsh that an electrical fault in a years time won’t be covered because you once put the wrong fuel in the tank.
I only found out after feverish googling after I got the £6000 quote. Hopefully anyone who reads this sorry tale will know better.Edited by Spunagain on Wednesday 21st August 12:10
surveyor said:
Who's saying that - Volvo or the dealer?
Can't see how they could maintain that non-related faults such as gearbox and suspension would not be covered, and you still also have your consumer rights...
This is from the dealer, who, as a customer I would assume speak for Volvo - I assume wrong?Can't see how they could maintain that non-related faults such as gearbox and suspension would not be covered, and you still also have your consumer rights...
Can you not just tell them not to touch your car and have it recovered by a local company to take it to a garage you know and trust to carry out the work you want?
The dealer obviously isn't willing to fix the car under warrenty (and why should they? you broke it).. So take it elsewhere.
The dealer obviously isn't willing to fix the car under warrenty (and why should they? you broke it).. So take it elsewhere.
Seems like they ripping the c@nt. I don't see why anything would be broke. I once but quarter tank of petrol in my diesel then brimmed the tank with diesel, ran chuggy for couple days till I put enough diesel in to drown out the petrol. Then got another 120,000 miles with no problem. Be different if u but diesel in a petrol but I know of loads people who have done what you have with no lasting effect at all.
Atomsforpeace said:
I don't see why anything would be broke.
It can affect the high pressure fuel pump on modern diesels pretty badly, since in normal running the pump is lubricated by the fuel it's pumping. Petrol doesn't have the lubrication qualities of diesel.It can also have a pretty bad effect on injectors - especially higher pressure ones as are common on new cars.
Older diesels can take a beating, modern ones not so much.
C
ETA: Still can't figure out why that would affect a claim on something like the stereo or paint though, as the Volvo dealer is suggesting.
Atomsforpeace said:
Seems like they ripping the c@nt. I don't see why anything would be broke. I once but quarter tank of petrol in my diesel then brimmed the tank with diesel, ran chuggy for couple days till I put enough diesel in to drown out the petrol. Then got another 120,000 miles with no problem. Be different if u but diesel in a petrol but I know of loads people who have done what you have with no lasting effect at all.
I always thought petrol in a diesel was more disastrous than diesel in a petrol?FWIW, this happened several times in the company I used to work for. Apprentice filled a diesel Transit to the brim with petrol, from empty and drove it until it stopped! After a flush it ran fine.
MysteryLemon said:
Can you not just tell them not to touch your car and have it recovered by a local company to take it to a garage you know and trust to carry out the work you want?
The dealer obviously isn't willing to fix the car under warrenty (and why should they? you broke it).. So take it elsewhere.
The dealer say the car's history has been already flagged when it was brought in.The dealer obviously isn't willing to fix the car under warrenty (and why should they? you broke it).. So take it elsewhere.
I am not asking them to drain and flush under warranty, I am happy to paiy a fair price for that.
BTW They started by quoting 5 hours, until I told them I had been quoted £160 elsewhere which they have pretty much matched.
Warranties normally rely on the principle of proximate cause i.e. if the problem is not related to your mis fueling then you would be covered as normal.
Some avenues to explore:
It would be worth getting hold of the warranty T&C and having a read if there is anything to this effect.
It's not uncommon for dealers to go over the top when the wrong fuel is used. Normally draining and starting again is sufficient. As there was no chance of this being a warranty claim i would (tentatively) suggest that this won't have been logged centrally with Volvo. If this is the case could you just arrange for your car to be towed somewhere else to be sorted and then use your local Volvo dealer in future?
Another route could be arranging/threatening for some sort of specialist to assess the situation. I doubt they'd advise £6k of work is required you can then use this to bargain with.
Edit: Just seen your post above, it would be worth validating that it has been flagged somehow. Volvo specific forum maybe. Sounds like they're just trying to box you in to paying £6k, rather than giving you the facts.
Some avenues to explore:
It would be worth getting hold of the warranty T&C and having a read if there is anything to this effect.
It's not uncommon for dealers to go over the top when the wrong fuel is used. Normally draining and starting again is sufficient. As there was no chance of this being a warranty claim i would (tentatively) suggest that this won't have been logged centrally with Volvo. If this is the case could you just arrange for your car to be towed somewhere else to be sorted and then use your local Volvo dealer in future?
Another route could be arranging/threatening for some sort of specialist to assess the situation. I doubt they'd advise £6k of work is required you can then use this to bargain with.
Edit: Just seen your post above, it would be worth validating that it has been flagged somehow. Volvo specific forum maybe. Sounds like they're just trying to box you in to paying £6k, rather than giving you the facts.
Edited by waterwonder on Wednesday 21st August 12:28
My neighbor managed to put 45 liters of unleaded into his 2004 TDI Passat, and drive it until it came to a complete stop...... 
He go the AA to relay him home.
I managed to drain the contents of the fuel tank (not via a siphon as modern tanks don't appear to let you siphon any more) by removing the rear seat base and taking out the in tank pump.
A new fuel filter later and a fresh tank of Derv and some strong injector cleaner and it sprang into life.
Fast forward 6 years and 80k later, and its still running without issue.
I spoke to a ex Mercedes technician a year ago about a similar issue, and he stated that Mercedes rules are that upon removing the fuel rail, should there be any sign of debris (traces of rubber etc) the entire fuel system will be written off by Mercedes from the fuel tank forward.
He go the AA to relay him home.
I managed to drain the contents of the fuel tank (not via a siphon as modern tanks don't appear to let you siphon any more) by removing the rear seat base and taking out the in tank pump.
A new fuel filter later and a fresh tank of Derv and some strong injector cleaner and it sprang into life.
Fast forward 6 years and 80k later, and its still running without issue.
I spoke to a ex Mercedes technician a year ago about a similar issue, and he stated that Mercedes rules are that upon removing the fuel rail, should there be any sign of debris (traces of rubber etc) the entire fuel system will be written off by Mercedes from the fuel tank forward.
Yeah take your point about modern diesels not being as good I used to swear by old ones but stopped buying them when they started making the engine components out of cheese. went from diesels that would do 150000 almost problem free to particulate filters, turbos and fuel and water pumps going for fun. I'm a taxi driver so went back to petrol as they are much more reliable these days since they started making rubbish plastic components in all diesels. gone are days I can do 300000 miles in a mk1 skodA without touching the engine. Had a pug 407 and learnt my lesson on how crap diesels have become.(406 was bullet proof for taxi)
Now have to take a 20mpg hit in order not to be lumped with a thousand pound bill every year for turbo,particulate etc. I worked out I'm better off getting 35mpg and having reliability that 55 with massive bills has become a false economy especially for taxi.
Now have to take a 20mpg hit in order not to be lumped with a thousand pound bill every year for turbo,particulate etc. I worked out I'm better off getting 35mpg and having reliability that 55 with massive bills has become a false economy especially for taxi.
I got alot of "the end is nigh" from this site when I fueled my old mans diesel espace with petol on an airport run. I ran it, it misfired, I ran it some more, ran very rough (during a very cold snap so I misinterpreted the symptoms) then ran it till it stopped.
Fuel drain company, change filters, still fine 30k later. I honestly believe the misfueling doom and gloom is theoretical, personally never heard of actual real world problems (awaits PH multiple examples).
Fuel drain company, change filters, still fine 30k later. I honestly believe the misfueling doom and gloom is theoretical, personally never heard of actual real world problems (awaits PH multiple examples).
Spunagain said:
surveyor said:
Who's saying that - Volvo or the dealer?
Can't see how they could maintain that non-related faults such as gearbox and suspension would not be covered, and you still also have your consumer rights...
This is from the dealer, who, as a customer I would assume speak for Volvo - I assume wrong?Can't see how they could maintain that non-related faults such as gearbox and suspension would not be covered, and you still also have your consumer rights...
MysteryLemon said:
Typical dealer jumping to the worst case scenario (and the most expensive...) when a simple drain and refuel could solve the problem.
To be fair to the dealer they're probably only doing what their manufacturer bosses are telling them to do, the dealer's hands will be tied.Also, it's not just Volvo that insist on replacing the whole fuel system.
Wrong fueled my first S Type diesel in france. Got recovered by Jaguar assist to my driveway & drained the virtually neat unleaded & put it in the 944. Then got a jerry can of diesel & dumped that in. APart from the battery not liking being hammered to pump the fuel out it was fine for 30k until I sold it.
AntJC said:
My neighbor managed to put 45 liters of unleaded into his 2004 TDI Passat, and drive it until it came to a complete stop......
He go the AA to relay him home.
I managed to drain the contents of the fuel tank (not via a siphon as modern tanks don't appear to let you siphon any more) by removing the rear seat base and taking out the in tank pump.
A new fuel filter later and a fresh tank of Derv and some strong injector cleaner and it sprang into life.
Fast forward 6 years and 80k later, and its still running without issue.
I spoke to a ex Mercedes technician a year ago about a similar issue, and he stated that Mercedes rules are that upon removing the fuel rail, should there be any sign of debris (traces of rubber etc) the entire fuel system will be written off by Mercedes from the fuel tank forward.
Now that is the reasonable approach - but the quote happened before they have even touched the car, asked what distance I had travelled or how much petrol had gone in the tank......He go the AA to relay him home.
I managed to drain the contents of the fuel tank (not via a siphon as modern tanks don't appear to let you siphon any more) by removing the rear seat base and taking out the in tank pump.
A new fuel filter later and a fresh tank of Derv and some strong injector cleaner and it sprang into life.
Fast forward 6 years and 80k later, and its still running without issue.
I spoke to a ex Mercedes technician a year ago about a similar issue, and he stated that Mercedes rules are that upon removing the fuel rail, should there be any sign of debris (traces of rubber etc) the entire fuel system will be written off by Mercedes from the fuel tank forward.
I'd be interested to hear of anyone who has really fubared a common rail diesel engine - what did it take to break it?
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