Discussion
Whenever i see an advert or write up for an electric car with the amount of milage they can do on a full charge they always show them during day time with no lights on, i wonder what sort of milage they would get on a full charge driving during the night time, it can`t possibly be the same or for example winter time driving with the rear window heater on, the heater blower on full blast, the radio on, the lights and wipers on if its raining or even snowing, plus maybe a few other smaller power consumers surely that would reduce the milage right down to about 2 miles. There never seems to be a mention of driving in those sort of conditions or maybe you just cant drive them unless its during the day time in ideal conditions. (not that i would ever want one)
Lights will make bugger all difference, especially if they're LED which they probably are on most pure electric cars. A typical LED light setup seems to be about 30 watts so in say three hours of driving to do your 100 miles, you'd lose about a third of a mile of range.
Heaters are another matter; keeping even a well insulated car warm in the winter takes a significant amount of energy. If we say it takes 500 watts to keep the interior of a car warm, your range would drop by about six miles over that same 3 hour drive.
Heaters are another matter; keeping even a well insulated car warm in the winter takes a significant amount of energy. If we say it takes 500 watts to keep the interior of a car warm, your range would drop by about six miles over that same 3 hour drive.
Edited by kambites on Friday 23 August 10:52
This is why the charging points that have been mentioned in a few threads on here are going in, if you can get to work put the car on charge while you are there then drive home and charge again, or top up while you shop somewhere then the range becomes less of an issue provided your usage doesn't mean you will always be at marginal charge for the required range.
My one electric car experience was driving a 2 year old iMiev. When the A/C was turned off it gained about 5 extra miles on the range meter, so clearly electric aircon takes a fair amount of juice out of the traction battery.
On the question of lights etc, AIUI, the lights, radio, fag lighter etc are normally powered off a standard 12V lead acid battery (maybe a caravan battery rather than car, discharge/charge cycle would probably match caravan use more than a petrol car) not the main traction battery. The iMiev certainly had a normal sized battery next to the washer bottle, brake reservoir etc under the "bonnet"
On the question of lights etc, AIUI, the lights, radio, fag lighter etc are normally powered off a standard 12V lead acid battery (maybe a caravan battery rather than car, discharge/charge cycle would probably match caravan use more than a petrol car) not the main traction battery. The iMiev certainly had a normal sized battery next to the washer bottle, brake reservoir etc under the "bonnet"
I've been out in a Nissan Leaf - The guys that look after the car say that the range is never as high as quoted anyway, however; Switching on the heater (an electric element, a bit that in a kettle) cut 20 miles off the range.
Add in a dark winters morning, with heated rear screen, lights and wipres, and the range drops even further
Add in a dark winters morning, with heated rear screen, lights and wipres, and the range drops even further
Several posts in to an electric car thread and still no sign of Technomatt? He's slipping. 
I agree minimum range with everything turned on would be far more useful figure to have when considering buying one. Are the quoted ranges based on the same cycles used for petrol/diesel cars, which I believe are mandated/regulated by some international body?
I agree minimum range with everything turned on would be far more useful figure to have when considering buying one. Are the quoted ranges based on the same cycles used for petrol/diesel cars, which I believe are mandated/regulated by some international body?
Superhoop said:
I've been out in a Nissan Leaf - The guys that look after the car say that the range is never as high as quoted anyway, however; Switching on the heater (an electric element, a bit that in a kettle) cut 20 miles off the range.
Add in a dark winters morning, with heated rear screen, lights and wipres, and the range drops even further
I got into examining electric cars some years ago and the comments above about the quoted range being very optimistic is spot on. In the rain(wipers) and cold, (heater), and heated electric rears creen and all the lights on significantly less range is actually available. Which in the UK is a lot of the time.Add in a dark winters morning, with heated rear screen, lights and wipres, and the range drops even further
For short planned journeys in urban areas electric cars may be used. However no electric car could offer the common daily business mileages which my still working friends clock up of 600++ miles. Quite impossible. Equally the owner cannot suddenly decide to meet up in say London from Newcastle by electric car and return in a day.
It is essentially horses for courses. With a planned approach and limited distance use there are circumstances in which electric cars can be the preferred choice. However for flexibility and the opportunity to react to changing driving needs the IC cars are still much more flexible.
On the Eco question I do think many of the quoted "savings" with electric cars are substantially overstated. It is an arguable point whether the apparent savings of electric cars by Atomic generation required or Coal fired generation required to produce the kind of energy our society consumes are real. The Eco trendy generation of Wind power/Solar power/Wave power etc seems to be so overhyped as to be ridiculous. I cannot personally see any real savings to society as a whole and without question electric cars are much more expensive to run, given the depreciation and replacement battery costs involved.
No doubt the electric car enthusiasts will be along to argue their case shortly. I think the facts of the case speak for themselves.
You can set these cars to warm up or cool down prior to you leaving for work in the morning, (well in the Leaf you can)
So in winter, you'll be getting into a nice warm car fully defrosted, and it has taken the energy to do that from your house.
This will help save some energy in your battery as you're not running the heater on full blast trying to get the thing warmed up when you leave.
So in winter, you'll be getting into a nice warm car fully defrosted, and it has taken the energy to do that from your house.
This will help save some energy in your battery as you're not running the heater on full blast trying to get the thing warmed up when you leave.
RizzoTheRat said:
I agree minimum range with everything turned on would be far more useful figure to have when considering buying one. Are the quoted ranges based on the same cycles used for petrol/diesel cars, which I believe are mandated/regulated by some international body?
But as with a petrol car, the minimum range under exactly the wrong situation can be zero. kambites said:
dtmpower said:
Steffan said:
common daily business mileages which my still working friends clock up of 600++ miles.
Over 600 miles per day ?
kambites said:
dtmpower said:
Steffan said:
common daily business mileages which my still working friends clock up of 600++ miles.
Over 600 miles per day ?Which is apparently the situation that 97% of the UK find themselves in
dtmpower said:
kambites said:
dtmpower said:
Steffan said:
common daily business mileages which my still working friends clock up of 600++ miles.
Over 600 miles per day ?What I find interesting is that the storage of electricity for use in electric has developed very little since the First World War. That has always been the Achilles heel of electric cars and remains the Achilles heel IMO. The development of Hybrid cars clearly demonstrates that weakness. Pure electric rechargeable cars cannot offer the flexibility needed by serious daily drivers. They are acceptable for short commuter driving but that is in reality all they can achieve. A sudden requirement to travel 200+ miles to an urgent meeting and return in a day cannot be satisfied with a pure electric car. Hence my doubts about their long term market penetration once the hype and spin wears of the current publicity drive.
t on this one. Even at a very optimistic average speed of 60mph, that's 20 hours a day driving. Simply not possible over any kind of extended period.Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff