Automotive Camera Rigs!
Discussion
Yes, I know this has been discussed to death and never seems to get anywhere BUT I am seriously in need of sorting out a decent rig, but don’t have a grand to fork out. I want a CF rig thats at least 4m, ideally 6m.
I have pretty much managed to source most of the other parts, such as the clamps and suction cups etc but I need the CF pole. I have found several places that can sell me CF pole sections but I have a couple of questions:
1) How can I join the poles together to ensure a solid joint that wont slip or allow flex
2) What diameter CF pole would be best, I am thinking something around the 50mm diameter, but I am not sure if the Manfrotto 035 Superclamps can accommodate this diameter.
What are your opinions/experiences on this. I know there are some Top Class automotive togs on here so I am seeking your input if possible also
I know the likes of Car Camera Rig offer a superb product and in an ideal world with no budget I would have one in a heart beat, but I am tied as to how much I can spend on this!
Cheers, Rick
I have pretty much managed to source most of the other parts, such as the clamps and suction cups etc but I need the CF pole. I have found several places that can sell me CF pole sections but I have a couple of questions:
1) How can I join the poles together to ensure a solid joint that wont slip or allow flex
2) What diameter CF pole would be best, I am thinking something around the 50mm diameter, but I am not sure if the Manfrotto 035 Superclamps can accommodate this diameter.
What are your opinions/experiences on this. I know there are some Top Class automotive togs on here so I am seeking your input if possible also
I know the likes of Car Camera Rig offer a superb product and in an ideal world with no budget I would have one in a heart beat, but I am tied as to how much I can spend on this!
Cheers, Rick
035 SuperClamps have a maximum clamp radius of 55mm. My CF boom is 52mm outside diameter and I wouldn't want to go beyond that as you start running the risk of crushing the carbon.
Your other consideration is the join. Mine has a fixed external sleeve at one end of each section. The sleeve is 400mm IIRC, meaning there's 200mm overlap with the next section. It's not quite a perfect fit so I had to find a solution to prevent the loose section rotating within the fixed sleeve- this was only a problem once the camera was mounted to the far end of the boom, but let's face it that's when it matters. I drilled mine and dropped a bolt & wingnut through it but have since seen a less destructive option of Velcro around the join.
The join is literally the weak link and is where most of the flex comes from. I run 2x2m but wouldn't be too comfortable going longer with this configuration. A third 2m pole would put a lot of leverage on the joins which could lead to a spontaneous failure, whilst shortening the sections and needing more joins would introduce too much flex for a consistent result IMHO.
I met Justin from CCR a couple of months ago with a mission to shoot a properly long exposure rigshot. At 6 mtrs (4x1.5m sections) we managed 60 seconds with acceptable sharpness. I can just squeeze 30s out of mine at 4m
The Car Camera Rig set up is undeniably expensive but I'd argue it also representing excellent value given the alternatives of unusable images or broken equipment.
Your other consideration is the join. Mine has a fixed external sleeve at one end of each section. The sleeve is 400mm IIRC, meaning there's 200mm overlap with the next section. It's not quite a perfect fit so I had to find a solution to prevent the loose section rotating within the fixed sleeve- this was only a problem once the camera was mounted to the far end of the boom, but let's face it that's when it matters. I drilled mine and dropped a bolt & wingnut through it but have since seen a less destructive option of Velcro around the join.
The join is literally the weak link and is where most of the flex comes from. I run 2x2m but wouldn't be too comfortable going longer with this configuration. A third 2m pole would put a lot of leverage on the joins which could lead to a spontaneous failure, whilst shortening the sections and needing more joins would introduce too much flex for a consistent result IMHO.
I met Justin from CCR a couple of months ago with a mission to shoot a properly long exposure rigshot. At 6 mtrs (4x1.5m sections) we managed 60 seconds with acceptable sharpness. I can just squeeze 30s out of mine at 4m
The Car Camera Rig set up is undeniably expensive but I'd argue it also representing excellent value given the alternatives of unusable images or broken equipment.
Thanks for getting back to me, from googling and reading threads on here it is actually you I wanted to hear from so thanks.
I know the CCR one is the daddy and trust me, if I had £1500 spare I Would 100% have one on order, but I don’t, I have about a third of that at best so the only option is to put something together myself. There are a few CF manufacturers who are not too far away from my house so if the the Manfrotto mounting bits are up to the job then its the boom I need to concentrate on.
The way I see it, if CCR can have a 6m rig thats good enough to obtain 60 sec exposure (which is way beyond what I am likely to need) then it is clearly possible to do with the right kit. mmmm time to get thinking me thinks.
PS Did you do a video with Justin on the rig? Just you mention a 60 sec shot at 6m, that rings a bell from a video Justin posted up a week or so ago?
Cheers for your input, any other thoughts welcome
Rick
I know the CCR one is the daddy and trust me, if I had £1500 spare I Would 100% have one on order, but I don’t, I have about a third of that at best so the only option is to put something together myself. There are a few CF manufacturers who are not too far away from my house so if the the Manfrotto mounting bits are up to the job then its the boom I need to concentrate on.
The way I see it, if CCR can have a 6m rig thats good enough to obtain 60 sec exposure (which is way beyond what I am likely to need) then it is clearly possible to do with the right kit. mmmm time to get thinking me thinks.
PS Did you do a video with Justin on the rig? Just you mention a 60 sec shot at 6m, that rings a bell from a video Justin posted up a week or so ago?
Cheers for your input, any other thoughts welcome
Rick
Focus_ASBO said:
Did you do a video with Justin on the rig? Just you mention a 60 sec shot at 6m, that rings a bell from a video Justin posted up a week or so ago?
Yep, we filmed it. blog post here.I can't find details for who I sourced my boom from two or three years back but there's a rig thread running on TalkPhotography in which someone's just picked up some carbon poles and gives his supplier.
Hi Feirny, it looks like the one Dan is selling is the Rig Pro one which is aluminium, from what I can gather he is wanted £500 for his, which while this is a good price for that rig, it is looking like I can put a 6m carbon rig together for less than that. Thanks for the heads up though.
Focus_ASBO said:
Hi Feirny, it looks like the one Dan is selling is the Rig Pro one which is aluminium, from what I can gather he is wanted £500 for his, which while this is a good price for that rig, it is looking like I can put a 6m carbon rig together for less than that. Thanks for the heads up though.
No worries. Had it in my head it was CF, so apologies on that front.Can I just ask, I can see circular cross section poles being quite flexy at length, why don't they use something with a better second moment of area like those Bosch rexroth Alu profiles?
I have a 3m long 40x40mm piece and its as rigid as you like! Obviously it has nothing on CF re: weight but it's not exactly that heavy either. I don't use it for anything though, it's just on the floor in my lab!
I have a 3m long 40x40mm piece and its as rigid as you like! Obviously it has nothing on CF re: weight but it's not exactly that heavy either. I don't use it for anything though, it's just on the floor in my lab!
AndWhyNot said:
Yep, we filmed it. blog post here.
I can't find details for who I sourced my boom from two or three years back but there's a rig thread running on TalkPhotography in which someone's just picked up some carbon poles and gives his supplier.
Slightly off topic but you have a great gallery on your websiteI can't find details for who I sourced my boom from two or three years back but there's a rig thread running on TalkPhotography in which someone's just picked up some carbon poles and gives his supplier.
Otispunkmeyer said:
Can I just ask, I can see circular cross section poles being quite flexy at length, why don't they use something with a better second moment of area like those Bosch rexroth Alu profiles?
Circular cross-section aluminium is absolutely fine, as long as it's got a big enough diameter. At 50mm it should be flex-free in this application. (I assume it's the same with carbonfibre!) The problem then is limiting flex of the bodywork it's attached to...That said, the Rexroth stuff looks interesting. Might be worth considering if it's no heavier than plain aluminium tube. Or maybe you could go to a smaller diameter for the same strength, thus reducing the amount of post-processing work required a little.
Ev_ said:
Otispunkmeyer said:
Can I just ask, I can see circular cross section poles being quite flexy at length, why don't they use something with a better second moment of area like those Bosch rexroth Alu profiles?
Circular cross-section aluminium is absolutely fine, as long as it's got a big enough diameter. At 50mm it should be flex-free in this application. (I assume it's the same with carbonfibre!) The problem then is limiting flex of the bodywork it's attached to...That said, the Rexroth stuff looks interesting. Might be worth considering if it's no heavier than plain aluminium tube. Or maybe you could go to a smaller diameter for the same strength, thus reducing the amount of post-processing work required a little.
But because it has the grooved sections on all 4 sides, its incredibly easy to attach just about anything!
Not sure the Rexroth stuff is especially cheap either, being German. But there are plenty of other manufacturers out there who basically make the exact same stuff. Might be worth a look for some applications.
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