Expensive cars, cheap engine

[Vladimir]

This isn't just a pop at the Elise, it includes two cars we've owned.

Example:

Our VW California 180 4Motion; lists at £53k (with options), has a rather modest 2.0 litre, bi-turbo 180bhp 4 pot unit found in a pick up and very similar to those found in fairly basic VWs.

Our old Land Rover 110XS - £32k list price, Ford Transit engine.

Almost any 2.0 litre (or less) diesel in a big body - e.g. A6/520d/big Merc 200CDI - low rent engine, big price tag.

Lotus 111R - over £30k, same engine as a Corolla T Sport...

Caterhams (just) get away with it as they are usually fairly well tuned.

With the VW, we had no choice. Same with the LR but I do struggle to understand how people can buy a rather flashy looking barge with the same engine as a modest hatchback.

Any others?!

[Timbo_S2]

Vladimir said:

This isn't just a pop at the Elise, it includes two cars we've owned.

Example:

Our VW California 180 4Motion; lists at £53k (with options), has a rather modest 2.0 litre, bi-turbo 180bhp 4 pot unit found in a pick up and very similar to those found in fairly basic VWs.
Any others?!

Even better - New Caravelle Business 4 Motion - retails at £69,950 without options, for the same 4 pot diesel engine...

[aka_kerrly]

Years ago you used to be able to get a BMW 718I and 518i - The 318I barely felt powerful so god knows what a tank like 7er would be like.

Similarly the Mercedes 190 with a 1.8 carb engine was awful to.

[Jandywa]

The celica/corolla t-sport engine is a bloody good one. But you're right. It probably should have the lump from a veyron

[SteveSteveson]

Not really sure what your getting at here... I can understand the wonder at the BMW 718, but the rest of them? Nothing wrong with using the engine in lots of cars... Not really low rent.

[jamieduff1981]

Yeah the Supermarine Spitfire had the same engine as the Fairey Battle. What a naff pedigree to choose for a thoroughbred fighter.

[Captain Muppet]

Using a cheap engine in an expensive car makes the expensive car cheaper.
It also makes the cheap car cheaper.

As long as the cheap engine does the job I can't see what the problems is.

[ewenm]

I don't get it. Does the engine do what you need it to do in the car? It doesn't matter what else it is used in, and for small manufacturers the cost of developing their own engine would be huge.

I see a car as a complete package, hopefully more than the sum of its parts. The Caterham 7 is a classic example - basic, simple parts brought together to create something that can delight and excite every time you drive it.

[kambites]

The Corrola T-Sport was over 20k; a 30k car sharing an engine with a 20k car is hardly a huge discrepancy.

[E38Ross]

aka_kerrly said:

Years ago you used to be able to get a BMW 718I and 518i - The 318I barely felt powerful so god knows what a tank like 7er would be like.

Similarly the Mercedes 190 with a 1.8 carb engine was awful to.

No you couldn't. A 7 series has NEVER been fitted with anything less than 6 cylinders.

[Vladimir]

Just a discussion point really. Some work, others don't.

I find stuff like that interesting though.

Flipping it on it's head, I love stuff like the C63 Merc - Basic(ish) body, whacking great 6.2 litre V8 stuck in the bonnet.

[kambites]

Vladimir said:

Flipping it on it's head, I love stuff like the C63 Merc - Basic(ish) body, whacking great 6.2 litre V8 stuck in the bonnet.

You could equally well look at the S63 and say "how rubbish, that's got the engine from a C-class in it".

[anonymous-user]

I do see the OPs point, I often wonder how you could be happy with spending £30 - £40k on a well specified 5 series or A6 with a gruff clattery 4 pot 2 litre diesel engine and not feel totally robbed whenever you drive it. You overlook it in an £18k golf economy special, but it really is jarring in the nice cabin of a well specified A6.

In the same vein having only experienced V6 Rover 800s back in the day the shock of the terrible refinement of the 2 litre petrol engine in the really rather plush cabin of a Vitesse coupe was similarly surprising/disappointing.

Edited by dme123 on Tuesday 3rd September 14:30

[300bhp/ton]

Captain Muppet said:

Using a cheap engine in an expensive car makes the expensive car cheaper.
It also makes the cheap car cheaper.

As long as the cheap engine does the job I can't see what the problems is.

I suppose to take this to the extreme, look at the sad demise of TVR. Sure it's not all the engines fault, but the downward slide certainly started when they began making their own bespoke engines.

[Vladimir]

kambites said:

You could equally well look at the S63 and say "how rubbish, that's got the engine from a C-class in it".

Now that's just being silly...

[ewenm]

Vladimir said:

Just a discussion point really. Some work, others don't.

I find stuff like that interesting though.

Flipping it on it's head, I love stuff like the C63 Merc - Basic(ish) body, whacking great 6.2 litre V8 stuck in the bonnet.

Flipping it on its head would have been marketing the boggo Rover 214 as "with the engine from a Caterham!!!!!".

[Vladimir]

dme123 said:

I do see the OPs point, I often wonder how you could be happy with spending £30 - £40k on a well specified 5 series or A6 with a gruff clattery 4 pot 2 litre diesel engine and not feel totally robbed whenever you drive it. You overlook it in an £18k golf economy special, but it really is jarring in the nice cabin of a well specified A6.

In the same vein having only experienced V6 Rover 800s back in the day the shock of the terrible refinement of the 2 litre petrol engine in the really rather plush cabin of a Vitesse coupe was similarly jarring.

I seem to remember a game a while back where you tried to get as much over the basic price as possible to win - I believe you could get an A6 2.0TDI to something like £70k with every single possible option!!!

[CYMR0]

$69k fully loaded, but has the same engine as this (2.0 four-cylinder turbo petrol with 240 hp), which is around $28k.

[Vladimir]

CYMR0 -excellent! Cheers for joining in!

[Coatesy351]

This?