Just spent a week with a BMW 320D F30
Discussion
Supplied with a BMW 320 pool car by my company for a week away. What a massive disappointment.
I have read so much positive feedback for it here, I really tried to give it a fair shake, but it is such a poor car.
Noisy, rattly engine, made all the more obvious by the stop start tech bringing blessed silence. When on the move, gutless, laggy, and without enough torque to exploit the chassis. Is it better than some of the other low capactity Diesel engines ? yes, but that is a very low bar. It is grossly inferior to any petrol engine with a similar output. It is not nearly as impressive in real life as 180 bhp sounds on paper.
The ride was terrible. WHAM WHAM over every join in the road, lots of tyre noise, jiggly ride, tramlining, no idea if I am giving the chassis a fair shake, but it was supplied with 18's and runflat tyres. E90 not nearly as noisy at the front.
Handling in terms of grip available was impressive..in terms of feedback, delicacy, progressive limits, it was woeful, just no fun to drive fast at all. Electic steering system inferior to the E36 and E90. I am sure you could set a fast lap time on the ring, but compared to the E30, E36 or even the E90 it was a step backwards. The front end seemed much stiffer but this seemed to translate into more understeer than grip.
The traction control, was very very intrusive and one of worst systems I have encountered. Perhaps this is unfair as this car was not optioned with the DTC or variable steering or Sports +, but the standard car's electronics are very poor indeed, amd I almost suspect BMW have deliberately done this in order to sell upgrades.
I Drive is horrible...who thought controlling a system with a dial is a good idea ? Entering addresses is just painful. Give me a touchscreen everyday. There is a reason every mobile phone has a touchcreen not a dial.
Economy was very, very impressive. Credit where credit is due, it was the most economical saloon I have ever driven over all conditions.
Also to be fair, I think there is good chassis under there, get rid of the 18's, fit non runflat tyres, fit a powerful petrol engine, change the electric power steering and most of my complaints would go away. I can see how the 335i would be a great improvement.
It's a car setup for people who have to get from A-B as quickly as possible whilst at the same time as cheaply as possible, in many ways I can see that it is the best company car ever built, a tool for a very specific job. I can't however ever imagine using my own money to buy one, and I was shocked at how compromised 3 series cars have become in the pursuit of economy and lap times and looks over all other considerations. 3 series for me have always been a car that is a great tool for the job, and also a very enjoyable driving machine, and this latest car does not meet that criteria at all.
I have read so much positive feedback for it here, I really tried to give it a fair shake, but it is such a poor car.
Noisy, rattly engine, made all the more obvious by the stop start tech bringing blessed silence. When on the move, gutless, laggy, and without enough torque to exploit the chassis. Is it better than some of the other low capactity Diesel engines ? yes, but that is a very low bar. It is grossly inferior to any petrol engine with a similar output. It is not nearly as impressive in real life as 180 bhp sounds on paper.
The ride was terrible. WHAM WHAM over every join in the road, lots of tyre noise, jiggly ride, tramlining, no idea if I am giving the chassis a fair shake, but it was supplied with 18's and runflat tyres. E90 not nearly as noisy at the front.
Handling in terms of grip available was impressive..in terms of feedback, delicacy, progressive limits, it was woeful, just no fun to drive fast at all. Electic steering system inferior to the E36 and E90. I am sure you could set a fast lap time on the ring, but compared to the E30, E36 or even the E90 it was a step backwards. The front end seemed much stiffer but this seemed to translate into more understeer than grip.
The traction control, was very very intrusive and one of worst systems I have encountered. Perhaps this is unfair as this car was not optioned with the DTC or variable steering or Sports +, but the standard car's electronics are very poor indeed, amd I almost suspect BMW have deliberately done this in order to sell upgrades.
I Drive is horrible...who thought controlling a system with a dial is a good idea ? Entering addresses is just painful. Give me a touchscreen everyday. There is a reason every mobile phone has a touchcreen not a dial.
Economy was very, very impressive. Credit where credit is due, it was the most economical saloon I have ever driven over all conditions.
Also to be fair, I think there is good chassis under there, get rid of the 18's, fit non runflat tyres, fit a powerful petrol engine, change the electric power steering and most of my complaints would go away. I can see how the 335i would be a great improvement.
It's a car setup for people who have to get from A-B as quickly as possible whilst at the same time as cheaply as possible, in many ways I can see that it is the best company car ever built, a tool for a very specific job. I can't however ever imagine using my own money to buy one, and I was shocked at how compromised 3 series cars have become in the pursuit of economy and lap times and looks over all other considerations. 3 series for me have always been a car that is a great tool for the job, and also a very enjoyable driving machine, and this latest car does not meet that criteria at all.
I currently have a 320d msport as a rental, and I agree with pretty much all of that.
Crushingly competent, bucket loads of grip but no feel, the engine is effective but very dieselly and I was ok with I drive.
If you want something efficient to do big miles in and have £350 a month to spend I can see why it's an obvious choice.
More road noise than I expected, ride quality not great but better than I feared, engine more flexible than i thought it would be (although I understand why a large proportion are autos) and the seats and leather are poor.
I am aware these are first world problems.
Crushingly competent, bucket loads of grip but no feel, the engine is effective but very dieselly and I was ok with I drive.
If you want something efficient to do big miles in and have £350 a month to spend I can see why it's an obvious choice.
More road noise than I expected, ride quality not great but better than I feared, engine more flexible than i thought it would be (although I understand why a large proportion are autos) and the seats and leather are poor.
I am aware these are first world problems.
I havent driven an F30, but we have a facelift E90 320Ed at work and I find the lag horrific. I think its more down to the stupidly long gear ratios though. If slowly moving in second gear and plant it from a junction or the like, its unreal. Literally nothing for a couple of seconds then all of a sudden you nearly ram the car in front from the insane surge of boost.
Having said that, on a motorway its brilliant, and if you are constantly on the boil its a cracking engine. I thought it was very quick for how much power it had on paper. Its ability to cruise at 3 figures is also very impressive for its engine size. Im assuming the f30 could only be better?
Having said that, on a motorway its brilliant, and if you are constantly on the boil its a cracking engine. I thought it was very quick for how much power it had on paper. Its ability to cruise at 3 figures is also very impressive for its engine size. Im assuming the f30 could only be better?
I've had a few diesel hire/loan cars over the last year, and I thought both the equivalent (in engine size) Mondeo and Insignia felt quicker than the 320D. Even the Mini Countryman D felt quicker. Speedo readings on the motorway showed not a lot of difference though, so I assume it's down to the flattening of the torque curve?
Maybe they need to make the power delivery less 'flat' to spice it up a little.
Didn't get anywhere near the claimed extra-urban MPG figures though ;-)
Maybe they need to make the power delivery less 'flat' to spice it up a little.
Didn't get anywhere near the claimed extra-urban MPG figures though ;-)
I don't agree of everything but you made a lot of points. Last year when I went to test drive the new 3series I was almost certain to buy one, being in the market for a new daily car. After reading all that great magazine reviews and having owned and enjoyed a E90 it seemed obvious. But the car deluded me deeply even if in objective terms it is a competent car. I briefly test drove a manual petrol 328 (even worse if you place it against the sweet E90 330) than I managed to took a 320d for a full weekend.
Having a weekend fun car at the time I could have forgiven the 320d a lack of involvment in driving but I on the other hand the car hadn't become more practical than the E90. Still not very spacious for rear passenger and my E90 was an estate (F30 estate was still not available). On Autostrada the noise insulation felt improved but marginal.
I ended up spending a bit more but getting a 525d estate, a big heavy car that doesn't make you go looking for your favorite road but with the good 8speed auto in sport+ it is brisker than I expected for a heavy four pot diesel estate, had a lot of room for rear passenger, a dcent and practical boot, highspeed comfort, good adaptive ride and while it is not agile at all it still has a benign handling.
Having a weekend fun car at the time I could have forgiven the 320d a lack of involvment in driving but I on the other hand the car hadn't become more practical than the E90. Still not very spacious for rear passenger and my E90 was an estate (F30 estate was still not available). On Autostrada the noise insulation felt improved but marginal.
I ended up spending a bit more but getting a 525d estate, a big heavy car that doesn't make you go looking for your favorite road but with the good 8speed auto in sport+ it is brisker than I expected for a heavy four pot diesel estate, had a lot of room for rear passenger, a dcent and practical boot, highspeed comfort, good adaptive ride and while it is not agile at all it still has a benign handling.
kambites said:
The ride is worse than the E90?!? 
Just what I was going to say!!! When I was looking to replace my E39 530, an E90 330 seemed an obvious answer - bit smaller and more agile (I hardly ever used all the space in the E39), probably a bit quicker... I test drove both Sport and SE models, and concluded that I couldn't possibly spend time in anything with such a shocking ride. Also, given that on anything other than totally smooth roads, they were thrown off line so easily, I couldn't even feel that they'd be any fun to drive on twisty roads - which to me is the point of having a 'sporty' car. And this is worse! Wow. Has suspension gone totally out of fashion, and if so, why..? Rhetorical question of course - I know the subject has been done to death on here. I'll just stick to cheaper older cars with suspension that works, and be happy to be thought an old git.
Other people may not agree, their opinions equally valid, etc. etc., but... Kambites took the words right out of my mouth.
I've just had on hire a 320i x-drive which is the first 3 series I have driven in a few years.
I though it was good, smooth, fast , tones of grip and also quiet.
The down sides where wind noise from door mirrors, footwell room is very tight with the manual an I only have size 10's
The ride was good and supple, but this could be down to the 17' tyres fitted, also fitted with adjustable suspension which was set to comfort.
I liked it other than it was white with gangsta black windows. I would consider a 5 series on the basis of the drive yesterday.
I though it was good, smooth, fast , tones of grip and also quiet.
The down sides where wind noise from door mirrors, footwell room is very tight with the manual an I only have size 10's
The ride was good and supple, but this could be down to the 17' tyres fitted, also fitted with adjustable suspension which was set to comfort.
I liked it other than it was white with gangsta black windows. I would consider a 5 series on the basis of the drive yesterday.
ExPat2B said:
The traction control, was very very intrusive and one of worst systems I have encountered. Perhaps this is unfair as this car was not optioned with the DTC or variable steering or Sports +, but the standard car's electronics are very poor indeed, amd I almost suspect BMW have deliberately done this in order to sell upgrades.
How hard were you driving the car to be triggering the traction control like that?I've got the Efficient Dynamics tax special version.
Ride is good on mine. 205/60 profile non runflats are almost certainly the reason.
Handling is a curious mix. The basic balance of the car is superb, and it hides the heavy diesel engine's weight very well indeed. But it's surprisingly soft, with pronounced body roll, and an alarming lack of body control when the road surface gets demanding. I had a couple of E90s before this - just bum basic 318i and 318d, and they were much sharper handling. Slightly tauter riding, but not uncomfortably so. The F30s steering is also completely numb. It's accurate and fast, but it's like driving with local anaesthetic in your hands. I once drove over a cattle grid without so much as a vibration through the steering wheel rim.
The engine is both the car's best and worst feature. With tall gearing and gobfuls of torque, it gives the car a lovely long-legged feel. We took it down to Italy last summer and it made the journey completely effortless. It storms up to a ton with no effort whatsoever, and showed a fully laden 138 mph on the GPS in Germany. It also averaged 54 mpg for the whole trip, which is seriously impressive given this involved two Alpine passes, and a week on busy mountain roads around Lake Garda. Unfortunately, it is also horribly rough and gruff, and intrusively noisy. There's also marked turbo lag which is much more prominent than in our ancient PD130 Golf.
My biggest issue though is build, reliability and durability. It's not a quality product. I've had it a year and 30,000 miles. So far:
FEM body module failed and had to be replaced. 6 weeks driving round with wipers and Stop/Start system not working properly while the part back order was cleared. It then took the dealer 2 full days to fit and code it.
Clutch judders after a few minutes in stop/start traffic.
Plastic "aluminium" trim on centre console is marked noticeably in several places.
Intermittent indicator failure warning even though the indicator is working fine.
Intermittent headlamp levelling system failure warning.
Heater blower motor intermittently sounds like it is trying to break free of the dash.
Front suspension is starting to clonk over sharp bumps.
Intermittent engine "cough" - like a couple of brief misfires/hesitations. Similar to a coil starting to fail on a petrol engine. Happens maybe once every 1,000 miles or so. Has done it from new. Nobody seems able to fix.
Poor quality paint with noticeable orange peel effect. Also marks ridiculously easy.
I could accept this if the car had been abused, but I have treated it as if it were my own. It gets used as a family hack, so there are 8 and 6 year old kids clambering in and out, but a near £30,000 saloon car should be able to cope with that.
It's still cheaper on BIK than anything else in the list so I don't regret choosing it, but if I'd spent this money out of my own pocket, I would be incredibly disappointed.
Ride is good on mine. 205/60 profile non runflats are almost certainly the reason.
Handling is a curious mix. The basic balance of the car is superb, and it hides the heavy diesel engine's weight very well indeed. But it's surprisingly soft, with pronounced body roll, and an alarming lack of body control when the road surface gets demanding. I had a couple of E90s before this - just bum basic 318i and 318d, and they were much sharper handling. Slightly tauter riding, but not uncomfortably so. The F30s steering is also completely numb. It's accurate and fast, but it's like driving with local anaesthetic in your hands. I once drove over a cattle grid without so much as a vibration through the steering wheel rim.
The engine is both the car's best and worst feature. With tall gearing and gobfuls of torque, it gives the car a lovely long-legged feel. We took it down to Italy last summer and it made the journey completely effortless. It storms up to a ton with no effort whatsoever, and showed a fully laden 138 mph on the GPS in Germany. It also averaged 54 mpg for the whole trip, which is seriously impressive given this involved two Alpine passes, and a week on busy mountain roads around Lake Garda. Unfortunately, it is also horribly rough and gruff, and intrusively noisy. There's also marked turbo lag which is much more prominent than in our ancient PD130 Golf.
My biggest issue though is build, reliability and durability. It's not a quality product. I've had it a year and 30,000 miles. So far:
FEM body module failed and had to be replaced. 6 weeks driving round with wipers and Stop/Start system not working properly while the part back order was cleared. It then took the dealer 2 full days to fit and code it.
Clutch judders after a few minutes in stop/start traffic.
Plastic "aluminium" trim on centre console is marked noticeably in several places.
Intermittent indicator failure warning even though the indicator is working fine.
Intermittent headlamp levelling system failure warning.
Heater blower motor intermittently sounds like it is trying to break free of the dash.
Front suspension is starting to clonk over sharp bumps.
Intermittent engine "cough" - like a couple of brief misfires/hesitations. Similar to a coil starting to fail on a petrol engine. Happens maybe once every 1,000 miles or so. Has done it from new. Nobody seems able to fix.
Poor quality paint with noticeable orange peel effect. Also marks ridiculously easy.
I could accept this if the car had been abused, but I have treated it as if it were my own. It gets used as a family hack, so there are 8 and 6 year old kids clambering in and out, but a near £30,000 saloon car should be able to cope with that.
It's still cheaper on BIK than anything else in the list so I don't regret choosing it, but if I'd spent this money out of my own pocket, I would be incredibly disappointed.
I had similar thoughts on a ride in an E88 1-series Coupé. It was a 118d, and your thoughts about the ride, engine and handling are all spot-on for that as well.
Ride too harsh and fidgety, engine very agricultural, handling very disappointing. That wasn't even an M-sport with huge wheels either!
Ride too harsh and fidgety, engine very agricultural, handling very disappointing. That wasn't even an M-sport with huge wheels either!
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