How much money is there to be made in music?

[extraT]

While watching Rage Against The Machine live in London 2010, the band presented a cheque to the two people who started a facebook page to get them to the xmas number one in 2009. The band said thez have put together all the profits from the downloads in that year and all the proceeds from the gig "In one big cheque" to a charity. The amount was §163,000.

To me that seems like a rather small amount considering the song in question was downloaded millions of times? So how exactly are these things calculated (the profits I mean)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IjvklKa1mOU (37mins for the cheque presentation)

[rehab71]

extraT said:

While watching Rage Against The Machine live in London 2010, the band presented a cheque to the two people who started a facebook page to get them to the xmas number one in 2009. The band said thez have put together all the profits from the downloads in that year and all the proceeds from the gig "In one big cheque" to a charity. The amount was §163,000.

To me that seems like a rather small amount considering the song in question was downloaded millions of times? So how exactly are these things calculated (the profits I mean)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IjvklKa1mOU (37mins for the cheque presentation)

Well, they quote circa 520,000 downloads before they play KITN, at £0.69 a download that's £358,800 revenue, once Apple, record label etc have had their bit it must leave about £160,000 which would normally go to the band I guess.

[Tom_C76]

Apple take 30% to start with! them the label get a share too. Normally a figure less than 5p is quoted for the band on each download.

[Kinky]

Don't forget publisher rights are hived off too

[GetCarter]

Most of us in the music biz don't use facebook (or indeed pop music) to earn money!

[DanoS4]

If you want to make money in the music business:

DON'T get into dance music! too many people think they're good at it, and too many sycophants agree.
DON'T run a recording studio - quickest way to turn £1m into £1k

Digital downloads are becoming more profitable, and there's still good money to be made in GOOD music, regardless of genre in all fairness.

Certainly keeps me in a good position

Dan

[extraT]

Interesting stuff... for the record I do not want to get in to the musicbiz, I can't play to save my life.... I am more interested in the economics and mechanisms of it..../geek

[GetCarter]

extraT said:

Interesting stuff... for the record I do not want to get in to the musicbiz, I can't play to save my life.... I am more interested in the economics and mechanisms of it..../geek

Well just to give you an idea, a mate of mine recently got £235,000 in royalties for 6 months usage, from one piece of music he had written - that he had no idea had earned him any money.

Such are the vagaries of royalties.

I never know how much I will earn. I find out when the money arrives. It's a quarterly lottery that my accountant finds hard to understand. And my bank manager thinks is a work of fiction.

[DanoS4]

LOL!!

Gotta love royalty cheques. A total lottery. I used to try and guess based on sales, but was always SO far out, I gave up

[anonymous-user]

You can't beat the utter randomness of royalties. Nothing better that getting a decent wedge for an old, forgotten library track... Recently picked up a couple of grand for a track I can't even remember recording. I checked it - it's me playing for sure - no recollection of it whatsoever.

[anonymous-user]

It's terrifying really. When you suddenly get a weak payment. You just know the next few months ain't going to be any fun...

[extraT]

Am I correct when I say royalties are collected by Fergal Sharky's mob? Surely there is a scale or someway of being able to calculate or guesstimate the dosh??!!

[GnuBee]

This was an interesting insight into various parts of the music industry including the business side of it. It covers a whole range of stuff including rights including details on how distributors like Apple get their share. Well worth the money...

http://www.amazon.co.uk/How-Music-Works-ebook/dp/B...

[GetCarter]

extraT said:

Surely there is a scale or someway of being able to calculate or guesstimate the dosh??!!

None, unfortunately. If I write a bit of music and it's used on a TV soap, unless I happen to have watched said soap, the first I know about it is when I get either a statement from those who co-own the copyright (I work for Warner Bros and Universal - who pay for all the recordings & market my stuff, in return for 50% of any takings) or a PRS royalty statement (many months later). If then Sky repeats the soap in another 50 countries, again - I only know when the cash arrives.

[Hub]

I've often wondered about this sort of thing. So if you have a short background clip, in say an episode Top Gear for example, what could you expect to get?

I find it odd that you wouldn't know what is used where and how much it gets you - don't you get asked?

I don't know what level bands need to be at these days before they can give up the day job - albums don't sell well, and you have to pay to get yourself on tours these days! I don't know how much radio play gets you either.

[mu0n]

This bloke lives near me and is doing very well.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ed_Drewett

A bit of a by all accounts. But I guess that's what money does to some people.

[GetCarter]

Hub said:

I've often wondered about this sort of thing. So if you have a short background clip, in say an episode Top Gear for example, what could you expect to get?

I find it odd that you wouldn't know what is used where and how much it gets you - don't you get asked?

I don't know what level bands need to be at these days before they can give up the day job - albums don't sell well, and you have to pay to get yourself on tours these days! I don't know how much radio play gets you either.

How much you earn is calculated by how many people are assumed to be watching. So if I get coast to coast USA we are talking many hundreds of pounds - whereas a late night prog in Tasmania would be about 10p.

I write music specifically for TV and film use, and give it away free of charge in HOPE it'll get used (so I get paid!).. so I'm never asked.

Each bit of music I have published and is used in any sort of broadcast is logged by PRS, and every three months they calculate how much I'm to be paid.

I was in lots of bands earlier in my life (some successful) but I saw that there was likely to be little money in it long term, so got out and started writing.

[NDA]

A family member had a top ten hit in the uk in the 1980's, he write the song and fronted the band. He still collects about £12k a year net from this song - from radio plays worldwide etc.

The paperwork from EMI is exhaustive, dozens of pages.

[V8A*ndy]

Talking of the PRS.

I used to run a rather well known music venue and I had a very well known covers band playing.

I got this call from the PRS saying they were sending people out to monitor the gig.

Thought it was odd as the venue paid a rather hefty bill to PRS and PPL every year but they came out and asked the band what covers they played made a note of that then stayed at the gig and had a few beers.


Never had anything like it in the 20 odd years I was there. I still don't understand how they work out royalties from that.

[Justin Cyder]

The reality for 99% of us is music is about throwing a £5k guitar into a £2k car and driving 50 miles to play a £30 gig. And I love it.