Monday 14th October 2013

Ford Fiesta ST: PH Carpool

Still need convincing about the Fiesta ST? Hear it from a PHer who's just bought one

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Name: Nick Beards
Car: Fiesta ST2
Owned since: June 2013
Previously owned: Renault Clio 1.2, Citroen Saxo VTR

Bought on sight without even a test drive

Why I bought it:
"I'd wanted a hot hatch of some description for a while now and had been looking secondhand at Clio 197s and the Focus ST. Finally I found myself in a position to replace my aging Saxo and after poring over classifieds I popped to my local Ford dealer to speak about a secondhand Focus but found nothing that took my fancy. Around a week later they called and told me they had available the first two Fiesta STs in Spain; that same day I headed down there and bought one without ever having seen or driven it."

What I wish I'd known:
"I'd had plenty of time researching this type of car so knew the questions I had to ask and things I had to look for when buying secondhand. All that went out the window when it came to buying this car! I just wanted it, the exclusivity appealed to me and mine was the second registered in Spain. I broke every rule in the book - I didn't haggle on price and Ford didn't even fill the tank for me. I bought with my heart not my head - I know better but for some reason at the time it just didn't matter!"

Nick's ST one of the first delivered to Spain

Things I love:
"I had to wait a few weeks as my car, along with its sister, was in Barcelona then off to Madrid doing launch events for the ST so I read every article available to see what id got myself in for. I was not let down - the car is a dream and the reviews are spot on. After coming from an abused, slightly neglected 12 year-old Saxo it was always going to feel special to me but the smell of a new car and knowing that nobody else had even driven it was the icing on a very big cake for me.

"It's pin-point accurate and devastatingly effective in third and fourth over a proper road; speed accumulates very fast indeed and the half leather Recaros are sublime."

Things I hate:
"It's not a van! I'm a keen mountain biker as well as loving my cars and travel Spain racing. Most of the time I have access to a van or pick-up truck but when I don't squeezing your bike, spares and camping equipment in a Fiesta can be ... well ... it doesn't fit. But for me it's a small price to pay for the smile it puts on my face."

Brake bedding in process got a bit scary

Costs:
"Apart from the above mentioned lack of haggling on list price I've only owned it for a few months so as of yet it's cost me nothing. I have five years Ford warranty so I'm hoping that should keep me out of trouble. I'm 26 and insurance in Spain is reasonable and it's cost me 600 euros fully comp for the year and anybody with a valid licence is also insured to drive. Not that I'll let them!"

Where I've been:
"Track days here are few, far between and expensive but the back roads are epic and there's plenty to choose from. Only last week I was returning home from a race but had left my bike and camping gear with a friend. I took full advantage, hopped on a back road from Alcoy to Castell de Castells and enjoyed nearly 50km of 'spirited driving' without once coming across another car. I've no plans for any track days as such but would love to plan a road trip to the Nordschleife just to experience what has become a Mecca for car enthusiasts."

Straight to the driver's seat without even haggling

What next?
"That very same drive from Alcoy showed the only real flaw I've come across to date - BRAKES! Power is not a problem but they faded after around 30km but with very little warning and had me heading for an escape route just before a tight 90 left across a bridge. Some better pads and some Castrol SRF1 brake fluid should do the trick. Other than that possibly the Mountune power upgrade but I'm not sure how that sits with the warranty here in Spain and I'm still a bit of a boy racer at heart so maybe a noisy exhaust."

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[graeme4130]

Cool, and a roof rack will always sort that mountainbike issue

[ExPat2B]

I am pleased the guy likes his car, but how can this pretend to be at all objective, he admits he did no test drives of comparable cars, and his comparision point is a Saxo.

[timothymcn]

ExPat2B said:

I am pleased the guy likes his car, but how can this pretend to be at all objective, he admits he did no test drives of comparable cars, and his comparison point is a Saxo.

Where's the claim of objectivity? If anything this story is about how car ownership isn't objective. Sometimes you do your research and plan everything out, but when you get there you forget what you came for, you forget to haggle and you just buy the car you want cos you want it. That's the wonderful thing about cars; they're an emotional product, and we get attached to them for completely subjective reasons.

[framerateuk]

I can't say I'd ever buy a car within so much as a hint of a test drive, but each to their own! Sounds like it was always going to be better than what came before it.

The brakes were rubbish on the last Fiesta ST too. It was quite popular to replace them with MK3 Mondeo brakes on the front and ST170 rears (or go the whole hog and get APs/Brembos). I doubt such an easy swap is available anymore, but I'm sure plenty of Ford tuners will have parts available soon.

[MikeyBoy2000]

I've just bought one coming from a Mountune'd Focus 56 plate ST3 (that I also owned from new). Point to point I would say that the Fiesta would give it a good run for its money - turn in and grip are superb and that give a whole heap of confidence, whereas the Focus always seemed a bit nose heavy. Once mine is run in, its off to Mountune for them to work their magic. The level of equipment is REALLY impressive for the price and knocks spots off my (admittedly first generation) Focus. Seats are a step up against the Focus recaros and I know this isn't very PH, but 40mpg is nice after the 25 or less in the Focus...

Bad points? The steering feels a little dead around the straight ahead and electric steering seems to do odd things after years of hydraulic systems, like inconsistent weighting as corner forces load up, WAY too light at parking speeds which is a touch alien after the 'steering weight' at even moderate speed - I am sure this just a case of recalibrating my brain to suit! Surely there's opportunities in the future for the tuning industry to remap electric steering systems... The engine noise is just OK, but after a 5 cylinder, any less cylinders is always going to be bad...

And the lights are rubbish - it really needed Bi-xenons - I am sure the bean counters had to have their say somewhere or the car's architecture doesn't support it without a lot of R&D spend..

All in all though, loving it - then again, I have always been a sucker for fast Fords...

[PtheP]

I bought my Alfa GT without seeing it and relying on a test drive and inspection by my 24 year old son ... a leap of faith but he works on model development for a major manufacturer so at least knows a decent paint job.

The Fiesta looks decent enough but i think is let down by those wheels - they look like something you could pick up cheap at Halfords

[moskvich427]

"I'm 26 and insurance in Spain is reasonable and it's cost me 600 euros fully comp for the year and anybody with a valid licence is also insured to drive."


That's it, I'm moving to Spain...

[Coldfuse]

I now have to add another Blue to the (small) list of acceptable Blues a car can come in!

Very nice car that!

[menoy]

OP said:

"I had to wait a few weeks as my car, along with its sister, was in Barcelona then off to Madrid doing launch events for the ST

(...)

and knowing that nobody else had even driven it was the icing on a very big cake for me

Hmm...


Also, always managed to fit my MTB in a Seicento - would have thought would be no problem with folded seats in a 10yrs older (i.e. larger) car.

[LukeR94]

moskvich427 said:

"I'm 26 and insurance in Spain is reasonable and it's cost me 600 euros fully comp for the year and anybody with a valid licence is also insured to drive."


That's it, I'm moving to Spain...

Ill be on your plane, Im off to test drive his ST

[exceed]

I believe you can get insurance packages like that here in the colonies too? Will try to dig something up!

[QuattroDave]

framerateuk said:

I can't say I'd ever buy a car within so much as a hint of a test drive.....

That's my sentiments exactly, however when I asked for a test drive in the fiesta st at my local ford dealer in Southampton city centre my request was greeted with an unparalleled level of contempt from the salesman "We expect over half of our ST's to sell without a test drive or the customer even seeing one so we're not expecting to have any to test for months. We'll contact you when we have one"

That was about six months ago and despite having my details on their system they've not called and I've kept my money. That's put me off that dealer completely.

[anonymous-user]

I hate to seem like an internet critic, but this article is completely pointless. A guy who had a beaten up old Saxo buys a Fiesta ST and, with absolutely no baseline for reference except for his own Saxo, he thinks it's great. The opinion of a paperclip sales rep on his latest VAG diesel st box would be more informative, as he does at least have the last 16 diesel stboxes to compare it to.

[alangla]

QuattroDave said:

That's my sentiments exactly, however when I asked for a test drive in the fiesta st at my local ford dealer in Southampton city centre my request was greeted with an unparalleled level of contempt from the salesman "We expect over half of our ST's to sell without a test drive or the customer even seeing one so we're not expecting to have any to test for months. We'll contact you when we have one"

That was about six months ago and despite having my details on their system they've not called and I've kept my money. That's put me off that dealer completely.

I went round 3 dealers when I was ordering mine. First one had one they appeared to use as the garage taxi, but wouldn't let me drive it. Treated like a total tyre kicker.
Second one, the sales manager swore blind I'd never get a test drive because they attract all sorts of test pilots, followed by a lengthy story about a Kuga getting wrecked on a track test. As above, still not had a call to say they've got one for me to test.
Third one couldn't have been nicer. Gave me a test drive as soon as they had one available. Ordered it from them & picked it up on Friday night, 600 miles covered over the weekend!

A funny postscript was the first one phoning back just after I'd ordered from the third (about 3-4 weeks passed in the interim). He was a bit surprised when he found out that not only was I a serious buyer but had already ordered. "So I guess if we'd been quicker we'd have had a chance of getting your business"

[MadDog1962]

exceed said:

I believe you can get insurance packages like that here in the colonies too? Will try to dig something up!

I'd read the small print on the policy if I were you. For example here in the USA it seems you can insure almost anything for about £600 a year. But then you find that there are rather low claim limits, and "Comprehensive" doesn't necessarily mean the same thing as it does in the UK. If you run into somebody else's car they might be covered only up to a surprisingly low amount, and your car might not be covered at all if it's your fault as over here comprehensive doesn't mean the same thing as it does in the UK.

I like the look of these new Fiestas. The comment about the brake fade made me think back to the scary experience I had in 1988 thrashing a Sierra 1.6L along the A66....

[MikeGoodwin]

moskvich427 said:

"I'm 26 and insurance in Spain is reasonable and it's cost me 600 euros fully comp for the year and anybody with a valid licence is also insured to drive."


That's it, I'm moving to Spain...

Im 24 and this thing would cost me £500 with my GF on the policy!

[300bhp/ton]

Big fan of the PH carpool. Not really a fan of the Fiesta. For me it's the sort of car a person buys when they want to make others think they are a car person when they actually aren't.

As a company car or a beater (when the used price plummets) I can see the logic, if not the passion. But buying with your own money I just don't understand. Sure it was new and shiny, but so is a new Hotpoint dishwasher from Currys. And sadly this is how I view cars like this. Just a wasted opportunity to actually own something interesting.

Edited by 300bhp/ton on Monday 14th October 11:10

[framerateuk]

300bhp/ton said:

Big fan of the PH carpool. Not really a fan of the Fiesta. For me it's the sort of car a person buys when they want to make others think they are a car person when they actually aren't.

As a company car or a beater (when the used price plummets) I can see the logic, if not the passion. But buying with your own money I just don't understand. Sure it was new and shiny, but so is a new Hotpoint dishwasher from Currys. And sadly this is how I view cars like this. Just a wasted opportunity to actually own something interesting.

Edited by 300bhp/ton on Monday 14th October 11:10

Interesting doesn't go side by side with "reliable" and "trouble free" and "economical" though. Something many people will want for their daily driver. I'd love a TVR, but there's no way that would fit in with my garage at the moment. I have my toy (Caterham), and I have my daily (Megane 250). There's no way you could put a TVR or something more interesting in place of the Megane as I want something that works every time I start it. I can live with the Caterham having problems, my normal car however, needs to work.

(I'm not saying TVR's are unreliable, you could replace the word TVR with any slightly older sports car of your choice, the same applies).

[dave7692]

Had a serious look at one of these prior to going for the golf. If it drives as well as my previous Zetec S did with a bit more power then it must be a fantastic car.
I think in a couple of years when I'm bored of the golf I might try to pick up one of these.

[300bhp/ton]

framerateuk said:

Interesting doesn't go side by side with "reliable" and "trouble free" and "economical" though though.

Well it can do.

Buying new doesn't mean it'll be reliable, although many hope it will. But the main difference is should something go wrong, then you are less likely to need to pay for it.

Trouble - well, as many new cars do suffer problems and especially new models (there are often recalls). You might not be troubled to open your wallet, but you may well end up revisiting the dealership more often than you hoped. This won't always be the case, but it's not a guarantee that you won't.

Economical is such a misleading term. 1 there are plenty of fuel efficient interesting cars. But for me economy comes down to the larger costs of running and owning a vehicle. If you have the cash to buy outright, then you could have bought something else. If you are buying on finance, then you are paying a large amount of money a month, which you could obviously be spending on fuel on a cheaper, used more interesting vehicle.

Not too mention that rather huge cost of depreciation. I have no idea what the ST actually cost or will be worth. But lets be optimistic that it loses £5000 in 3 years. This means it's costing you nearly £140 a month in depreciation or lost money. On top of that you may well have your finance to pay also. Which overall means it is an expensive commodity to actually own on a monthly basis, if 'economy' is really a prime concern.

framerateuk said:

Something many people will want for their daily driver. I'd love a TVR, but there's no way that would fit in with my garage at the moment. I have my toy (Caterham), and I have my daily (Megane 250). There's no way you could put a TVR or something more interesting in place of the Megane as I want something that works every time I start it. I can live with the Caterham having problems, my normal car however, needs to work.

From the sounds of it, your situation is rather different, if you already have a Caterham.

framerateuk said:

(I'm not saying TVR's are unreliable, you could replace the word TVR with any slightly older sports car of your choice, the same applies).

Maybe, but then I have daily driven a classic Triumph for 60,000 miles and currently daily drive a lightweight sports car for 80 miles a day.


Anyhow, I don't hate the Fiesta ST as a car. Just for the money there are so many wonderful interesting cars available, that it pales by comparison. The fact it'll bleed money on a daily basis is not really an enduring quality either.