Should I have a guilty conscience?
Discussion
Was late to a meeting the other day so stepped on it in the V70, on a motorway, perfect sight, in admittedly damp conditions, with cruise control set to 160 EuroLeptons. The Volvo doesn't even break sweat at that speed and your driver was completely on the ball.
In Lane 2 approaching a Mk IV facelift Fiesta behind an artic in Lane 1. Estimated speed of the Ford is about 140 EuroLeptons, which I don't even really like doing in a brand new 208 never mind a 13-odd-year-old Fiesta. Young lady driver behind the wheel.
I can see what's about to happen - Fiesta is going to cut me up to go into L2 to overtake the artic, so I've already dabbed the brakes to switch off cruise and engine brake down to below her speed. I'm guessing she didn't check her mirrors, sadly I guessed right.
I'm still closing albeit not at enough speed to get close, I've given her room to complete the manoeuvre safely. What happens next wasn't in the script - she panics after checking her mirror and hits the anchors almightily. With that I pass and come up side-by-side with the Fiesta, still only engine braking (it's an auto so it's VERY leisurely at scrubbing off speed). The screech and lock-up of the brakes of the Fiesta alerts me something is going to go seriously awry here, so I'm braking (medium-hard, not emergency stopping, I didn't need to) and the poor lass careers across L1 and L2, hits the central reservation before coming to a stop pointing towards the hard shoulder in L2. I've managed to slow myself down and remain in control completely and had to watch all this playing out in front of me. I protect her car from being T-boned by approaching traffic leaving myself between L1 and L2 with hazards on about 30-40 metres behind. Rather they slam into an V70 from behind than a Fiesta with what I think has very little side impact protection. Yes, I know that I didn't leave enough space in front ideally, but where I came to a stop is where I came to a stop. Luckily Fiesta girl gets the motor moving, pissing out coolant all over the shop, and onto the hard shoulder. I avoid the debris as best I can and stop 30m in front. By now traffic is slowing, thankfully. The artic in question drove straight on.
That's the first time I've had to experience someone losing it right in front of me. The question is, speed aside (yes, I was wilfully breaking the law and prepared to accept the consequences should I have been stopped - then again I'm the guy that does a rigid 30 mph in a 30), why do I feel like I'm responsible for just being there? My car was not involved, technically, but were it not for me cruising in lane 2 preparing to overtake both Fiesta and artic it might not have happened. Or am I being naive and it was just an accident waiting to happen?
Lessons learned: actually, the Mk IV Fiesta stands up far better to a frontal impact than I thought. Driver walked away, the airbag wasn't even activated, but the front end and pretty much with that the whole car was a write-off. Think twice about what you think is a safe speed, it might be for you and your vehicle, but not for your fellow road users.
So tell me I was just in the wrong place with the right reactions at the wrong time.
In Lane 2 approaching a Mk IV facelift Fiesta behind an artic in Lane 1. Estimated speed of the Ford is about 140 EuroLeptons, which I don't even really like doing in a brand new 208 never mind a 13-odd-year-old Fiesta. Young lady driver behind the wheel.
I can see what's about to happen - Fiesta is going to cut me up to go into L2 to overtake the artic, so I've already dabbed the brakes to switch off cruise and engine brake down to below her speed. I'm guessing she didn't check her mirrors, sadly I guessed right.
I'm still closing albeit not at enough speed to get close, I've given her room to complete the manoeuvre safely. What happens next wasn't in the script - she panics after checking her mirror and hits the anchors almightily. With that I pass and come up side-by-side with the Fiesta, still only engine braking (it's an auto so it's VERY leisurely at scrubbing off speed). The screech and lock-up of the brakes of the Fiesta alerts me something is going to go seriously awry here, so I'm braking (medium-hard, not emergency stopping, I didn't need to) and the poor lass careers across L1 and L2, hits the central reservation before coming to a stop pointing towards the hard shoulder in L2. I've managed to slow myself down and remain in control completely and had to watch all this playing out in front of me. I protect her car from being T-boned by approaching traffic leaving myself between L1 and L2 with hazards on about 30-40 metres behind. Rather they slam into an V70 from behind than a Fiesta with what I think has very little side impact protection. Yes, I know that I didn't leave enough space in front ideally, but where I came to a stop is where I came to a stop. Luckily Fiesta girl gets the motor moving, pissing out coolant all over the shop, and onto the hard shoulder. I avoid the debris as best I can and stop 30m in front. By now traffic is slowing, thankfully. The artic in question drove straight on.
That's the first time I've had to experience someone losing it right in front of me. The question is, speed aside (yes, I was wilfully breaking the law and prepared to accept the consequences should I have been stopped - then again I'm the guy that does a rigid 30 mph in a 30), why do I feel like I'm responsible for just being there? My car was not involved, technically, but were it not for me cruising in lane 2 preparing to overtake both Fiesta and artic it might not have happened. Or am I being naive and it was just an accident waiting to happen?
Lessons learned: actually, the Mk IV Fiesta stands up far better to a frontal impact than I thought. Driver walked away, the airbag wasn't even activated, but the front end and pretty much with that the whole car was a write-off. Think twice about what you think is a safe speed, it might be for you and your vehicle, but not for your fellow road users.
So tell me I was just in the wrong place with the right reactions at the wrong time.
She didn't check her mirrors until too late to complete her manouvre, and had no awareness of what was going on around her. Not to mention that she slammed her brakes on (from what I can tell, unnecessarily) and couldn't control the result.
Just out of interest, why not go into L3 and give her a lane to herself?
Otherwise, if everything happened as written, I wouldn't worry about it. You at least had the awareness to predict the traffic, and act accordingly. And you gave her safety, after the fact.
Just out of interest, why not go into L3 and give her a lane to herself?
Otherwise, if everything happened as written, I wouldn't worry about it. You at least had the awareness to predict the traffic, and act accordingly. And you gave her safety, after the fact.
Only person to run out of talent was the girl in the Fiesta, completely of her own doing. You did all you could do, and certainly more than some people would do in stopping and blocking the traffic to go and help her. Feel good about being a good citizen not bad about something you had no control of.
lightthefuse said:
Should have mentioned, 2-lane motorway.
Thought so 
Really wouldn't worry mate. You were partly involved in a wreckage of an event, it'd be difficult not to analyse how you feel about your actions; you'd have to be of a certain type of mentality to not to, really.
Any police involvement?
I guess it depends a bit on whether she didn't check her mirrors (all her fault), or whether she checked, saw you, but assumed you'd be doing 70 or 80 in the slightly damp conditions on a 2 lane road, and was caught out by the approach speed.
Either way nobody was hurt, so it could have been MUCH worse. Try to focus on that instead.
Either way nobody was hurt, so it could have been MUCH worse. Try to focus on that instead.
scdan4 said:
I'm inclined to think that it was a situation of her own making, but am very intrigued as to what she said to you? (You stopped, I assume you went and had a chat to offer help / see if she was ok)
Indeed, I did pretty much as you described - a "you alright, do you need me to call anyone?" to which the reply was her jumping out of the car saying "I'm OK, I'm OK. No, you don't need to call anyone" (i.e. 'please don't call anyone', make of that what you will, I'm an East End boy so keeping schtum is something I know how to do no matter the rights and wrongs of it, I would also have had just cause to be late so wasn't worried about time either after the event) and then a couple of lads she appeared to know stopping afterwards. She was genuinely OK, shook up of course but that's probably the shock - at least that was my reaction when spinning a Sierra on the motorway and just missing the central ressie.
Does your Volvo have DRLs? I don't flash before overtaking, but if you had she may have completely misread the point you were trying to make.
Why did she slam on the brakes?
Those two lane M-ways aren't nice, it's worse when someone starts moving over not realising that you're beside them on their OS coming past.
Why did she slam on the brakes?
Those two lane M-ways aren't nice, it's worse when someone starts moving over not realising that you're beside them on their OS coming past.
carinaman said:
Does your Volvo have DRLs? I don't flash before overtaking, but if you had she may have completely misread the point you were trying to make.
Why did she slam on the brakes?
Those two lane M-ways aren't nice, it's worse when someone starts moving over not realising that you're beside them on their OS coming past.
1) No DRLs, permanent headlights. No flash on my part, I was staying in lane.Why did she slam on the brakes?
Those two lane M-ways aren't nice, it's worse when someone starts moving over not realising that you're beside them on their OS coming past.
2) Search me! She could have made it had she committed. I was already slowing down to give her room.
3) Been there done that (behind an artic in L1 then being dozy with the blind spot going for the overtake). Have sharpened up my driving technique instead by not going up the arse of artics maintaining speed at any cost, preferring to come off the accelerator/click off cruise well beforehand.
I think you did an amazing job. A big pat on the back for you for your observation, your reading of the situation, the speed at which you reacted to the hazard, and the fast thinking, decisive behaviour in positioning your car so as to protect her in her moment of need. You then offered reassurance, and further offered to help by making contact with help on her behalf.
Above and beyond all of the amazing stuff, we then find out that you are 'good at keeping schtum' because you are from the east end.
Jesus wept.
Above and beyond all of the amazing stuff, we then find out that you are 'good at keeping schtum' because you are from the east end.
Jesus wept.
carinaman said:
Did it impact on your meeting? Or you could just park this incident and deal with the business in hand? I'm partially asking as I've made a couple of bad mistakes driving this year where my mind was not perhaps as focussed as it could have been with regard to driving. 
The mind did wander for the rest of the journey (about another 50 miles), but not enough to affect my observation, I wasn't pressing on though since the road class is non-motorway and I'd already made up my time on the M-way, even including stopping. Parked it at the back of my head - thought about at lunch and in the car on the way home though, even making a point of looking across the carriageway where the impact point was on my way home. You don't need to ask if I was double-defensive driving though the rest of the day.I would say if you can't focus on the job in hand, don't get behind the wheel but I know it's easier said than done. I'm the kind of driver that analyses my every move though, bad or good, since I enjoy the mechanics of driving no matter if I'm driving a wheezebox or Ferrari.
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