Reducing visibility
Discussion
Recently I have noticed that the council had dumped large mounds of earth on the central reservation at the approach to a couple of roundabouts in the area.
The local rag has said that these are to reduce visibility for drivers approaching the roundabout, as there have been a few accidents where drivers approaching the entrance to a roundabout have run into the back of cars that they expected to carry on around the roundabout but stopped instead.
I thought that driving was all about observation. So how is reducing the information available to a driver supposed to make driving safer?
The local rag has said that these are to reduce visibility for drivers approaching the roundabout, as there have been a few accidents where drivers approaching the entrance to a roundabout have run into the back of cars that they expected to carry on around the roundabout but stopped instead.
I thought that driving was all about observation. So how is reducing the information available to a driver supposed to make driving safer?
Are you talking about the Rhuddlan - St. Asaph dual carriageway ?
Another road 'safety' idea is to build up the height of roundabouts so approaching motorists cannot see others approaching at the other junctions.
Madness - these d
heads really think they are improving safety by interrupting the smooth flow of traffic, forcing vehicles to stop at every junction. What's the betting that the brainwave is to change all "give way" signs to "stop" ? 
Another road 'safety' idea is to build up the height of roundabouts so approaching motorists cannot see others approaching at the other junctions.
Madness - these d
heads really think they are improving safety by interrupting the smooth flow of traffic, forcing vehicles to stop at every junction. What's the betting that the brainwave is to change all "give way" signs to "stop" ? 
This is getting all too common.
Instead of promoting good road layout and driver education, lets just bugger up the roads and force everybody to stop-start everywhere in the mistaken nelief that it will (a) reduce accidents and (b) persuade us on to public transport (I assume!)
The roundabout under the M25 at junction 6 (A22) is a good example. Approaching from the direction of Caterham, the A22 is a dual carriageway down a fairly steep hill.
There used to be lots of lovely visibility of the roundabout (which is light-controlled anyway) and there are 100s of yards of painted rumble lines to remind the dosiest that the roundabout is approaching.
So what do they do? Erect a massive fence in the central reservation so that you can't see what's coming. Brilliant "solution" (to what problem, excactly?). Not.
So now, the 70mph traffic heading doen hill has to scrub it all off down to 0mph whether the lights are on green or red. How long before a pile-up ensues when the following traffic assumes that cars in front will just go on a green?
Feckwits.
Instead of promoting good road layout and driver education, lets just bugger up the roads and force everybody to stop-start everywhere in the mistaken nelief that it will (a) reduce accidents and (b) persuade us on to public transport (I assume!)
The roundabout under the M25 at junction 6 (A22) is a good example. Approaching from the direction of Caterham, the A22 is a dual carriageway down a fairly steep hill.
There used to be lots of lovely visibility of the roundabout (which is light-controlled anyway) and there are 100s of yards of painted rumble lines to remind the dosiest that the roundabout is approaching.
So what do they do? Erect a massive fence in the central reservation so that you can't see what's coming. Brilliant "solution" (to what problem, excactly?). Not.
So now, the 70mph traffic heading doen hill has to scrub it all off down to 0mph whether the lights are on green or red. How long before a pile-up ensues when the following traffic assumes that cars in front will just go on a green?
Feckwits.
As you pointed out, there was a percieved problem with cars going up the back of each other. This might happen if there was long grass /small bushes etc that you could not see over if you were in a normal car, but could see over if you were in a lorry/van/tall car etc.
Obviously the guy in the normal car (the vast majority of us) would need to come to a stop but the guy in the tall vehicle could see the road was clear, and assumed you could too...
The solution would surely be to clear all visual hazards out of the way so we could all see, not make them even bigger so none of us could see???
Obviously the guy in the normal car (the vast majority of us) would need to come to a stop but the guy in the tall vehicle could see the road was clear, and assumed you could too...
The solution would surely be to clear all visual hazards out of the way so we could all see, not make them even bigger so none of us could see???
welsh blackbird said:
Recently I have noticed that the council had dumped large mounds of earth on the central reservation at the approach to a couple of roundabouts in the area.
The local rag has said that these are to reduce visibility for drivers approaching the roundabout, as there have been a few accidents where drivers approaching the entrance to a roundabout have run into the back of cars that they expected to carry on around the roundabout but stopped instead.
I thought that driving was all about observation. So how is reducing the information available to a driver supposed to make driving safer?
I guess you have been reading the Rhyl and Prestatyn Visitor???
lunarscope said:
Are you talking about the Rhuddlan - St. Asaph dual carriageway ?
Another road 'safety' idea is to build up the height of roundabouts so approaching motorists cannot see others approaching at the other junctions.
Madness - these d
The quote in the Visitor paper says they have already done this at the roundabout near the golf club at Rhuddlan.
"There are towers of flowers on the splitter islands which reduce visibilty, forcing motorists to slow down", said councillor Eryl Williams , cabinet member for highways.
Hey, why not make us all wear blinkers and slitty snow goggles, then our vision would really be stuffed.............SMIDSY..........
Nutters all.
Large roundabout and limited vision, should in the long run assist safety..ie people wont go flying onto the roadabout...as they'll have to slow down to see it's clear...
You see section of slip roads and dual carraigeways that have barriers in the middle for the last 200 metres to actually prevent vision...thus slowing drivers entry onto the roundabout..
You see section of slip roads and dual carraigeways that have barriers in the middle for the last 200 metres to actually prevent vision...thus slowing drivers entry onto the roundabout..
Streetcop said:
Large roundabout and limited vision, should in the long run assist safety..ie people wont go flying onto the roadabout...as they'll have to slow down to see it's clear...
You see section of slip roads and dual carraigeways that have barriers in the middle for the last 200 metres to actually prevent vision...thus slowing drivers entry onto the roundabout..
Sorry Street, that kind on negative logic simply doesn't work.
A properly trained driver will slow down to the correct speed anyway and stop if there is traffic on the roundabout.
Deliberately obstructing vision is absolute insanity, you can really never have enough vision of the road ahead.
Every day in life I see drivers who come up to a roundabout you are traversing, look you straight in the eye, and deliberately drive straight out in front of you, absolute lunatics!
That has nothing to do with speed or vision, it has to do with being a thoughtless, dangerous miscreant.
This problem has got so bad now that insurance companies have started paying out knock for knock claims on accidents that occur on roundabouts, rather than take the trouble to prove liability.
IOLAIRE said:
Large roundabout and limited vision, should in the long run assist safety..ie people wont go flying onto the roadabout...as they'll have to slow down to see it's clear...
You see section of slip roads and dual carraigeways that have barriers in the middle for the last 200 metres to actually prevent vision...thus slowing drivers entry onto the roundabout..
Sorry Street, that kind on negative logic simply doesn't work.
A properly trained driver will slow down to the correct speed anyway and stop if there is traffic on the roundabout.
And there is the proof in the pudding...a "properly trained driver".....
The standards on the roads are terrible...if not worse....there are some very good drivers about...but are in the minority....
Streetcop said:
Streetcop said:
Large roundabout and limited vision, should in the long run assist safety..ie people wont go flying onto the roadabout...as they'll have to slow down to see it's clear...
You see section of slip roads and dual carraigeways that have barriers in the middle for the last 200 metres to actually prevent vision...thus slowing drivers entry onto the roundabout..
Sorry Street, that kind on negative logic simply doesn't work.
A properly trained driver will slow down to the correct speed anyway and stop if there is traffic on the roundabout.
And there is the proof in the pudding...a "properly trained driver".....
The standards on the roads are terrible...if not worse....there are some very good drivers about...but are in the minority....
Of course they are Street, you'll get no argument from me about the standard of driving in this country.
But the proof you refer to is proof of the fact that we need to train drivers properly, not limit their visual acuity in the misguided belief that it will improve their driving standards.
Driver training, especially initial training, is the best that it's ever been. It's more stringent, it's more indepth and thorough, there's hazard perception/awareness, theory tests, limit penalty points in the first 2 years from test etc etc...
The problem is....once passed...the numpties drive how ever the hell they like....
More police are needed and Zero tolerance...to regain a bit of discipline back on the roads...
Street
The problem is....once passed...the numpties drive how ever the hell they like....
More police are needed and Zero tolerance...to regain a bit of discipline back on the roads...
Street
Streetcop said:
Driver training, especially initial training, is the best that it's ever been. It's more stringent, it's more indepth and thorough, there's hazard perception/awareness, theory tests, limit penalty points in the first 2 years from test etc etc...
The problem is....once passed...the numpties drive how ever the hell they like....
More police are needed and Zero tolerance...to regain a bit of discipline back on the roads...
Street
You know Street, if ever there was an expression guaranteed to get people's backs up it's "Zero Tolerance".
It positively reeks of precocious authority that assumes the answer to a problem is to blindly and wholeheartedly prosecute every single case of presumed wrongdoing and brutalise people into simpering compliance. It never, ever works.
Driver and social education are closely linked and both are desperately inadequate in this country, and it's not getting any better.
Mr E said:
And there is the proof in the pudding...a "properly trained driver".....
The standards on the roads are terrible...if not worse....there are some very good drivers about...but are in the minority....
Agree completely.
So why is nothing being done about it.
Because it's not vote friendly.....
Call a man's wife, his daughter, his job whatever. Critisise his driving..and.....
Not enough people bleat about driving standards. People are bothered about anti-social behaviour, car theft, criminal damage, burglary, violent crime etc etc...
That's what the government and the police chiefs look at..
Start dealing with driving standards and all you hear is;
Hitting the motorist in the pocket again. Easy targets. Thieves and rapists roaming the streets and you're dealing with me for hogging the middle lane. I'll write to my MP about this officer...etc etc 
That's why not much gets done about driving standards. Or not on a grand scale anyway
So look after your motor, polish it, service it and just pray nobody collides with it...
Streetcop said:
More police are needed and Zero tolerance...to regain a bit of discipline back on the roads...
As discussed elsewhere, "zero tolerance" needs to be applied very selectively, if at all.
The rest of that sentence I agree with, but can't quite equate it with your attitude towards f**king up the road system in order to improve "safety".
>> Edited by pdV6 on Thursday 4th November 14:08
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