Fred Whitton in sub-7 hours ?
Discussion
I posted this on another forum but didn't get many replies, so here goes.
If I get a place next year I would like to aim for sub 7 hours. I did it in 7:51 this year, so this may be nigh on impossible, but I like having something to aim for!
My training this year consisted of a progressively longer weekend ride (mostly solo rides), getting up to around 80 miles a couple of weeks before the Fred. My weekend rides were always hilly, although not quite up to the Fred's ascent per mile. I did 2 or sometimes 3 mid-week turbo sessions, pretty much always the 2x20 format. I started this training in February and continued up until the event.
I'd be interested to hear from people who've gone sub-7 hours and hear what kind of training you did and what your background was. I've only been riding my road bike for 2 years so didn't have a hugely strong base to begin from.
I admit the weather was pretty horrid this year and with better weather I could have maybe got round in 7:30, but I'd like to be able to go sub 7 regardless of conditions.
I think maybe joining a local club and getting out of my comfort zone with a fast group may be required. No pain, no gain!
If I get a place next year I would like to aim for sub 7 hours. I did it in 7:51 this year, so this may be nigh on impossible, but I like having something to aim for!
My training this year consisted of a progressively longer weekend ride (mostly solo rides), getting up to around 80 miles a couple of weeks before the Fred. My weekend rides were always hilly, although not quite up to the Fred's ascent per mile. I did 2 or sometimes 3 mid-week turbo sessions, pretty much always the 2x20 format. I started this training in February and continued up until the event.
I'd be interested to hear from people who've gone sub-7 hours and hear what kind of training you did and what your background was. I've only been riding my road bike for 2 years so didn't have a hugely strong base to begin from.
I admit the weather was pretty horrid this year and with better weather I could have maybe got round in 7:30, but I'd like to be able to go sub 7 regardless of conditions.
I think maybe joining a local club and getting out of my comfort zone with a fast group may be required. No pain, no gain!
1403 riders finished the 2012 event and only 77 were sub 7 hours... From what I gather most people who suffer have either got their feeding totally wrong or just plain under-estimated the hills. Honister after 50 odd miles must be hellish but Hardknott and Wrynose pass after 80 odd is just evil!
112 miles in 7 hours over that terrain is a great effort but rather than fast chain gang training, you will need to map some routes that feature some good long climbs 80 odd miles into the ride and replicate the route.
Good luck....
112 miles in 7 hours over that terrain is a great effort but rather than fast chain gang training, you will need to map some routes that feature some good long climbs 80 odd miles into the ride and replicate the route.
Good luck....
Hardknott is actually around the 95 mile point - ridiculously hard. I managed to ride it all but even with 34-27 I was chewing the handlebars and probably doing 30rpm on the steep bits!
I just checked my Strava and it says moving time of 7:20, so I stopped for 30 minutes. I only stopped at the two feed stops - the first one for about 10 minutes to fill my bottles and scoff some food, but the second was about 20 minutes - I'd left my jacket off crossing Cold Fell and was soaked and chilled to bone. I stood shivering in the hall while drinking a coffee, but I was actually getting colder just standing around, so I decided to head off. Once I was pedalling again I warmed up quite quickly having descended off the exposed fell into the warmer lowlands.
I don't think the hills were my problem. I think there is more time to be made up on the flatter sections - I'm not particularly fast on the flats being 63kg. I could probably work on improving my threshold power but don't know where to start really.
I just checked my Strava and it says moving time of 7:20, so I stopped for 30 minutes. I only stopped at the two feed stops - the first one for about 10 minutes to fill my bottles and scoff some food, but the second was about 20 minutes - I'd left my jacket off crossing Cold Fell and was soaked and chilled to bone. I stood shivering in the hall while drinking a coffee, but I was actually getting colder just standing around, so I decided to head off. Once I was pedalling again I warmed up quite quickly having descended off the exposed fell into the warmer lowlands.
I don't think the hills were my problem. I think there is more time to be made up on the flatter sections - I'm not particularly fast on the flats being 63kg. I could probably work on improving my threshold power but don't know where to start really.
I'm no cycle expert, but I'd defiantly look at getting into a club and hitting some monster climbs. Try some mountain biking for extra muddy climbing, also look at gym work for leg strength and endurance. Have you looked into your fuelling? The weeks before are just as important as the day.
okgo said:
As per everything, get fitter and lose weight 
See a lad I ride with finished 5th this year, he's a fat git so you should be fine.
I don't have much weight to shift - perhaps 1 or 2 kg if I really tried. I'm 63kg now.See a lad I ride with finished 5th this year, he's a fat git so you should be fine.
As for getting fitter - clearly yes, but I'd like to hear ideas on the best way to achieve this.
IMHO, there ain't no substitute for miles. 'Train hard, race easy' to paraphrase a quote. As mentioned before, you need to be able to ride hard while fatigued, so maybe move your turbo sessions to a Sunday evening after the club run (assuming you're in a club). Training on fatigue will help you pull it out of the bag when you need to at the back end of things.
Also, I got good results from focusing hard on turbo training as a way to change my power loading - I was training for short distance (10/25 mile TTs), but the principle should be sound if you want to increase your flat riding ability. All of my training over winter was at 2 or 3% gradient (turbo), sunday club ride or flat out race speed - I was doing long intervals at that grade as though it was flat, so when I hit the road properly in march, I was riding riders who had been stronger the previous season off my back wheel.
Also, I got good results from focusing hard on turbo training as a way to change my power loading - I was training for short distance (10/25 mile TTs), but the principle should be sound if you want to increase your flat riding ability. All of my training over winter was at 2 or 3% gradient (turbo), sunday club ride or flat out race speed - I was doing long intervals at that grade as though it was flat, so when I hit the road properly in march, I was riding riders who had been stronger the previous season off my back wheel.
Well I've been lucky to get a place - 3rd year in a row. Training has been OK but not spectacular over the last couple of months. I've tried to do a longish ride each weekend (up to 50/60 miles) and a couple of turbo sessions per week. I'm in better shape than I was this time last year so I'm hopeful that I can improve beyond last years fitness.
I'll be building up the length and ascent of my weekend rides aiming to ride 80-90 miles in the month leading up to the ride. I'll probably add in a third turbo session too but I'm not sure which sessions are best. I've done plenty of 2x20 intervals in the past but thinking I should introduce shorter/harder intervals around 5 minutes long. Most hills in the UK and the Lakes are not 20 minutes.
Any recommendations for turbo sessions?
I'll be building up the length and ascent of my weekend rides aiming to ride 80-90 miles in the month leading up to the ride. I'll probably add in a third turbo session too but I'm not sure which sessions are best. I've done plenty of 2x20 intervals in the past but thinking I should introduce shorter/harder intervals around 5 minutes long. Most hills in the UK and the Lakes are not 20 minutes.
Any recommendations for turbo sessions?
2x20 is not there to help you climb five min hills at full pace, it's designed to push your threshold up which makes EVERYTHING easier.
I don't know when the Whitton is, but in the weeks weeks before it, yes, work in some 5 min all out intervals, this will boost your power at vo2 max which will mean you can push harder but the king of everything is FTP when talking about long rides. He with the highest FTP is the freshest when he gets to the hills
I don't know when the Whitton is, but in the weeks weeks before it, yes, work in some 5 min all out intervals, this will boost your power at vo2 max which will mean you can push harder but the king of everything is FTP when talking about long rides. He with the highest FTP is the freshest when he gets to the hills
okgo said:
2x20 is not there to help you climb five min hills at full pace, it's designed to push your threshold up which makes EVERYTHING easier.
I don't know when the Whitton is, but in the weeks weeks before it, yes, work in some 5 min all out intervals, this will boost your power at vo2 max which will mean you can push harder but the king of everything is FTP when talking about long rides. He with the highest FTP is the freshest when he gets to the hills
That makes sense. I need to read up a little on the physiology stuff. Doing 2x20s seemed to work really well last year in combination with a long hilly/hard weekend ride. I just want to make sure I'm using my time wisely.I don't know when the Whitton is, but in the weeks weeks before it, yes, work in some 5 min all out intervals, this will boost your power at vo2 max which will mean you can push harder but the king of everything is FTP when talking about long rides. He with the highest FTP is the freshest when he gets to the hills
So continue with the 2x20s then, or other types of threshold sessions? And what %FTP ? I've recently measured my FTP at just under 250 W (Wahoo Kickr) based on 95% of my 20 minute power.
I do lots of different stuff, 3x10 at 90 odd percent, 2 hours with last 30 mins as close to FTP as you can manage is good for training for longer stuff.
Don't always do the same stuff as the body responds well to new things but keep the principles similar I guess. I let my coach sort it for me now but it is interesting seeing the mix of stuff he gives me while every other person is doing same stuff week in week out.
Don't always do the same stuff as the body responds well to new things but keep the principles similar I guess. I let my coach sort it for me now but it is interesting seeing the mix of stuff he gives me while every other person is doing same stuff week in week out.
Yet another superbly run event. Despite the forecast for heavy rain we only had a few isolated showers. The wind wasn't too bad for that region and the roads dried out nicely by the end.
Managed to get round in 7:41 which was ten minutes better than last year. I rode round with my friend and could have gone a fair bit quicker based on how my legs were feeling but it was quite nice to ride around at a fairly sedate pace rather than a head-down smash fest.
Hardknott was as ridiculously tough as ever!
Fastest time was 6 hours dead I believe.
Managed to get round in 7:41 which was ten minutes better than last year. I rode round with my friend and could have gone a fair bit quicker based on how my legs were feeling but it was quite nice to ride around at a fairly sedate pace rather than a head-down smash fest.
Hardknott was as ridiculously tough as ever!
Fastest time was 6 hours dead I believe.
Would love to know how your training went and what if anything you would do differently. According to the official results page, two guys did it in 6.01 -
http://www.resultsbase.net/Results/IndividualResul...
It looks like only 100 people got in under 7 hrs, although I've only done a quick count up on the results page. It's about 3000 that take part isn't it? Would be a hell of an achievement to complete that at roughly 18.5 mph average!
I would think you need to do more longer rides if you are specifically aiming at pushing yourself that far. Hardknot at 95 miles, and you still have 15 or so to go to finish once on the summit?
http://www.resultsbase.net/Results/IndividualResul...
It looks like only 100 people got in under 7 hrs, although I've only done a quick count up on the results page. It's about 3000 that take part isn't it? Would be a hell of an achievement to complete that at roughly 18.5 mph average!
I would think you need to do more longer rides if you are specifically aiming at pushing yourself that far. Hardknot at 95 miles, and you still have 15 or so to go to finish once on the summit?
Difficult to say but I reckon I'd have been closer to 7:15 if I'd gone for it and not spent as much time at the feed stops (could have shaved 10 minutes off there).
I probably didn't do enough training for sub-7 hours. My training was probably intensive enough but not enough volume. I did a long weekend ride (building up from 50 in January to 70/80 by March) but only 2 or 3 turbo sessions a week, which means I had 3 rest days per week.
The hills weren't the problem. I'm reasonably light (63kg) so don't suffer too much. To get a fast time you need to be quick on the flat sections. Although it's a very hilly route there are still plenty of flat/rolling sections.
I probably didn't do enough training for sub-7 hours. My training was probably intensive enough but not enough volume. I did a long weekend ride (building up from 50 in January to 70/80 by March) but only 2 or 3 turbo sessions a week, which means I had 3 rest days per week.
The hills weren't the problem. I'm reasonably light (63kg) so don't suffer too much. To get a fast time you need to be quick on the flat sections. Although it's a very hilly route there are still plenty of flat/rolling sections.
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