Lots of petrol, LPG conversion or second car (MR2 roadster)?
Discussion
I've recently sold off my fleet of cars and replaced them with one new car, a 2007 Jeep Commander 5.7 Hemi. It is fantastic and I love it but the obvious downside is a current average of 18.5mpg. Also oil changes at nearly £100 a pop every 3k-6k miles start to add up too (5W-20 fully synthetic is expensive stuff it turns out). I am weighing up a few options at the moment:
I've found a ok looking facelift MR2 just down the road from me advertised for £1950 so I might take a look this weekend if it's still available to see if it sways me one way or the other.
- Just run just the Jeep as it is on petrol by itself. This saves on fixed costs (insurance, tax etc), is really nice and requires no further fixed investment. The downside is about £4k P/A in fuel and lots of expensive oil changes.
- Get the Jeep converted to LPG. This would probably cost slightly north of £2000 but would make the fuel costs much more sensible. It would also mean I have no spare wheel, have to faff with lpg and any reliability effects that might result from the conversion (I've read lots of horror stories of perfectly good cars being ruined with LPG).
- Buy an MR2 Roadster (mk3) as a second car and drive this for half the time. This obviously would increase fixed costs (insurance, tax and MOT) but would save a fortune on fuel and a noticeable amount on servicing and consumables. I would also then have a convertible sports car for those lovely summer evenings. Owning multiple cars is a bit of a faff with parking and keeping up with all the documentation and such though.
| MR2 mk3 | Jeep Commander HEMI | Jeep Commander Hemi LPG | MR2 mk3 + Jeep Commander HEMI | |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| Insurance | £580.00 | £670.00 | £670.00 | £880.00 |
| Tax | £220.00 | £495.00 | £495.00 | £715.00 |
| MOT | £50.00 | £50.00 | £50.00 | £100.00 |
| Maintenance/repair | £160.00 | £400.00 | £450.00 | £330.00 |
| Fixed total: | £1,010.00 | £1,615.00 | £1,665.00 | £2,025.00 |
| Tyre wear | £144.00 | £200.00 | £200.00 | £172.00 |
| Fuel | £1,772.94 | £3,939.87 | £3,066.32 | £2,856.40 |
| Total P/A: | £2,926.94 | £5,754.87 | £4,931.32 | £5,053.40 |
I've found a ok looking facelift MR2 just down the road from me advertised for £1950 so I might take a look this weekend if it's still available to see if it sways me one way or the other.
LPG
1) relability issues are largely tosh/bad install/no servicing
2) with a big V8 and doing 19mpg your payback period will be about 15-20k miles - if you are NOT going to do that mileage forget it. Also depends on your LPG prices which vary about 20p across the UK (I paid 59p up until 2 month ago), but in London 75p+)
3) 2k is high even for a reasonable install (maybe darn sarf tax). Mine was 1600 with 70l tank and just sold the car after 5 years and 70k miles. probably paid for itself 4x over. (Tank size is one of the biggest cost elements)
4) friend of mine has a jeep and has owned it 3 times (sold and bought back) - he tracks it as well (yes you read correctly) - he's never had any issues and been running LPG on cars for 20+ years. (search jeep cherokee prescott) in youtube - there are some other vid on YT of it but not got links at work. www.youtube.com/watch?v=isDx14NxRv8
5) Insurance can be a pain, cos some companies just treat it as a mod and load accordingly (usually those on price comparison sites). My first insurance I got a refund - go figure.
6) register the install with DVLA and get cheaper tax.
7) do get a decent install, preferably not from one of the ones who turn it round in a day
8) no need to ever worry about emissions on an MOT
Depending on who you believe LPG increases or degreases the resale value. Do a comparison on Autotrader see what the difference is Jeeps are a common candidate for installs
1) relability issues are largely tosh/bad install/no servicing
2) with a big V8 and doing 19mpg your payback period will be about 15-20k miles - if you are NOT going to do that mileage forget it. Also depends on your LPG prices which vary about 20p across the UK (I paid 59p up until 2 month ago), but in London 75p+)
3) 2k is high even for a reasonable install (maybe darn sarf tax). Mine was 1600 with 70l tank and just sold the car after 5 years and 70k miles. probably paid for itself 4x over. (Tank size is one of the biggest cost elements)
4) friend of mine has a jeep and has owned it 3 times (sold and bought back) - he tracks it as well (yes you read correctly) - he's never had any issues and been running LPG on cars for 20+ years. (search jeep cherokee prescott) in youtube - there are some other vid on YT of it but not got links at work. www.youtube.com/watch?v=isDx14NxRv8
5) Insurance can be a pain, cos some companies just treat it as a mod and load accordingly (usually those on price comparison sites). My first insurance I got a refund - go figure.
6) register the install with DVLA and get cheaper tax.
7) do get a decent install, preferably not from one of the ones who turn it round in a day
8) no need to ever worry about emissions on an MOT
Depending on who you believe LPG increases or degreases the resale value. Do a comparison on Autotrader see what the difference is Jeeps are a common candidate for installs
Edited by sparkyhx on Friday 29th November 13:39
Edited by sparkyhx on Friday 29th November 13:56
sparkyhx said:
LPG
1) relability issues are largely tosh/bad install/no servicing
2) with a big V8 and doing 19mpg your payback period will be about 15-20k miles - if you are NOT going to do that mileage forget it. Also depends on your LPG prices which vary about 20p across the UK (I paid 59p up until 2 month ago), but in London 75p+)
3) 2k is high even for a reasonable install (maybe darn sarf tax). Mine was 1600 with 70l tank and just sold the car after 5 years and 70k miles. probably paid for itself 4x over. (Tank size is one of the biggest cost elements)
4) friend of mine has a jeep and has owned it 3 times (sold and bought back) - he tracks it as well (yes you read correctly) - he's never had any issues and been running LPG on cars for 20+ years. (search jeep cherokee prescott) in youtube - there are some other vid on YT of it but not got links at work.
5) Insurance can be a pain, cos some companies just treat it as a mod and load accordingly (usually those on price comparison sites). My first insurance I got a refund - go figure.
6) register the install with DVLA and get cheaper tax.
7) do get a decent install, preferably not from one of the ones who turn it round in a day
8) no need to ever worry about emissions on an MOT
Depending on who you believe LPG increases or degreases the resale value. Do a comparison on Autotrader see what the difference is Jeeps are a common candidate for installs
If I went the LPG route it would only be with an absolutely top quality system and a 95l tank. Any smaller and the range would just be annoying, it only does 250ish miles from full to the light coming on petrol (about 65l). Insurance goes up a little when I looked at other vehicles with LPG though I haven't specifically asked about my one.1) relability issues are largely tosh/bad install/no servicing
2) with a big V8 and doing 19mpg your payback period will be about 15-20k miles - if you are NOT going to do that mileage forget it. Also depends on your LPG prices which vary about 20p across the UK (I paid 59p up until 2 month ago), but in London 75p+)
3) 2k is high even for a reasonable install (maybe darn sarf tax). Mine was 1600 with 70l tank and just sold the car after 5 years and 70k miles. probably paid for itself 4x over. (Tank size is one of the biggest cost elements)
4) friend of mine has a jeep and has owned it 3 times (sold and bought back) - he tracks it as well (yes you read correctly) - he's never had any issues and been running LPG on cars for 20+ years. (search jeep cherokee prescott) in youtube - there are some other vid on YT of it but not got links at work.
5) Insurance can be a pain, cos some companies just treat it as a mod and load accordingly (usually those on price comparison sites). My first insurance I got a refund - go figure.
6) register the install with DVLA and get cheaper tax.
7) do get a decent install, preferably not from one of the ones who turn it round in a day
8) no need to ever worry about emissions on an MOT
Depending on who you believe LPG increases or degreases the resale value. Do a comparison on Autotrader see what the difference is Jeeps are a common candidate for installs
Edited by sparkyhx on Friday 29th November 13:39
Doing the maths using £1.30/l for petrol, £0.75/l for lpg (it's about that my way), 90% lpg to petrol usage ratio, 85% mpg on lpg and £2000 conversion cost yields a payback mileage of about 23k, which is probably just over two years for me. I have no idea if I will keep it longer than that or not or what effect it would have on the value really. There are so few Hemis for sale that it's hard to get an idea.
V8RX7 said:
If you're keeping the Jeep - LPG it.
If you want a fun convertible - just buy one.
BUT the extra costs, tax, MOT repairs, insurance etc means it is not a sensible option.
I'm definitely keeping the Jeep, I've only just bought it and it's beautiful If you want a fun convertible - just buy one.
BUT the extra costs, tax, MOT repairs, insurance etc means it is not a sensible option.
. My calculations suggest that if I bought an MR2 and did half of the mileage in that, the savings in fuel, maintenance and consumables would outweigh the fixed costs and leave me several hundred pounds up. It's a question of would I enjoy those miles as much as in the Jeep and does the benefits outweigh the faff of running two cars again? The flip side of two cars is it doesn't matter so much when one of them is out of commission for a while and I would have the ideal car for every situation and weather condition.HemiCommander said:
I'm definitely keeping the Jeep, I've only just bought it and it's beautiful . My calculations suggest that if I bought an MR2 and did half of the mileage in that, the savings in fuel, maintenance and consumables would outweigh the fixed costs and leave me several hundred pounds up. It's a question of would I enjoy those miles as much as in the Jeep and does the benefits outweigh the faff of running two cars again? The flip side of two cars is it doesn't matter so much when one of them is out of commission for a while and I would have the ideal car for every situation and weather condition.
Much as the Jeep is an awesome thing I think I'd enjoy the contrast between cars massively more than just driving one about. Big, wafty, V8-powered Jeep and buzzy little 4-pot roadster sounds like a perfect combo. . My calculations suggest that if I bought an MR2 and did half of the mileage in that, the savings in fuel, maintenance and consumables would outweigh the fixed costs and leave me several hundred pounds up. It's a question of would I enjoy those miles as much as in the Jeep and does the benefits outweigh the faff of running two cars again? The flip side of two cars is it doesn't matter so much when one of them is out of commission for a while and I would have the ideal car for every situation and weather condition.
Krikkit said:
Much as the Jeep is an awesome thing I think I'd enjoy the contrast between cars massively more than just driving one about. Big, wafty, V8-powered Jeep and buzzy little 4-pot roadster sounds like a perfect combo.
I thought they would make a good combo. I have a slight worry that if I just drive an automatic luxomobile I might forget how to drive so a manual roadster would stop this happening! I am about 6'4" so the other question is would I fit in an MR2? They don't look like they were designed with the larger chap in mind.
Well I went to see the MR2 and it was a right giggle. It was a very amusing contrast to my Jeep, sat on the floor with the little sewing machine motor buzzing along just behind your ear. It had the proper Bridgestone Potenzas so the grip was good and handling felt very sharp. I sort of fitted too so I think I will have to get one now 
. Unfortunately the guy selling this one had arranged another guy to come down from Birmingham to see it just after me, didn't want to sell it to me until the other guy had seen it to avoid wasting his trip and he bought it at asking price.
So in conclusion, I am now in the market for a facelift MR2 roadster if anyone knows of a good example for sale. Preferably in bright Red or Yellow.
. Unfortunately the guy selling this one had arranged another guy to come down from Birmingham to see it just after me, didn't want to sell it to me until the other guy had seen it to avoid wasting his trip and he bought it at asking price. So in conclusion, I am now in the market for a facelift MR2 roadster if anyone knows of a good example for sale. Preferably in bright Red or Yellow.
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