Opinions from mechanics: How bad is this?
Discussion
I have a 2300 mile and 4.5 month old Fiesta ST that has been in and out of the dealer for the last 2 weeks. During the main fix (mis-aligned camshaft/crankshaft) they found that it was down 2.5 litres of oil (I had checked the level 10 days prior, all fine) They filled it up and asked me to check it after 200 miles. They stated no leaks or burning.
It now appears to have gone down some on the dipstick after ~200 miles. I had a look around where the car is parked and couldn't see any oil, but did notice the tailpipes were very sooty. So I did a video and think this is bad.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=803dihUEv9I
Taken 20 minutes after a 60 mile city/mway/dc/b road run.
I think with all the other problems with the engine I feel it is a bad egg and have a case for rejection now. Am I expecting too much?
It now appears to have gone down some on the dipstick after ~200 miles. I had a look around where the car is parked and couldn't see any oil, but did notice the tailpipes were very sooty. So I did a video and think this is bad.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=803dihUEv9I
Taken 20 minutes after a 60 mile city/mway/dc/b road run.
I think with all the other problems with the engine I feel it is a bad egg and have a case for rejection now. Am I expecting too much?
As I said in your other thread, ford will probably claim that the oil consumption you are experiencing is within their tolerances and therefore there is nothing wrong with the car. You'll have a hard time trying to get them to do something about that.
Make a fuss with Ford UK, surrounding dealers etc via phone, letter, social media until something gets done.
Make a fuss with Ford UK, surrounding dealers etc via phone, letter, social media until something gets done.
Ozzie Osmond said:
You need to give the dealer a chance to fix the car. It seems to be a single fault and it's not as if the car has broken down or anything.
Just make sure you set out the problem IN WRITING to the dealer so there's a clear record which you can refer back to later if necessary.
The car was originally diagnosed with a bad cam sensor and when replacing that didn't work, they then told me without looking at the car it was a wiring issue. They then had the car 5 days and by the 4th day they were stumped. On the 5th day the master tech then found the crankshaft/camshaft were mis-aligned. To me this suggests the engine wasn't built right in the first place. I don't know what, if any, damage that could cause? Just make sure you set out the problem IN WRITING to the dealer so there's a clear record which you can refer back to later if necessary.
The oil being 2.5 litres down was found after doing a health check. I don't know if these problems are related, but I fear on-going issues if I just let them keep repairing it.
Your comment that the oil was down on the dipstick after 200 miles resonated with me - my Austin Healey 3000 was exactly the same. Long European road trips had to be done accompanied industrial amounts of oil for refills - basically around 1 litre every 250 miles. I had to persevere with it until I could afford the full engine rebuild. That happened this year (and to fast road spec to - oh brother is it sweet now!) and the car is a reformed character oil consumption-wise. My point is that the engine was worn - very worn. Without knowing exactly what you are getting through any movement down the dipstick after 200 miles is too much.
A caveat I suppose towards modern cars - I had a diesel Audi A6 from new back in '06 and that could cut through oil until it had done around 10,000 miles and bedded in, but that is not in the league of what you are experiencing.
As the others say, get it back to the dealer and really quite quickly.
A caveat I suppose towards modern cars - I had a diesel Audi A6 from new back in '06 and that could cut through oil until it had done around 10,000 miles and bedded in, but that is not in the league of what you are experiencing.
As the others say, get it back to the dealer and really quite quickly.
From Ford's website, it is an ST with 1.0 Ecoboost engine? (I could be wrong, I lost interest in new cars in the mid-'90s 
.)
I'd suggest it's a Turbo problem rather than an engine problem per se - but it's using way too much oil from the figures alone, regardless.
VW had a problem with their early 16V engines consuming vast amounts of oil, but their maximum oil consumption figure was something like 1l per 1000 miles and so the engines could drain their sumps before the next oil change but still meet the spec
.
I doubt you'll be able to reject the car (an attempt to do this on a 3 week old Nissan with engine failure at 140 miles due to a manufacturing defect failed in the '80s), but I'd be expecting the Ford dealer to remedy this under warranty...
.)I'd suggest it's a Turbo problem rather than an engine problem per se - but it's using way too much oil from the figures alone, regardless.
VW had a problem with their early 16V engines consuming vast amounts of oil, but their maximum oil consumption figure was something like 1l per 1000 miles and so the engines could drain their sumps before the next oil change but still meet the spec
.I doubt you'll be able to reject the car (an attempt to do this on a 3 week old Nissan with engine failure at 140 miles due to a manufacturing defect failed in the '80s), but I'd be expecting the Ford dealer to remedy this under warranty...
HustleRussell said:
As I said in your other thread, ford will probably claim that the oil consumption you are experiencing is within their tolerances and therefore there is nothing wrong with the car. You'll have a hard time trying to get them to do something about that.
Make a fuss with Ford UK, surrounding dealers etc via phone, letter, social media until something gets done.
They could indeed say that. There is nothing in the handbook for acceptable oil usage for the Fiesta, but I did a bit of research and the handbook of the new EcoSport does state the maximum acceptable usage is 1 litre in the first 5000km(3100 miles) and then 1 litre/10000km thereafter.Make a fuss with Ford UK, surrounding dealers etc via phone, letter, social media until something gets done.
If mine has burned all 2.5 litres and continues at the same rate, then that would be ~3.75 litres in the first 3100 miles.
And yes a call to Ford themselves is overdue. I'll see what they think.
If the engine has always had oil pressure and the timing was not out by too much, the engine itself ought to be alright. I can't imagine the bores or seals causing that kind of consumption. Of course the turbo is another potential source of oil burning in the engine. It sounds as though major investigation is required. Hopefully it's something as simple as a crankcase ventilation/breathing valve.
Detail all the issues in letter and E mail for to the Dealer principal firstly.
Next, contact Ford UK customer services and get them to send one of their Field Engineers to assess the problems.
If the camshafts and crankshaft were misaligned it could have caused untold internal damage to the engine.
I for one do not buy this excuse as the engine would have run very badly from the word go.
For those that are unaware the ST has a 1.6 litre 4 cylinder turbocharged engine.
Keep at it and your issue will be resolved. Good luck.
Next, contact Ford UK customer services and get them to send one of their Field Engineers to assess the problems.
If the camshafts and crankshaft were misaligned it could have caused untold internal damage to the engine.
I for one do not buy this excuse as the engine would have run very badly from the word go.
For those that are unaware the ST has a 1.6 litre 4 cylinder turbocharged engine.
Keep at it and your issue will be resolved. Good luck.
JSquaredJim said:
Detail all the issues in letter and E mail for to the Dealer principal firstly.
Next, contact Ford UK customer services and get them to send one of their Field Engineers to assess the problems.
If the camshafts and crankshaft were misaligned it could have caused untold internal damage to the engine.
I for one do not buy this excuse as the engine would have run very badly from the word go.
For those that are unaware the ST has a 1.6 litre 4 cylinder turbocharged engine.
Keep at it and your issue will be resolved. Good luck.
Interesting what you say about the camshaft/crankshaft misalignment. I met with the service manager Thursday and:Next, contact Ford UK customer services and get them to send one of their Field Engineers to assess the problems.
If the camshafts and crankshaft were misaligned it could have caused untold internal damage to the engine.
I for one do not buy this excuse as the engine would have run very badly from the word go.
For those that are unaware the ST has a 1.6 litre 4 cylinder turbocharged engine.
Keep at it and your issue will be resolved. Good luck.
He has no record on their computer (he showed me) of the 5 days the car was in the dealer having that work done!? I had a loan car too....I'm at a loss to what the hell this means!
He then introduced me to the head tech, a really nice older guy. Struggled as I had with the inconsistent oil dipstick, but with the help of another tech the car had used another 0.5 litre of oil in under 400 miles. In line with the 2.5 litres used in the first 2000 miles.
I have now been asked to drive for 500 miles without touching it and take it back. I have also set up a case with Ford customer services.
OP, you state in your first post that the oil consumption was essentially discovered when the car was in for other work - misaligned camshaft/crankshaft!! You must have noticed something was awry to return the car for this work - what were the symptoms? This may well be the root cause of the problem.
After each visit and conversation confirm all in email to ford so there is a paper trail as it is already worrying that they have "no record" of the five days the car wuss in their workshop. If it ever progresses to official complaint or court, the judge will always review the written correspondence first
Do it while your memory is fresh
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