RE: VW discontinues Scirocco R...
Wednesday 18th December 2013
Rather surreptitiously and with little fuss, VW has dropped the Scirocco R from its range. We quite like the hot Scirocco here at PH so felt it needed a proper send off.
Not the best use of a decent engine...But then a bit of investigative work uncovered the Scirocco R won't actually disappear totally. The current car had to be killed off because its EA113 2.0-litre turbo doesn't meet the Euro 5+ emissions legislation that's effective from the start of 2014. However, the Scirocco will be revised next year, where we can expect the R to make a return most likely with the EA888 engine from the new Golf GTI and R.
This was rather better!For now, a few Scirocco Rs are at VW dealers as all of them have to be registered before the end of the year. So off we popped to the classifieds in search of a bargain, only to be a little disappointed. This 2013 R DSG would have been £33K new and is still commanding £29K after 5,000 miles so the car's relative rarity still accounts for something. The cheapest Scirocco R on PH is this 2010 DSG car.
VW discontinues Scirocco R...
... but the Golf R cabriolet stays. Huh?
Not the best use of a decent engine...
Bizarrely the Golf R cabriolet, which uses ostensibly the same engine and emits more CO2 than the Scirocco, meets the legislation and will remain on sale. Even the VW PR office didn't have an answer for that one! Furthermore, Audi will make no change to TT line up (the TTS uses a 272hp version of the EA113) so there is clearly some strange emissions criteria those cars comply with.
This was rather better!
The EA113 engine was probably best known as that found in the Mk5 Golf GTI and also made it to the later Mk6 Edition 35 plus a fast SEAT or two. PH has some fairly extensive experience with the engine then, and mostly positive. Nobody mention fuel consumption...
Discussion
that's just crazy on the rules and regs then surrounding the CO2 limits then
I do like the sirocco to look at, and testdriven a couple but not a fan, they drive nice but for me its the cabin that's the deal breaker, its just too much like a pillar box and with really poor visibility and the dark headliners in the couple I had a crack at made the lack of daylight worse.
I do like the sirocco to look at, and testdriven a couple but not a fan, they drive nice but for me its the cabin that's the deal breaker, its just too much like a pillar box and with really poor visibility and the dark headliners in the couple I had a crack at made the lack of daylight worse.
X5TUU said:
I do like the sirocco to look at, and testd riven a couple but not a fan, they drive nice but for me its the cabin that's the deal breaker, its just too much like a pillar box and with really poor visibility and the dark headliners in the couple I had a crack at made the lack of daylight worse.
I think if they had put the haldex awd into the R version it would have sold more. Thats why I feel the dropping the top model is more due to sales than anything. I found the same issues with the interior as wellRichard
article said:
bizarrely the Golf R cabriolet, which uses ostensibly the same engine and emits more CO2 than the Scirocco, meets the legislation and will remain on sale.
The legislation tightens up on Nox and particulate emissions. Exceed the limits and you can't sell any cars. Until the fleet average stuff comes into effect the CO2 output isn't legislated against, a higher output merely results in a more expensive tax disc.Scirocco R is an older product launched ~2009 so probably wasn't calibrated with the 2015 limits in mind.
Edited by BeefMaster9000 on Wednesday 18th December 12:38
Here in Northern Italy it performed poor sales compared to the obvious Golf GTIs but also versus the expensive AWD Golf R. For a period there were very interesting offers of delivery miles examples with huge discounts and I have been tempted. I test drove an R in DSG form and I liked it more than the Golf R which felt heavier and less responsive.
richs2891 said:
I think if they had put the haldex awd into the R version it would have sold more. Thats why I feel the dropping the top model is more due to sales than anything. I found the same issues with the interior as well
Richard
Well here's something I didn't know! I assumed that being an 'R' meant it had 4wd by default, like the Golf.Richard
richs2891 said:
I think if they had put the haldex awd into the R version it would have sold more. Thats why I feel the dropping the top model is more due to sales than anything. I found the same issues with the interior as well
Richard
It was the lack of 4WD that made me more keen on it. Better drivetrain efficiency and all that. More fun for the occasional trackday.Richard
I test drove one as a potential replacement for my MKV R32 and came away massively disappointed. If they'd put the Haldex system on it then it may have been so much more. But to me it didn't really have a redeeming feature that made me want to own one. Alternatively shame they didn't work on the VR6 and improve emissions for a true Corrado VR6 successor.
Think i've seen 2 on the road, so a rarer still than the Golf R, of which i've seen a handful.
I never drove a Scirocco R, but just couldn't deal with the sensation of driving a coffin when driving the EA888 engined one (i.e. GTI engine). I also thought, considering they are big money, i wanted AWD as an extra box to tick as the consummate all-rounder.
I was under the impression the EA113 had strong internals and was could take big power. It also has a K04 turbo which helps it achieve bigger numbers against the EA888. I believe a Stage 3 car - so knocking on the door of 400bhp - is pretty safe. Early on, there were issues with the cam follower that VW still do not acknowledge. Later cars, such as the Scirocco and Golf R are fine when standard, but get through them when fuel pumps are upgraded.
The disappointing for me is the fuel consumption - barely over 30mpg in the lardy Golf. To think my 997 Carrera S (with crappy Tiptronic) beat this is pretty pathetic. I think the EA888 cars can get closer to 40mpg, but i'm not sure how they fair when it comes to reliability. It justifies at least a remap as fuel consumption is no worse, and you have c.310bhp to play with.
Despite being heavier, ultimately glad i went for the Golf option. I've been using a 500 Abarth of late and the torque steer and wheelspin is tedious. People mock the Haldex set up, but you can use launch control it the wet and it just takes off... deeply impressive. Think i'd get pee'd off with a 270bhp FWD alternative.
I never drove a Scirocco R, but just couldn't deal with the sensation of driving a coffin when driving the EA888 engined one (i.e. GTI engine). I also thought, considering they are big money, i wanted AWD as an extra box to tick as the consummate all-rounder.
I was under the impression the EA113 had strong internals and was could take big power. It also has a K04 turbo which helps it achieve bigger numbers against the EA888. I believe a Stage 3 car - so knocking on the door of 400bhp - is pretty safe. Early on, there were issues with the cam follower that VW still do not acknowledge. Later cars, such as the Scirocco and Golf R are fine when standard, but get through them when fuel pumps are upgraded.
The disappointing for me is the fuel consumption - barely over 30mpg in the lardy Golf. To think my 997 Carrera S (with crappy Tiptronic) beat this is pretty pathetic. I think the EA888 cars can get closer to 40mpg, but i'm not sure how they fair when it comes to reliability. It justifies at least a remap as fuel consumption is no worse, and you have c.310bhp to play with.
Despite being heavier, ultimately glad i went for the Golf option. I've been using a 500 Abarth of late and the torque steer and wheelspin is tedious. People mock the Haldex set up, but you can use launch control it the wet and it just takes off... deeply impressive. Think i'd get pee'd off with a 270bhp FWD alternative.
Always amazes me how quick these VAG 2.0 turbo cars are, the normal 2.0 TFSi does 100 in 14.8 and the R 11.7, with 200 and 265 bhp respectively, the TTS is is pretty quick as well, my 350Z with 300 bhp takes 14 sec, must just be down to weight, possibly the DSG gearbox, heard one scream off and the gearchanges were impressively rapid.
Still, doesnt really grab me, but probably a very nice car, a bit too smooth and sophisticated and not nearly yobbish enough.
Still, doesnt really grab me, but probably a very nice car, a bit too smooth and sophisticated and not nearly yobbish enough.
love the look of the scirocco
my mum had the 2.0tsi with DSG
and just about every extra
was a great car, always got psotive attention as well
it drove well, pretty quick
and averaged between 30/35mpg easily keeping up with traffic!
the R version, was subtley different in looks to the keen eye
and i imagine all scirocco models will out perform their golf rivals in terms of residuals in the long term
as theyre isnt a huge amount of them
and they carry a bit more class
my mum had the 2.0tsi with DSG
and just about every extra
was a great car, always got psotive attention as well
it drove well, pretty quick
and averaged between 30/35mpg easily keeping up with traffic!
the R version, was subtley different in looks to the keen eye
and i imagine all scirocco models will out perform their golf rivals in terms of residuals in the long term
as theyre isnt a huge amount of them
and they carry a bit more class
mikebradford said:
love the look of the scirocco
my mum had the 2.0tsi with DSG
and just about every extra
was a great car, always got psotive attention as well
it drove well, pretty quick
and averaged between 30/35mpg easily keeping up with traffic!
the R version, was subtley different in looks to the keen eye
and i imagine all scirocco models will out perform their golf rivals in terms of residuals in the long term
as theyre isnt a huge amount of them
and they carry a bit more class
Is that VAG based Haiku ?my mum had the 2.0tsi with DSG
and just about every extra
was a great car, always got psotive attention as well
it drove well, pretty quick
and averaged between 30/35mpg easily keeping up with traffic!
the R version, was subtley different in looks to the keen eye
and i imagine all scirocco models will out perform their golf rivals in terms of residuals in the long term
as theyre isnt a huge amount of them
and they carry a bit more class
VeeDub Geezer said:
NelsonR32 said:
Alternatively shame they didn't work on the VR6 and improve emissions for a true Corrado VR6 successor.
They did, they just didn't fit it into the Golf/Scirocco chassis...
Ijust checked.... VR6 indeed. 10.6 degree V!
The FSI 3.2 and 3.6 engines have a 10.6deg vee, the non-FSI ones (2.8, 2.9, 3.2) are the old 15deg.
If you're a bit geeky, this is a good read: http://sandbox.enjoybeing.net/veedub/vw_vr6_self_s...
If you're a bit geeky, this is a good read: http://sandbox.enjoybeing.net/veedub/vw_vr6_self_s...
BeefMaster9000 said:
The legislation tightens up on Nox and particulate emissions. Exceed the limits and you can't sell any cars. Until the fleet average stuff comes into effect the CO2 output isn't legislated against, a higher output merely results in a more expensive tax disc.
Scirocco R is an older product launched ~2009 so probably wasn't calibrated with the 2015 limits in mind.
I was going to say, theres a lot more to it than just C02 and it will be something else like the NOx.Scirocco R is an older product launched ~2009 so probably wasn't calibrated with the 2015 limits in mind.
Daniel
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