Working in the Middle East - now or never?
Discussion
I've always thought about doing a year or two in the Middle East at some point in my life and I think now, having just turned 28, that it's now or never?
I've a background in commercial property agency (2006 - late 2012) and more recently (since October 2012) have been working in Technical Sales for the same company outside of property industry.
There are loads of sales jobs listed on websites such as bayt.com
Any advice from people who have done it?
I'd quite like to give it a go, earn some tax free money as well as some life experience.
Have chatted it through with the OH and she's ok with it, would have a friend of hers move into our house whilst I was away.
I've a background in commercial property agency (2006 - late 2012) and more recently (since October 2012) have been working in Technical Sales for the same company outside of property industry.
There are loads of sales jobs listed on websites such as bayt.com
Any advice from people who have done it?
I'd quite like to give it a go, earn some tax free money as well as some life experience.
Have chatted it through with the OH and she's ok with it, would have a friend of hers move into our house whilst I was away.
For me it would depend partly where in the ME you move to.....some places are beter than others.
Having said that, if it's something you want to do, do it NOW rather than later. Once your salary increases and/or family commitments increase it becomes much harder to move. I was offered a role in Qatar and after factoring in all the extra costs (mainly 3 young kids), taking them out of school, moving away from extended family etc etc I decided it wasn't worth the risk.
Having said that, if it's something you want to do, do it NOW rather than later. Once your salary increases and/or family commitments increase it becomes much harder to move. I was offered a role in Qatar and after factoring in all the extra costs (mainly 3 young kids), taking them out of school, moving away from extended family etc etc I decided it wasn't worth the risk.
TobyLaRohne said:
You'll have to learn to spell it first.
Realised that once I'd posted. Autopilot putting the u after the Q, thanks for pointing it out.What makes you think I won't like it?
ETA: Agree with the 30,000 offer, any less and I wouldn't bother. Just quite fancy the experience.
AB said:
What makes you think I won't like it?
ETA: Agree with the 30,000 offer, any less and I wouldn't bother. Just quite fancy the experience.
Well did you know recently the rule changes in Qatar around alcohol have been making Qatar a place closer related to Saudi than Dubai?ETA: Agree with the 30,000 offer, any less and I wouldn't bother. Just quite fancy the experience.
You're not married to the mrs which means you can get locked up for living together.
You need a license to buy alcohol from the one shop here that sells it for private comsumption, to get that you need your employers permission
You will be under the sponsorship of your company who you have to ask permission for a visa to exit the country unless you are lucky and get a rare multi exit visa. It is not unheard of for people to be told they have their exit visa only to get the airport and find it isnt in the system.
I don't know what your mrs is qualified in but she wont be able to stay unless you get married or unless she does visa runs or gets a job that they will sponsor her.
The mrs will be viewed as fair game by almost anyone local, especially if she is blonde and if you dare so much as swear at them they can have you locked up.
If she does find work, she will be paid at least 20% less than a man would be paid for the same job (in most but not all cases).
If you're in buying and selling properties you'll be dealing with rich locals, the average IQ of the population of Qatar is 78...thats 8 points above clinically retarded...AVERAGE in a country where 1 in 14 of the 200,000 is a millionaire.
Now mix into that the giant chip that some (not all) have on their shoulders and the "its my country my rules" attitude that seems to prevail, along with the rediculous requests for money off already discounted rates for no justifiable reason and I wouldn't wish having to deal with selling property to Locals on my worst enemy.
That is just off of the top of my head why you may want to thoroughly research Qatar before hopping on a plane and hoping it is ok.
Most dont last 18 months here in my experience, it is a very transient place unless you have a family or a unique ability to stay calm in the face of stupidity and ignorance the likes of which you probably thought died out in the 60's and 70's.
Oh yes, and I forgot to mention you can be fired on a whim and you have no recourse and no rights, you'd have to leave the country and if your employer doesnt give you an NOC letter (which most wont) you can't even look for another job, you just have to leave.
Edited by TobyLaRohne on Monday 6th January 15:14
TobyLaRohne said:
Well did you know recently the rule changes in Qatar around alcohol have been making Qatar a place closer related to Saudi than Dubai?
You need a license to buy alcohol from the one shop here that sells it for private comsumption, to get that you need your employers permission
I've given up alcohol and could always take it or leave it, so that doesn't particularly both me.You need a license to buy alcohol from the one shop here that sells it for private comsumption, to get that you need your employers permission
TobyLaRohne said:
You're not married to the mrs which means you can get locked up for living together.
I don't know what your mrs is qualified in but she wont be able to stay unless you get married or unless she does visa runs or gets a job that they will sponsor her.
The mrs will be viewed as fair game by almost anyone local, especially if she is blonde and if you dare so much as swear at them they can have you locked up.
If she does find work, she will be paid at least 20% less than a man would be paid for the same job (in most but not all cases).
She wouldn't be coming so not a concern. As mentioned in my OP.I don't know what your mrs is qualified in but she wont be able to stay unless you get married or unless she does visa runs or gets a job that they will sponsor her.
The mrs will be viewed as fair game by almost anyone local, especially if she is blonde and if you dare so much as swear at them they can have you locked up.
If she does find work, she will be paid at least 20% less than a man would be paid for the same job (in most but not all cases).
TobyLaRohne said:
You will be under the sponsorship of your company who you have to ask permission for a visa to exit the country unless you are lucky and get a rare multi exit visa. It is not unheard of for people to be told they have their exit visa only to get the airport and find it isnt in the system.
If you're in buying and selling properties you'll be dealing with rich locals, the average IQ of the population of Qatar is 78...thats 8 points above clinically retarded...AVERAGE in a country where 1 in 14 of the 200,000 is a millionaire.
Now mix into that the giant chip that some (not all) have on their shoulders and the "its my country my rules" attitude that seems to prevail, along with the rediculous requests for money off already discounted rates for no justifiable reason and I wouldn't wish having to deal with selling property to Locals on my worst enemy.
That is just off of the top of my head why you may want to thoroughly research Qatar before hopping on a plane and hoping it is ok.
Most dont last 18 months here in my experience, it is a very transient place unless you have a family or a unique ability to stay calm in the face of stupidity and ignorance the likes of which you probably thought died out in the 60's and 70's.
Oh yes, and I forgot to mention you can be fired on a whim and you have no recourse and no rights, you'd have to leave the country and if your employer doesnt give you an NOC letter (which most wont) you can't even look for another job, you just have to leave.
All part of the challenge of working in a difficult environment, a challenge which I think I'd enjoy. I'd only be responsible for and looking after myself, which is why I want to do it now, before that changes.If you're in buying and selling properties you'll be dealing with rich locals, the average IQ of the population of Qatar is 78...thats 8 points above clinically retarded...AVERAGE in a country where 1 in 14 of the 200,000 is a millionaire.
Now mix into that the giant chip that some (not all) have on their shoulders and the "its my country my rules" attitude that seems to prevail, along with the rediculous requests for money off already discounted rates for no justifiable reason and I wouldn't wish having to deal with selling property to Locals on my worst enemy.
That is just off of the top of my head why you may want to thoroughly research Qatar before hopping on a plane and hoping it is ok.
Most dont last 18 months here in my experience, it is a very transient place unless you have a family or a unique ability to stay calm in the face of stupidity and ignorance the likes of which you probably thought died out in the 60's and 70's.
Oh yes, and I forgot to mention you can be fired on a whim and you have no recourse and no rights, you'd have to leave the country and if your employer doesnt give you an NOC letter (which most wont) you can't even look for another job, you just have to leave.
Ok, well so long as you come into it with your eyes open I say go for it, I did and haven't looked back since.
Worst case scenario you dont like it and move back home.
I dont understand the UK tax system too much but from what my colleagues say you have to complete one tax cycle to be able to come back and not pay tax on your earnings, that would mean you have to move fast as you'd want to get here before the start of the next tax year as if you move just after it will be the end of the 2015-2016 tax year before you can go home and not have to pay tax on your earnings. Although I could be wrong on that, I don't think I am.
Worst case scenario you dont like it and move back home.
I dont understand the UK tax system too much but from what my colleagues say you have to complete one tax cycle to be able to come back and not pay tax on your earnings, that would mean you have to move fast as you'd want to get here before the start of the next tax year as if you move just after it will be the end of the 2015-2016 tax year before you can go home and not have to pay tax on your earnings. Although I could be wrong on that, I don't think I am.
Edited by TobyLaRohne on Monday 6th January 15:39
Edited by TobyLaRohne on Monday 6th January 15:41
okgo said:
That £90k in UK terms, is it really worth all the hassle?
It's not hassle though, well the way I see it anyway!Nothing ties me down to be honest, my girlfriend is one of those people who wishes she'd done some travelling and it quite happy for me to do it, but she's well tied down in her career now and it's not one you can hop in and out of. As long as I carry on sending the mortgage money back!!
Just to mention - that £90k may or may not include living expenses.
A cousin of mine has been working out there for the last two years. As well as his wage he gets a 4 bedroomed house c/w swimming pool, all bills paid, company Landcruiser V8(which apparently costs £8 to fill up
) , and free schooling for his kids. On top of that his UK residence is rented out.
Whilst many of us would think that was utopia he's getting a bit fed up and talking about returning to the UK.
A cousin of mine has been working out there for the last two years. As well as his wage he gets a 4 bedroomed house c/w swimming pool, all bills paid, company Landcruiser V8(which apparently costs £8 to fill up
) , and free schooling for his kids. On top of that his UK residence is rented out.Whilst many of us would think that was utopia he's getting a bit fed up and talking about returning to the UK.
R8Steve said:
okgo said:
That £90k in UK terms, is it really worth all the hassle?
£90k in any terms is a lot of money!Typically a months salary goes like this:
2k on a modest 1.6ltr rental crappy car
or
5k a month on a loan or rental cost of something saucy like a supercar
10k a month on a city centre 1 bedroom apartment (furnished)
8k a month on food and going for drinks with friends and meals out etc
1.5k a month for bills including electricity, internet and mobile phone costs (personal)
so thats for a conservative life, you would have about 22k a month going out and 8k saving...some months that can be up or down, but basically unless you stay home alot or penny pinch you will save about 1,300 gbp a month.
Which, out here, really isnt alot considering the sacrifices you make to be here such as actually not being able to leave the country as you please (say for a family emergency on a weekend, you may have to wait until the working week before you can get an exit visa to fly home..which in more than one case I know of has been too late to see sick family members
).Personally I wouldn't work out here without a multi exit visa.
Or you could do what I do...
£11k per month wage.
free accom,
free high speed internet,
free food ranging from 5 different styles (american, far east and british cuisine etc)
free medical,
free mobile calls back to UK,
free flights to and from UK or place of your choosing 3 times a year,
free use of company LandCruiser,
But with every good thing there is a bad, you have to be in Afghanistan. But if you dont mind coming here, have something to offer a contractor then go for it before it all goes tits up in 2015!
£11k per month wage.
free accom,
free high speed internet,
free food ranging from 5 different styles (american, far east and british cuisine etc)
free medical,
free mobile calls back to UK,
free flights to and from UK or place of your choosing 3 times a year,
free use of company LandCruiser,
But with every good thing there is a bad, you have to be in Afghanistan. But if you dont mind coming here, have something to offer a contractor then go for it before it all goes tits up in 2015!
petop said:
Or you could do what I do...
£11k per month wage.
free accom,
free high speed internet,
free food ranging from 5 different styles (american, far east and british cuisine etc)
free medical,
free mobile calls back to UK,
free flights to and from UK or place of your choosing 3 times a year,
free use of company LandCruiser,
But with every good thing there is a bad, you have to be in Afghanistan. But if you dont mind coming here, have something to offer a contractor then go for it before it all goes tits up in 2015!
Now I would do that, no harder than Libya...do they need a PA..?£11k per month wage.
free accom,
free high speed internet,
free food ranging from 5 different styles (american, far east and british cuisine etc)
free medical,
free mobile calls back to UK,
free flights to and from UK or place of your choosing 3 times a year,
free use of company LandCruiser,
But with every good thing there is a bad, you have to be in Afghanistan. But if you dont mind coming here, have something to offer a contractor then go for it before it all goes tits up in 2015!
Claire
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