THE CHINESE MARKET
Discussion
Roughly:
- 250-300 in 2013
- 200 cars sold in 2012 (around 5% of WW sales)
- 190 in 2011
- 110 in 2010
AM expects China to be 25% of sales by 2017.
http://www.wautom.com/2012/12/aston-martin-sales-i...
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-04-20/aston-mar...
https://www.amoc.org/content/view/1364/844/
- 250-300 in 2013
- 200 cars sold in 2012 (around 5% of WW sales)
- 190 in 2011
- 110 in 2010
AM expects China to be 25% of sales by 2017.
http://www.wautom.com/2012/12/aston-martin-sales-i...
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-04-20/aston-mar...
https://www.amoc.org/content/view/1364/844/
With respect ,what is the point of this topic.
Of course Aston Martin should offer colours and interior spec that appeal to the taste of other cultures but you are surely not suggesting that their new models be shaped around the Chinese market.
What next the Brazilian Aston or maybe the Indian Aston with an embroidered Taj Mahal in the headrest !
No ! All Aston have to do is produce a range of performance cars, at the right price say £75K to £150K with the benefit of fuel efficient modern technology ,that people WANT to buy,it really is not that difficult.
Of course Aston Martin should offer colours and interior spec that appeal to the taste of other cultures but you are surely not suggesting that their new models be shaped around the Chinese market.
What next the Brazilian Aston or maybe the Indian Aston with an embroidered Taj Mahal in the headrest !
No ! All Aston have to do is produce a range of performance cars, at the right price say £75K to £150K with the benefit of fuel efficient modern technology ,that people WANT to buy,it really is not that difficult.
avinalarf said:
With respect ,what is the point of this topic.
Of course Aston Martin should offer colours and interior spec that appeal to the taste of other cultures but you are surely not suggesting that their new models be shaped around the Chinese market.
What next the Brazilian Aston or maybe the Indian Aston with an embroidered Taj Mahal in the headrest !
No ! All Aston have to do is produce a range of performance cars, at the right price say £75K to £150K with the benefit of fuel efficient modern technology ,that people WANT to buy,it really is not that difficult.
What happened with the FFFRR? The last few incarnations, albeit small accents of the design of the L322 seemed a little bling for the home market.Of course Aston Martin should offer colours and interior spec that appeal to the taste of other cultures but you are surely not suggesting that their new models be shaped around the Chinese market.
What next the Brazilian Aston or maybe the Indian Aston with an embroidered Taj Mahal in the headrest !
No ! All Aston have to do is produce a range of performance cars, at the right price say £75K to £150K with the benefit of fuel efficient modern technology ,that people WANT to buy,it really is not that difficult.
Let us hope whatever new platform rolls off the production line at Gaydon that the design encapsulates the emotional content of the car it replaces and without an iota of a accountants input anywhere.
Thank you montecristo.
Good news.
avinalarf said:
With respect ,what is the point of this topic.
Of course Aston Martin should offer colours and interior spec that appeal to the taste of other cultures but you are surely not suggesting that their new models be shaped around the Chinese market.
What next the Brazilian Aston or maybe the Indian Aston with an embroidered Taj Mahal in the headrest !
With your username Sir, if I cannot spot any humour, I always have the feeling that I must have missed something.Of course Aston Martin should offer colours and interior spec that appeal to the taste of other cultures but you are surely not suggesting that their new models be shaped around the Chinese market.
What next the Brazilian Aston or maybe the Indian Aston with an embroidered Taj Mahal in the headrest !
The point of my question is, if other car manufacturers are doing so well in China, I just hope AM are also making good progress.
avinalarf said:
No ! All Aston have to do is produce a range of performance cars, at the right price say £75K to £150K with the benefit of fuel efficient modern technology ,that people WANT to buy, it really is not that difficult.
I hear that AML are looking for a good leader, a person with vision, and the outlook that,
'it really is not that difficult'. ->
Lots of perks, but you will have forum people moaning about you.
Perhaps not then.
Edited by Jon39 on Tuesday 21st January 14:06
Well Jon , this topic has come soon after a similar one regarding the future of Aston Martin.
It must be pretty obvious that Aston will have to be either purchased by a large motor manufacturer as a 'trophy' brand or as is being done incorporate technology from other sources.
The fact remains that they should not and need not alienate their present customer base.
By taking styling cues from the One77 and C100 and incorporating them with modern engine technology I think that's the way to go over the next 10 years .
So, job done.
It must be pretty obvious that Aston will have to be either purchased by a large motor manufacturer as a 'trophy' brand or as is being done incorporate technology from other sources.
The fact remains that they should not and need not alienate their present customer base.
By taking styling cues from the One77 and C100 and incorporating them with modern engine technology I think that's the way to go over the next 10 years .
So, job done.
Edited by avinalarf on Tuesday 21st January 14:19
I didn't think that at this stage of development of the Chinese car market that 'sports cars' are that popular so it is not a huge market. At the pricier end of the market in China the important thing is to 'show' your wealth which why the large SUV's and saloons but the common thing with these is that they will be driven by chauffeurs. It may be some time before the real sports cars get to be desired as much as they are in the Western world. Another interesting snippet I heard was that convertibles were considered 'a poor mans car' as they couldn't afford a roof. Not sure how true that is but it would be interesting to see what the proportion of convertibles sold to hard tops was.
If you look at Astons range the Rapide is the only four seater but lacks space for the owner to be in the back - great for the chauffeur though
I could easily see AML achieving 25% of it's production output into the Chinese market because it would be a tiny element of it.
In my opinion that is why there is so much talk about AML/Bentley/RR having a luxury SUV's in their range - it would be a sales winner in the Chinese and Russian markets and create a profit stream that would drive the development of the rest of their business.
If you look at Astons range the Rapide is the only four seater but lacks space for the owner to be in the back - great for the chauffeur though
I could easily see AML achieving 25% of it's production output into the Chinese market because it would be a tiny element of it.In my opinion that is why there is so much talk about AML/Bentley/RR having a luxury SUV's in their range - it would be a sales winner in the Chinese and Russian markets and create a profit stream that would drive the development of the rest of their business.
The trouble with the Chinese Market it will be very short lived. The Chinese are brilliant at copying. You can sure that as fast as they import products they will be being copied at some rate of knots. Which in turn means that the emerging Asian Markets will in a very short time be swamped with look a like , Bentleys, Astons etc. So to those companies hoping that the future looks bright, it will , for a while. Apparently one of Astons biggest importers is would you believe Germany . The Germans get a bit fed up with Mercs and Beemers and love our Aston Martins. Now there could be a country to concentrate on. Patent laws can be enforced there as well !!!
The trouble with the Chinese Market it will be very short lived. The Chinese are brilliant at copying. You can sure that as fast as they import products they will be being copied at some rate of knots. Which in turn means that the emerging Asian Markets will in a very short time be swamped with look a like , Bentleys, Astons etc. So to those companies hoping that the future looks bright, it will , for a while. Apparently one of Astons biggest importers is would you believe Germany . The Germans get a bit fed up with Mercs and Beemers and love our Aston Martins. Now there could be a country to concentrate on. Patent laws can be enforced there as well !!!
robgt said:
The trouble with the Chinese Market it will be very short lived. The Chinese are brilliant at copying. You can sure that as fast as they import products they will be being copied at some rate of knots. Which in turn means that the emerging Asian Markets will in a be swamped with look a like , Bentleys, Astons etc. So to those companies hoping that the future looks bright, it will , for a while. Apparently one of Astons biggest importers is would you believe Germany . The Germans get a bit fed up with Mercs and Beemers and love our Aston Martins. Now there could be a country to concentrate on. Patent laws can be enforced there as well !!!
"Chinese Market it will be very short lived." "very short time"I see what you did there......
IanV12VR said:
I didn't think that at this stage of development of the Chinese car market that 'sports cars' are that popular so it is not a huge market.
McLaren would disagree with youhttp://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-25710088
Neil1300r said:
McLaren would disagree with you
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-25710088
They may do Neil - but the numbers are tiny in comparison to the numbers of luxury SUV's and saloons that are sold. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-25710088
Also interesting how young the age of their buyers are - new generation coming through I suppose.
Some car manufacturers do indeed make models not just influenced by Chinese taste but actually solely for the Chinese market, such as LWB versions of Audi A6 and BMW 5 series - BMW even make a LWB 3 series just for china !
The wealthy in China buy far fewer 2 door sports cars in %age terms than their equivalents in the West but it's based on a much bigger number, so still an important market - basically all the previous posters are both right & wrong !
But in addition to sports cars which are selling in growing numbers for Aston in China, to not make an SUV is not far off from financial suicide/negligence for Aston - it has been proven by Porsche to be no hindrance to their reputation as a sports car manufacturer or for that matter, a hindrance to the competence of their sports cars and it provides huge financial stability
The fact others on this forum may not like the actual product is an utter irrelevance - you don't have to buy it. But a £100k+ Aston SUV would sell like hot cakes. And just think, it may make it easier for Aston to limit production of it's sports cars to meet supply, which would help residuals and encourage customer specced cars !
The wealthy in China buy far fewer 2 door sports cars in %age terms than their equivalents in the West but it's based on a much bigger number, so still an important market - basically all the previous posters are both right & wrong !
But in addition to sports cars which are selling in growing numbers for Aston in China, to not make an SUV is not far off from financial suicide/negligence for Aston - it has been proven by Porsche to be no hindrance to their reputation as a sports car manufacturer or for that matter, a hindrance to the competence of their sports cars and it provides huge financial stability
The fact others on this forum may not like the actual product is an utter irrelevance - you don't have to buy it. But a £100k+ Aston SUV would sell like hot cakes. And just think, it may make it easier for Aston to limit production of it's sports cars to meet supply, which would help residuals and encourage customer specced cars !
Copy they do...
JLR make pretty much all their profit in China, people walk in and buy a fleet of cars for their hench men and themselves and they do have funny taste (seating arrangements, status is to have a big arm chair in the middle of the back of a car for instance).
AM might be better pandering to the Saudis, chuck in a few helicopters and we have a deal sir?
robgt said:
The trouble with the Chinese Market it will be very short lived. The Chinese are brilliant at copying. You can sure that as fast as they import products they will be being copied at some rate of knots. Which in turn means that the emerging Asian Markets will in a very short time be swamped with look a like , Bentleys, Astons etc. So to those companies hoping that the future looks bright, it will , for a while.
People in China who are/would be interested and can afford buying Bentleys and Astons are not interested in knock-offs, so I fail to see these 'copies' affecting sales of the originals. That doesn't mean to say that these knock-offs won't be bought by people, but rather that it won't affect the sales of the originals in any way since they are two very different target audiences.The copies problem is at the low end of the market where someone is just looking for a decent car.
jonby said:
- it has been proven by Porsche to be no hindrance to their reputation as a sports car manufacturer or for that matter, a hindrance to the competence of their sports cars and it provides huge financial stability
Porsche did have the ability to raid the family parts bin and reuse the Touareg as a starting place. That's why I think its a shame Ford didn't keep AM and Range Rover together. Maybe an Merc/AMG ML as a starting point?Jon1967x said:
jonby said:
- it has been proven by Porsche to be no hindrance to their reputation as a sports car manufacturer or for that matter, a hindrance to the competence of their sports cars and it provides huge financial stability
Porsche did have the ability to raid the family parts bin and reuse the Touareg as a starting place. That's why I think its a shame Ford didn't keep AM and Range Rover together. Maybe an Merc/AMG ML as a starting point?Let's face it, a huge percentage of buyers of big luxury SUVs barely care about dynamic performance or VFM - it's all about image, looks, etc - just look at the X6 !
Its all about status with the Chinese (or the Chinese that we're talking about, the ones that can afford to buy Ferrari/Bentleys etc). In my job I've interviewed a lot of Chinese graduates, you ask them about their ambitions and its always "i want to buy a bentley!"
I used to look at a high end Chinese Soya sauce manufacturer; its product was bought so that people could put this bottle of expensive stuff on their table. Not so they could actually use it
So the copies wont cut the mustard. No matter how good they are they wont have the status.
The wealthy Chinese all seem to drive SUVs; the roads just aren't good enough for regular use of modern sports cars. And yes, as discussed above, you don't drive yourself, you sit in the back seat, so having gadgets etc there is important. Interestingly there hasn't been a classic car market in the past in China (no air-conditioning! and the car is old!), but there are some early signs of that changing - but again i suspect the cars will be bought as status symbols rather than to be used (which in turn suggests the chinese focus will be on classic ferraris, gullwings and maybe db5s)
Aston obviously has the problem that its brand isnt as well known in China and it doesnt have an SUV. Will it build one? I dont know. At the moment it seems happy with a rising wholesale car price albeit on modest volumes. I dont think the manufacturing capacity is there to start making 1000s of SUVs, so i wont be that surprised if its a low priority (given the development cost)
I used to look at a high end Chinese Soya sauce manufacturer; its product was bought so that people could put this bottle of expensive stuff on their table. Not so they could actually use it
So the copies wont cut the mustard. No matter how good they are they wont have the status.
The wealthy Chinese all seem to drive SUVs; the roads just aren't good enough for regular use of modern sports cars. And yes, as discussed above, you don't drive yourself, you sit in the back seat, so having gadgets etc there is important. Interestingly there hasn't been a classic car market in the past in China (no air-conditioning! and the car is old!), but there are some early signs of that changing - but again i suspect the cars will be bought as status symbols rather than to be used (which in turn suggests the chinese focus will be on classic ferraris, gullwings and maybe db5s)
Aston obviously has the problem that its brand isnt as well known in China and it doesnt have an SUV. Will it build one? I dont know. At the moment it seems happy with a rising wholesale car price albeit on modest volumes. I dont think the manufacturing capacity is there to start making 1000s of SUVs, so i wont be that surprised if its a low priority (given the development cost)
Got all excited when I saw the title of this thread. Thought a drive out to here http://www.huaxing.co.uk was being organised!
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