Dog advice please... recall issue.
Discussion
I have two dogs (now), one (Phoebe, black lab)is utterly perfect in every way (except she occasionally swallows things that results in large doses of anguish and huge vets bills) and I've had her since she was a pup and she's now six.
The other is Chester who is a Basset cross/collie. He's only two and is great in most ways apart from the fact he's as thick as two short planks! His recall to owner is terrible! I've not seen him for six months and I'd forgotten how dreadful he can be at coming back, especially if there's another dog about - he just has to play and refuses/totally ignores any request for the little bugger to come back!
This is compounded by the slight problem that I'm a cripple and cannot gallop off after him very quickly if any problem developes... and it does sometimes as he will grumble at bigger dogs on occasion.
I'd love some advice on how to get him to return reliably as calling him is NOT working. Don't want to start smacking him for his bad behaviour, but it's bloody tempting at times....
Other than this, he's a smashing mutt. Had him since he was a baby but as he was his Mummies dog, I tried to ignore him so he'd bond with her when he first took up residence. This was very hard to do, but my wife had never had her own dog and as mutts tend to rather like me, it had to be done... very hard, I love puppies!
Consequently, I didn't really train him.
So now I've inherited a dog that does adore me and Pheebs, but is a bit of a bugger.
How do I get him to come back reliably/on command?
How do I get him to just walk away from other dogs if they grumble at him?
The other is Chester who is a Basset cross/collie. He's only two and is great in most ways apart from the fact he's as thick as two short planks! His recall to owner is terrible! I've not seen him for six months and I'd forgotten how dreadful he can be at coming back, especially if there's another dog about - he just has to play and refuses/totally ignores any request for the little bugger to come back!
This is compounded by the slight problem that I'm a cripple and cannot gallop off after him very quickly if any problem developes... and it does sometimes as he will grumble at bigger dogs on occasion.
I'd love some advice on how to get him to return reliably as calling him is NOT working. Don't want to start smacking him for his bad behaviour, but it's bloody tempting at times....
Other than this, he's a smashing mutt. Had him since he was a baby but as he was his Mummies dog, I tried to ignore him so he'd bond with her when he first took up residence. This was very hard to do, but my wife had never had her own dog and as mutts tend to rather like me, it had to be done... very hard, I love puppies!
Consequently, I didn't really train him.
So now I've inherited a dog that does adore me and Pheebs, but is a bit of a bugger.
How do I get him to come back reliably/on command?
How do I get him to just walk away from other dogs if they grumble at him?
Recall is about training, we use treats (cheese!). Call the dog, give him a treat, let him go away again, call, give a treat, let him go away. On a walk call frequently, give a treat, let him go away. Make the times that the lead goes on an exception and not a rule. Even when you are putting the lead on call, give a treat, make a fuss, then put the lead on. Always make coming back to you a good thing, a fun thing.
It take some work to start with but it works, even in the most exciting circumstances (including once meeting an unexpected flock of sheep and set off in pursuit) they just turn and run back when called.
It take some work to start with but it works, even in the most exciting circumstances (including once meeting an unexpected flock of sheep and set off in pursuit) they just turn and run back when called.
As above, really.
Every time he comes back, a treat. Make the recall noise again (I whistle) as you give the treat to reinforce the connection.
Recall lots for no good reason - If it's always recall - treat - lead, they will not want to come back as it means going back on the lead. Recall - treat, off you go is a much better incentive.
Repeat ad infinitum, eventually even the thickest dogs get it.
There will always be times that something else is more interesting than the treat but I count a 90% "hit rate" as quite successful!
Every time he comes back, a treat. Make the recall noise again (I whistle) as you give the treat to reinforce the connection.
Recall lots for no good reason - If it's always recall - treat - lead, they will not want to come back as it means going back on the lead. Recall - treat, off you go is a much better incentive.
Repeat ad infinitum, eventually even the thickest dogs get it.
There will always be times that something else is more interesting than the treat but I count a 90% "hit rate" as quite successful!
Decent training treats help a lot - chopped up cocktail sausages work well.
Make sure the dog knows you have food on you. Let them wander off and clearly state their name, the command and a hand motion. When they eventually come keep repeating the single command. Treat and fuss the dog so they know they have done well.
Rise and repeat - the trick is consistency, if you change the motion, or the command then you need to start from the beginning.
Get this right and use clear hand signals and you will get to the point where you don't even need to say the command, if the dog is looking at you the hand signal will suffice.
Also don't use a certain command for everything - "here" for example could be used as heel, telling the dog to come in to the house etc and as a result it confuses the animal. "Here" should just be used for recall back to you, "heel" is for them to return to you and follow, "in" if you are calling the dog back in from the garden etc.
Once the dog learns the command, then it will also pick up on how the command is delivered. If I give a command in a stern voice then my dog knows not to mess me around and comes immediately.
It takes a lot of training, perseverance and consistency.
If you let the dog off the lead then its also worth doing some distance training - this way when they do roam off the lead they never go to far front your or out of ear shot.
Make sure the dog knows you have food on you. Let them wander off and clearly state their name, the command and a hand motion. When they eventually come keep repeating the single command. Treat and fuss the dog so they know they have done well.
Rise and repeat - the trick is consistency, if you change the motion, or the command then you need to start from the beginning.
Get this right and use clear hand signals and you will get to the point where you don't even need to say the command, if the dog is looking at you the hand signal will suffice.
Also don't use a certain command for everything - "here" for example could be used as heel, telling the dog to come in to the house etc and as a result it confuses the animal. "Here" should just be used for recall back to you, "heel" is for them to return to you and follow, "in" if you are calling the dog back in from the garden etc.
Once the dog learns the command, then it will also pick up on how the command is delivered. If I give a command in a stern voice then my dog knows not to mess me around and comes immediately.
It takes a lot of training, perseverance and consistency.
If you let the dog off the lead then its also worth doing some distance training - this way when they do roam off the lead they never go to far front your or out of ear shot.
My trainer suggested "High value" treats.
These are normally (like people and the name suggests) treats he doesn't get that often because of X/Y/Z.
We use a bit of salmon,sausage, cheese, or stuff that i buy for myself (in theory) when doing recall training, and then just some pets at home/bakers/pedigree stuff for doing his routine, or sitting before crossing the road etc.
These are normally (like people and the name suggests) treats he doesn't get that often because of X/Y/Z.
We use a bit of salmon,sausage, cheese, or stuff that i buy for myself (in theory) when doing recall training, and then just some pets at home/bakers/pedigree stuff for doing his routine, or sitting before crossing the road etc.
Read the post - the OP can't run....
Be careful that when you do recall you don't punish the dog for not coming earlier....
I also trained mine by preparing their meal out of sight of the dog, then calling them to me for their food. Actually I use a whistle, as I wanted to train the dog to the whistle, so that anyone could walk her and be confident she would come back.
As others have said, make sure you practice recall when you DON'T really need the dog to come to you. If the only time you try to recall the dog is when something fun is happening away from you (another dog to play with) then it will never work.
Be careful that when you do recall you don't punish the dog for not coming earlier....
I also trained mine by preparing their meal out of sight of the dog, then calling them to me for their food. Actually I use a whistle, as I wanted to train the dog to the whistle, so that anyone could walk her and be confident she would come back.
As others have said, make sure you practice recall when you DON'T really need the dog to come to you. If the only time you try to recall the dog is when something fun is happening away from you (another dog to play with) then it will never work.
Train him on an empty stomach.
Use high value rewards (chicken, liver cake, cheese, cocktail sausages, whatever he REALLY likes). Ideally have two people stood opposite each other 10 - 15 ft apart. One of you call the dog with your chosen command (not his name, that's not a command), when he arrives he gets the treat, the other person then calls him using the same command, use hand gestures if it helps, eg hold a hand out and move your arm back so he knows he's coming right up to you and towards the hand. Repeat until out of treats of he stops doing it.
Never repeat a command, you're just teaching him he doesn't have to listen.
Don't bother doing training if the dog is being particularly rubbish, there's no point, try again later. If he's on dry food, make him work for it, have two people stood apart and hand him a couple of bits of food at a time while using the command to call him.
Don't forget, there's a difference between a badly trained dog and a disobedient dog.
Use a training line if you can cope with it, you don't have to get as close to the dog to bring him back.
Use high value rewards (chicken, liver cake, cheese, cocktail sausages, whatever he REALLY likes). Ideally have two people stood opposite each other 10 - 15 ft apart. One of you call the dog with your chosen command (not his name, that's not a command), when he arrives he gets the treat, the other person then calls him using the same command, use hand gestures if it helps, eg hold a hand out and move your arm back so he knows he's coming right up to you and towards the hand. Repeat until out of treats of he stops doing it.
Never repeat a command, you're just teaching him he doesn't have to listen.
Don't bother doing training if the dog is being particularly rubbish, there's no point, try again later. If he's on dry food, make him work for it, have two people stood apart and hand him a couple of bits of food at a time while using the command to call him.
Don't forget, there's a difference between a badly trained dog and a disobedient dog.
Use a training line if you can cope with it, you don't have to get as close to the dog to bring him back.
The other thing that makes it a whole lot easier, but may be hard to arrange, is to do it with another dog or dogs who already do it. After training our first it became so much easier with subsequent ones because they wanted to join in whatever the other one was doing. Our current Golden barely got any training at all, we'd call, the trained one would run to us and the new one came as well.
Took note of all the good advise given and went out today armed with his favourite treats... an absolute pocket full! He was, if anything bloody worse!!!!!
I was with a mate whos dog is brilliant and Phoebe who is even more brilliant, both come instantly when called and Pheebs will come if I just look at her a certain way.
If there's another dog about he just totally ignores everything, commands, noises, whistles even food - and he does love his belly!
When there were no other dogs about, he did return about 80% of the time for his treat, but every dog he sees, he's off.
I'm also ashamed to admit he did get a 'clunk' today. He growled (pretty aggresively) at a bigger dog and had to be grabbed sharpish.
I'm not going to give up on him, and there;s always the option of getting a long lead, but I think it's unfair to keep him on his lead when every other dog is allowed off, especially Phoebe.
I was with a mate whos dog is brilliant and Phoebe who is even more brilliant, both come instantly when called and Pheebs will come if I just look at her a certain way.
If there's another dog about he just totally ignores everything, commands, noises, whistles even food - and he does love his belly!
When there were no other dogs about, he did return about 80% of the time for his treat, but every dog he sees, he's off.
I'm also ashamed to admit he did get a 'clunk' today. He growled (pretty aggresively) at a bigger dog and had to be grabbed sharpish.
I'm not going to give up on him, and there;s always the option of getting a long lead, but I think it's unfair to keep him on his lead when every other dog is allowed off, especially Phoebe.
We had problems with ours until , one day he just realised what he had to do, You said about it being unfair as the other dogs are off the lead,
You have to show him who's boss , you could also try really long mountaineering rope , Hounds are renown for recall problems, it's just a matter of patience & perseverance ,
The dog must be aware that you're his master at all times.
You have to show him who's boss , you could also try really long mountaineering rope , Hounds are renown for recall problems, it's just a matter of patience & perseverance ,
The dog must be aware that you're his master at all times.
Xtriple129 said:
Took note of all the good advise given and went out today armed with his favourite treats... an absolute pocket full! He was, if anything bloody worse!!!!!
I was with a mate whos dog is brilliant and Phoebe who is even more brilliant, both come instantly when called and Pheebs will come if I just look at her a certain way.
If there's another dog about he just totally ignores everything, commands, noises, whistles even food - and he does love his belly!
When there were no other dogs about, he did return about 80% of the time for his treat, but every dog he sees, he's off.
I'm also ashamed to admit he did get a 'clunk' today. He growled (pretty aggresively) at a bigger dog and had to be grabbed sharpish.
I'm not going to give up on him, and there;s always the option of getting a long lead, but I think it's unfair to keep him on his lead when every other dog is allowed off, especially Phoebe.
I would keep him on a longer lead,you have control you are the boss.I was with a mate whos dog is brilliant and Phoebe who is even more brilliant, both come instantly when called and Pheebs will come if I just look at her a certain way.
If there's another dog about he just totally ignores everything, commands, noises, whistles even food - and he does love his belly!
When there were no other dogs about, he did return about 80% of the time for his treat, but every dog he sees, he's off.
I'm also ashamed to admit he did get a 'clunk' today. He growled (pretty aggresively) at a bigger dog and had to be grabbed sharpish.
I'm not going to give up on him, and there;s always the option of getting a long lead, but I think it's unfair to keep him on his lead when every other dog is allowed off, especially Phoebe.
The only dog who gave me trouble off the lead was a Irish terrier lovely dog at home but always ready for a scrap.With time and patience it got better but he was always unpredictable.I always gave him his freedom with no dogs about.
Xtriple129 said:
Took note of all the good advise given and went out today armed with his favourite treats... an absolute pocket full! He was, if anything bloody worse!!!!!
You have to take it all the way back to square one. Start at home, with no other distractions. Whenever he is coming towards you, give him the "come" command and offer a treat. Keep giving the command after the action for as long as it takes for him to make the association between the word and the action. Then start giving the command before the action. If at any point it isn't working you have gone too fast and need to go back a stage. Then keep building it up. Try the garden (with no distractions). The park (with no distractions). The house (with a little distractions). And so on. Again - If at any point it isn't working you have gone too fast and need to go back a stage. You essentially have to treat him like an 8 week old puppy that doesn't know anything.Xtriple129 said:
Took note of all the good advise given and went out today armed with his favourite treats... an absolute pocket full! He was, if anything bloody worse!!!!!
I was with a mate whos dog is brilliant and Phoebe who is even more brilliant, both come instantly when called and Pheebs will come if I just look at her a certain way.
If there's another dog about he just totally ignores everything, commands, noises, whistles even food - and he does love his belly!
When there were no other dogs about, he did return about 80% of the time for his treat, but every dog he sees, he's off.
I'm also ashamed to admit he did get a 'clunk' today. He growled (pretty aggresively) at a bigger dog and had to be grabbed sharpish.
I'm not going to give up on him, and there;s always the option of getting a long lead, but I think it's unfair to keep him on his lead when every other dog is allowed off, especially Phoebe.
Keep on it - it won't happen in a day. Rinse repeat on a daily basis - you will break him down. Remember though constancy is really important, the word, tone, movement need to be the same time and time again. Also make sure you keep the command short - Here / In / Down / Bed / Sit. I was with a mate whos dog is brilliant and Phoebe who is even more brilliant, both come instantly when called and Pheebs will come if I just look at her a certain way.
If there's another dog about he just totally ignores everything, commands, noises, whistles even food - and he does love his belly!
When there were no other dogs about, he did return about 80% of the time for his treat, but every dog he sees, he's off.
I'm also ashamed to admit he did get a 'clunk' today. He growled (pretty aggresively) at a bigger dog and had to be grabbed sharpish.
I'm not going to give up on him, and there;s always the option of getting a long lead, but I think it's unfair to keep him on his lead when every other dog is allowed off, especially Phoebe.
If you are finding it difficult to get out you can also do it in the house. Let the dog wander out of the room and then shout the "here" command. Pretty easy to do whilst you are on the sofa watching TV and the house is generally free of distractions. It is important though that you also do the training outside otherwise the dog think the here command only applies indoors.
Good luck with it!
Tried again today. Rainy miserable weather so a lot less mutts about. I discovered that he responds to 'c'mon' in addition to his name. If you don't say his name first he totally ignores you. But, he did come back 100% of the time... until another dog appears on the scene when he becomes totally ignorant! He just wants to play/grumble with/at them. Recall success rate fell to about 5%!
I was sat watching him while I had a fag and played with Phoebe. He seems to be totally bored! He's not interested in balls or sticks and just sort of wanders about aimlessly until another dog appears when he chirps up.
Perhaps I need to engage him more?
I was sat watching him while I had a fag and played with Phoebe. He seems to be totally bored! He's not interested in balls or sticks and just sort of wanders about aimlessly until another dog appears when he chirps up.
Perhaps I need to engage him more?
Part of the problem is his breeding - he is part hound, and as such will have selective deafness to anything you say if he feels there is something better to look at / sniff / play with / interact with. Hounds get their noses down and are gone - we have a trail hound, and started to let him off a few months after getting him, not realising just how strong the must-follow-my-nose urges are. We ended up realising this when we lost him for nearly 45 minbutes while he was off sniffing whatever good smells it was!
Try to get hold of a long lead (we used horse lunge lines tied together) and practice the recall while he is on the lead - that way if there are other distractions (i.e. other dogs) you have control over him and can, if needed, slowly pull him back to you while calling his name and then treating him when he gets to you. It may be quite a long process, but once he starts coming back while he is on the lead, you can find an enclosed area and let him off, but again keep practicing the recall. Initially we always used to treat when the hound came back, but now he gets treats about 25% of the time (but he knows we have them on us). The way that Woody responded to the training was fantastic (eventually) and now he can be let off almost anywhere and we are confident he will come back when told to (granted there are times when he still gets the deafness, but that's a hound thing, and we can live with it).
Good luck with it!
Try to get hold of a long lead (we used horse lunge lines tied together) and practice the recall while he is on the lead - that way if there are other distractions (i.e. other dogs) you have control over him and can, if needed, slowly pull him back to you while calling his name and then treating him when he gets to you. It may be quite a long process, but once he starts coming back while he is on the lead, you can find an enclosed area and let him off, but again keep practicing the recall. Initially we always used to treat when the hound came back, but now he gets treats about 25% of the time (but he knows we have them on us). The way that Woody responded to the training was fantastic (eventually) and now he can be let off almost anywhere and we are confident he will come back when told to (granted there are times when he still gets the deafness, but that's a hound thing, and we can live with it).
Good luck with it!
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