Dear Aston Martin
Discussion
Dear Aston Martin, whilst I am flattered that you seem to have sort of followed my idea of producing and marketing a more radical Vantage V8 I fear that your N430 is not quite what I had in mind. If I was in a position to advise a potential purchaser of a new V8 Vantage I would advocate the V8S. That is a model in its own right. Producing a supposed track inspired model that despite its somewhat gaudy exterior is without doubt a reduced spec model is not the way to go. I would fear that the long term residual value will be dire.
Porsche have the marketing so very right. Build a hot version of an existing car. Sell it for more than the standard car, then offer all the refinements as options. Brilliant!
Here is a scenario. I return home in September with a spangly new N430. My good neighbour pops round to have a peep. How do I defend its appearance and race track illusion? I can hardly declare that it has soft suspension , no sport button, its manual and looks like no other Aston Martin of old?
To conclude Aston Martin, it is not too late to withdraw this and other similar planned incarnations, stick to your roots and heritage. I am sure that you have read the reaction from others on this subject . Basically don't do it! Pull the promotional video as well because that is bad as well.
AM please consider a new stand alone model that has the best manual seats, more power, CF bonnet, wings, tailgate, doors and maybe some body enhancements to distinguish from the standard cars. With the weight saved fit the car with CCM brakes and ultra light wheels . Sell this car for the same price as the V8S with the option of adding all the fripperies. How can it fail? Plus you will not alienate existing customer brand loyalty by trashing the residual value of their current car.
Porsche have the marketing so very right. Build a hot version of an existing car. Sell it for more than the standard car, then offer all the refinements as options. Brilliant!
Here is a scenario. I return home in September with a spangly new N430. My good neighbour pops round to have a peep. How do I defend its appearance and race track illusion? I can hardly declare that it has soft suspension , no sport button, its manual and looks like no other Aston Martin of old?
To conclude Aston Martin, it is not too late to withdraw this and other similar planned incarnations, stick to your roots and heritage. I am sure that you have read the reaction from others on this subject . Basically don't do it! Pull the promotional video as well because that is bad as well.
AM please consider a new stand alone model that has the best manual seats, more power, CF bonnet, wings, tailgate, doors and maybe some body enhancements to distinguish from the standard cars. With the weight saved fit the car with CCM brakes and ultra light wheels . Sell this car for the same price as the V8S with the option of adding all the fripperies. How can it fail? Plus you will not alienate existing customer brand loyalty by trashing the residual value of their current car.
Agreed on this, Aston need a GT3 style car, the N400 was too lame, and the N24 was too extreme, and I don't like the colour scheme of the N430
The look of the GT4 Vantage is nice with the rear spoiler and later bumpers and more aggressive skirt, develop something like that into a road racer and that would be spot on in my eye
The look of the GT4 Vantage is nice with the rear spoiler and later bumpers and more aggressive skirt, develop something like that into a road racer and that would be spot on in my eye
Cheers Mikey, what do you mean this time? 
Can you imagine the AM Dealer Network reaction when the N430 was first shown to them? They are the poor sods who will be under pressure to sell it. But Hey, a good salesman can sell anything.
Note to Aston Martin. Don't do it !! It's not too late!
Can you imagine the AM Dealer Network reaction when the N430 was first shown to them? They are the poor sods who will be under pressure to sell it. But Hey, a good salesman can sell anything.
Note to Aston Martin. Don't do it !! It's not too late!
Well I am a potentially new AM buyer so I can give my perspective....
I am torn between whether the N430 gets me close to my ideal spec as well as offering some interesting colour combinations (providing I can drop the lipstick) or whether it devalues the brand and in particular the Vantage range somewhat.
Choosing the Vantage S over the Vantage is hard enough given what £10K difference gets you (less and less it seems once you really dive into the specs) but there is just enough to differentiate it. Now the N430 potentially makes neither the Vantage or Vantage S make sense but may well drive me away altogether if the spec and configurability do not stack up.
I am open minded on this and await the facts with interest but truth is this is a bit of a curve ball which may send me running as it all gets too difficult. On the other hand it aay prove to be inspired and perfect timing for me. You will note that I am as confused as the AM messaging :-)
I am torn between whether the N430 gets me close to my ideal spec as well as offering some interesting colour combinations (providing I can drop the lipstick) or whether it devalues the brand and in particular the Vantage range somewhat.
Choosing the Vantage S over the Vantage is hard enough given what £10K difference gets you (less and less it seems once you really dive into the specs) but there is just enough to differentiate it. Now the N430 potentially makes neither the Vantage or Vantage S make sense but may well drive me away altogether if the spec and configurability do not stack up.
I am open minded on this and await the facts with interest but truth is this is a bit of a curve ball which may send me running as it all gets too difficult. On the other hand it aay prove to be inspired and perfect timing for me. You will note that I am as confused as the AM messaging :-)
Hashluck, AM did it to me last year with the SP10, just as I was just about to order the S. Exactly the same issues as we've seen today - dealer not fully briefed on the new car spec before the press launch. Shocking really. Anyway, I saw a Ceramic black car and that, along with all the Alcantara in the SP10, wasn't for me so I quickly went back to the S. Personally I think the S is a significant step up on the standard Vantage. If the N430 is closer to the S then it may be for you. I'd try those sports seats though, not everyone likes them. One other thought, If you like Ceramic, there may be deal out there on an SP10?
Thanks Phil. The SP10 is great except I don't want a black car or a black interior :-) plus there would still be options to add. I already did look at this since they are still building SP10a at the factory but it is not for me.
Vantage spec has been improved to match S spec almost by stealth. Tick the sports exhaust and sports suspension box on the Vantage and you are there mechanically (ignoring the extra 10 horses which I am not sure I fully believe anyway)
Those two options add £2k. Then add Bluetooth, Sat Nav and Cruise for £2.5K and you really are there saving over £5K on the S!
What else makes up the difference? CF splitter and diffuser (£4K option on Vantage), Clear Lamps (which I don't like) and some interior trim, er that is about it.
So it is really difficult to make a case for the S (though bizarrely I would still choose one, hoping for easier resale down the line).
My hope was/is that the N430 will close that gap a little with S spec for less money. Let us see (there is certainly no CF splitter). Then of course as you say you actually have to like the way it looks and the seats etc (though sports seats rather than lightweights can be fitted in the N43O even if that somewhat defeats the object of it!)
Vantage spec has been improved to match S spec almost by stealth. Tick the sports exhaust and sports suspension box on the Vantage and you are there mechanically (ignoring the extra 10 horses which I am not sure I fully believe anyway)
Those two options add £2k. Then add Bluetooth, Sat Nav and Cruise for £2.5K and you really are there saving over £5K on the S!
What else makes up the difference? CF splitter and diffuser (£4K option on Vantage), Clear Lamps (which I don't like) and some interior trim, er that is about it.
So it is really difficult to make a case for the S (though bizarrely I would still choose one, hoping for easier resale down the line).
My hope was/is that the N430 will close that gap a little with S spec for less money. Let us see (there is certainly no CF splitter). Then of course as you say you actually have to like the way it looks and the seats etc (though sports seats rather than lightweights can be fitted in the N43O even if that somewhat defeats the object of it!)
hashluck said:
Vantage spec has been improved to match S spec almost by stealth. Tick the sports exhaust and sports suspension box on the Vantage and you are there mechanically (ignoring the extra 10 horses which I am not sure I fully believe anyway)
What else makes up the difference? CF splitter and diffuser (£4K option on Vantage), Clear Lamps (which I don't like) and some interior trim, er that is about it.
So it is really difficult to make a case for the S (though bizarrely I would still choose one, hoping for easier resale down the line).
My hope was/is that the N430 will close that gap a little with S spec for less money. Let us see (there is certainly no CF splitter). Then of course as you say you actually have to like the way it looks and the seats etc (though sports seats rather than lightweights can be fitted in the N43O even if that somewhat defeats the object of it!)
Couple of things hereWhat else makes up the difference? CF splitter and diffuser (£4K option on Vantage), Clear Lamps (which I don't like) and some interior trim, er that is about it.
So it is really difficult to make a case for the S (though bizarrely I would still choose one, hoping for easier resale down the line).
My hope was/is that the N430 will close that gap a little with S spec for less money. Let us see (there is certainly no CF splitter). Then of course as you say you actually have to like the way it looks and the seats etc (though sports seats rather than lightweights can be fitted in the N43O even if that somewhat defeats the object of it!)
The 10 BHP comes for the N400 air boxes that allows more air through at higher rpm, it is a real gain IME of my std 4.7 vs my S
The S also has the Sports button that the Std & N430 don't have
It also has the sports exhaust
Some more checks are need on the suspension now fitted to the S & N430, My S came with sports suspension. More recently they have been shipping with comfort suspension.
In your position I'd be tempted by the N430 providing the above are covered off, but you won't get the Sport button for the sharper throttle response (mine is always on) and you may have to spend a bit more to get the right options on it.
Rob, I fear this has nothing to do with your our any other suggestions, it's just a parts bin special edition in the mould of the N420. I have posted the full spec in the N420 thread.
I do understand ( and in principle agree with) your thoughts, but Aston are currently investing heavily in the next generation with AMG/Merc technology, as you know they have also involved many current owners in this process But they have to keep stimulating interest in the current model and just like all other manufacturers a tasty special edition is always a good option, Porsche did plenty of that with the 997 series before the 991 came out! They have also launched a DB9 SE at the same time!
I do understand ( and in principle agree with) your thoughts, but Aston are currently investing heavily in the next generation with AMG/Merc technology, as you know they have also involved many current owners in this process But they have to keep stimulating interest in the current model and just like all other manufacturers a tasty special edition is always a good option, Porsche did plenty of that with the 997 series before the 991 came out! They have also launched a DB9 SE at the same time!
hashluck said:
Thanks Phil. The SP10 is great except I don't want a black car or a black interior :-)
Those two options add £2k. Then add Bluetooth, Sat Nav and Cruise for £2.5K and you really are there saving over £5K on the S!
ceramic grey is not that black, there is mid/deep brown tinge to it -- it photographs very black for some reason. I love it. Thing is, as you say, can't get any interior except black.Those two options add £2k. Then add Bluetooth, Sat Nav and Cruise for £2.5K and you really are there saving over £5K on the S!
SP10 also has the forged alloys, which is at least a £2k option on the V8/S.
As SP10 is £6000 more than standard V8 (Roadster), it's good value as you get all the V8S bits plus 700 Watt audio and 10 spoke forged alloys.
SFO said:
hashluck said:
Thanks Phil. The SP10 is great except I don't want a black car or a black interior :-)
Those two options add £2k. Then add Bluetooth, Sat Nav and Cruise for £2.5K and you really are there saving over £5K on the S!
ceramic grey is not that black, there is mid/deep brown tinge to it -- it photographs very black for some reason. I love it. Thing is, as you say, can't get any interior except black.Those two options add £2k. Then add Bluetooth, Sat Nav and Cruise for £2.5K and you really are there saving over £5K on the S!
SP10 also has the forged alloys, which is at least a £2k option on the V8/S.
As SP10 is £6000 more than standard V8 (Roadster), it's good value as you get all the V8S bits plus 700 Watt audio and 10 spoke forged alloys.
jonby said:
SFO said:
hashluck said:
Thanks Phil. The SP10 is great except I don't want a black car or a black interior :-)
Those two options add £2k. Then add Bluetooth, Sat Nav and Cruise for £2.5K and you really are there saving over £5K on the S!
ceramic grey is not that black, there is mid/deep brown tinge to it -- it photographs very black for some reason. I love it. Thing is, as you say, can't get any interior except black.Those two options add £2k. Then add Bluetooth, Sat Nav and Cruise for £2.5K and you really are there saving over £5K on the S!
SP10 also has the forged alloys, which is at least a £2k option on the V8/S.
As SP10 is £6000 more than standard V8 (Roadster), it's good value as you get all the V8S bits plus 700 Watt audio and 10 spoke forged alloys.
Everyone will love the brand, but I think everyone would like them slightly more if they took a risk. Something that was a bit controversial.
I can understand the idea that if all badges were removed you could still tell it was an Aston - but wouldn't expect people to also be able to tell which Aston?
This N430 is of the copy and paste mentality. Not in bodywork but from the 4.3 roll-out too and life-cycle too. And that's a shame from a brand with so much to offer.
If you want a 'Cup' version of the Vantage why not shed some serious weight (carbon parts beyond the cosmetics), make it a very limited edition and give it something no Vantage has had before, whether it's a re-mapping of the Sportshift or even something experimental like the Dual Clutch system. As other posters have then said you 'gauge market reaction' and then roll those features out across the rest of the Vantage range.
"Hello sir, would you like the 'Cup' bonnet on your Vantage S for £5,000? It sheds 5 kilos off the aluminium version."
These special pieces are a chance to do something outlandish and show potential for the platform, Aston seems to be using it as an opportunity to keep the paint shop busy.
I can understand the idea that if all badges were removed you could still tell it was an Aston - but wouldn't expect people to also be able to tell which Aston?
This N430 is of the copy and paste mentality. Not in bodywork but from the 4.3 roll-out too and life-cycle too. And that's a shame from a brand with so much to offer.
If you want a 'Cup' version of the Vantage why not shed some serious weight (carbon parts beyond the cosmetics), make it a very limited edition and give it something no Vantage has had before, whether it's a re-mapping of the Sportshift or even something experimental like the Dual Clutch system. As other posters have then said you 'gauge market reaction' and then roll those features out across the rest of the Vantage range.
"Hello sir, would you like the 'Cup' bonnet on your Vantage S for £5,000? It sheds 5 kilos off the aluminium version."
These special pieces are a chance to do something outlandish and show potential for the platform, Aston seems to be using it as an opportunity to keep the paint shop busy.
Painting the N430 in colours that have nothing whatsoever to do with the brand is going to do little more than invite ridicule and scepticism. Dear God what are you thinking ?
Aston Martin why would I or others contemplate changing their V8's for a car that boasts no improvements whatsoever over our existing cars.?
I firmly believe that the way forward is to come up with a new V8 Vantage boasting less weight more power but one that embodies everything that is Aston Martin. Fit it with the V12's brakes and suspension, revise its asthmatic breathing. How about calling it an RS?
This car that I am proposing will not humble a 911 GT3 It will be a very special Aston Martin, one which will make potential new owners feel very individual indeed. Trashing AM's best selling car by instilling marketing that echoes Rover of old is not the way forward.
As always my loyalty to AM is a little shaken and stirred but still intact.
Love it Molly, thank you.
Rob is right though with the halo car Aston needs even if it a bit an extreme 'loss leader' as probably the RS is to Porsche. Marketing is very important to car ranges and each brand needs their 'realistic saleable' poster car. Something that fills the pages of all the mags and then is chewed and chewed over in the forums. See what Jag is doing with 'S' 'RS' etc - pure marketing and brand strengthening.
Aston needs to lose weight!!! Then I would buy one.
Rob is right though with the halo car Aston needs even if it a bit an extreme 'loss leader' as probably the RS is to Porsche. Marketing is very important to car ranges and each brand needs their 'realistic saleable' poster car. Something that fills the pages of all the mags and then is chewed and chewed over in the forums. See what Jag is doing with 'S' 'RS' etc - pure marketing and brand strengthening.
Aston needs to lose weight!!! Then I would buy one.
GT3andy said:
Love it Molly, thank you.
Rob is right though with the halo car Aston needs even if it a bit an extreme 'loss leader' as probably the RS is to Porsche. Marketing is very important to car ranges and each brand needs their 'realistic saleable' poster car. Something that fills the pages of all the mags and then is chewed and chewed over in the forums. See what Jag is doing with 'S' 'RS' etc - pure marketing and brand strengthening.
Aston needs to lose weight!!! Then I would buy one.
Nice work Andy - that deserves another (self-indulgent Rob is right though with the halo car Aston needs even if it a bit an extreme 'loss leader' as probably the RS is to Porsche. Marketing is very important to car ranges and each brand needs their 'realistic saleable' poster car. Something that fills the pages of all the mags and then is chewed and chewed over in the forums. See what Jag is doing with 'S' 'RS' etc - pure marketing and brand strengthening.
Aston needs to lose weight!!! Then I would buy one.
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