how low do you go
Discussion
'm looking for a suspension which is lower and stiffer than original. 450/400 springs would be good for my taste. Ground clearance is no problem. But it should work well. Any experience with shorter dampers or something like that. Please with pics of the side few would be great.
Dennis
Dennis
The lowest point on the car is the 3rd quarter of the exhaust (the sump is pretty close though) and at this height she still goes over 90% of speed bumps without grounding out. Doesn't rub on 17" wheels, 40 profile tyres on the front 45 on the back. Most curbs are higher than the bottom of the door though so can't really park near pavements.
Rambling on my phone whilst working...
As I said in the standard ride height thread, this suspension has been designed so that the lower arms sit level which mine obviously don't, so it could be improved on. The thing is, if I wanted to go around a track as fast as possible I wouldn't have bought a chim. Among the reasons that I bought one of these is because I like the way they look, and I think they look much better on 17 inch wheels all around and slightly lower than standard.
That said, it drives and handles much better than standard. It's on ggpros on the same spring weights as everyone suggests with the damper setting about the same too, the only difference in the settings is the ride height. Tyres are proxes which have a slightly spongey side wall which helps with the road comfort. I would struggle to notice any difference in handling on the road and in the little track play about that I've had (only bought the car last summer) I have to be trying silly hard before I think that it could do with a bit of adjustment.
Look at it this way, If I started to think I was struggling with traction I would probably be looking at corner weighting and playing about with the rest of the geo expecting bigger improvements before I raised the suspension.
As I said in the standard ride height thread, this suspension has been designed so that the lower arms sit level which mine obviously don't, so it could be improved on. The thing is, if I wanted to go around a track as fast as possible I wouldn't have bought a chim. Among the reasons that I bought one of these is because I like the way they look, and I think they look much better on 17 inch wheels all around and slightly lower than standard.
That said, it drives and handles much better than standard. It's on ggpros on the same spring weights as everyone suggests with the damper setting about the same too, the only difference in the settings is the ride height. Tyres are proxes which have a slightly spongey side wall which helps with the road comfort. I would struggle to notice any difference in handling on the road and in the little track play about that I've had (only bought the car last summer) I have to be trying silly hard before I think that it could do with a bit of adjustment.
Look at it this way, If I started to think I was struggling with traction I would probably be looking at corner weighting and playing about with the rest of the geo expecting bigger improvements before I raised the suspension.
Not got a great side on pic of mine, but Rich at Southways was saying mine was pretty low (slammed I think was the yoof word he used). Not a deliberate ploy by me, just the settings they had after APM fitted the GGP's.
I only get a few problems with the larger speed humps and then I just go over them diagonally.
I only get a few problems with the larger speed humps and then I just go over them diagonally.
Mark. said:
Not got a great side on pic of mine, but Rich at Southways was saying mine was pretty low (slammed I think was the yoof word he used). Not a deliberate ploy by me, just the settings they had after APM fitted the GGP's.
I only get a few problems with the larger speed humps and then I just go over them diagonally.
Andy does like to get your Chimaera 'down in the dirt so to speak'.I only get a few problems with the larger speed humps and then I just go over them diagonally.
Mine is about 25mm lower than standard as I recall, as set up by APM as well.
Certainly seemed to handle noticeably better each time he has done some suspension work for me (shocks once, then later front shock and wishbones).
Here is how mine looked:
This is empty. With a lot of luggage in the boot (like when we went camping) it was way too low. Kept scraping on everything. Speed bumps were ok, but when pressing on a bit on a bumpy road occasionally you would get the suspension to compress off one bump, right on top of another and it would grind the exhaust on the road. It was also a pain to have to worry about hitting the door on pavements when parallel parked.
I've since lifted it back up to about 150mm rear and 140mm front and it sits much better now and rides nicer.
This is empty. With a lot of luggage in the boot (like when we went camping) it was way too low. Kept scraping on everything. Speed bumps were ok, but when pressing on a bit on a bumpy road occasionally you would get the suspension to compress off one bump, right on top of another and it would grind the exhaust on the road. It was also a pain to have to worry about hitting the door on pavements when parallel parked.
I've since lifted it back up to about 150mm rear and 140mm front and it sits much better now and rides nicer.
I agree with that Zed, to low and the car handles dangerously, other than it looks Slammed there is no way the suspension works better with 3 inches of travel. The main thing is that the chassis is getting stressed at many points when running rock hard shocks and slamming it into the ground.
Now I know why its called slammed
I fully believe a low car works well on track but on the road, no chance!
For chaps considering lowering their car.
The brakes can get out of balance, you will lock up easily as there's less weight pushing the footprint into the ground,
Snap oversteer, under steer, wheels going light over uneaven roads, vibrations causing other components to fail,
It does not handle better it handles worse in my book, I've spent a full day adjusting ride heights, its a compromise that the standard settings take into account, lower yes but my a few mm and you can feel the difference!
To low is simply wrong. But it looks good!!!!
Now I know why its called slammed
I fully believe a low car works well on track but on the road, no chance!
For chaps considering lowering their car.
The brakes can get out of balance, you will lock up easily as there's less weight pushing the footprint into the ground,
Snap oversteer, under steer, wheels going light over uneaven roads, vibrations causing other components to fail,
It does not handle better it handles worse in my book, I've spent a full day adjusting ride heights, its a compromise that the standard settings take into account, lower yes but my a few mm and you can feel the difference!
To low is simply wrong. But it looks good!!!!
From the sound of it zeds car was grounding out because there was too much weight in the boot for the spring rates, he will still get the same amount of movement and handling after raising the suspension it just won't hit the road as often. Why are you guessing at 3 inches of travel and how much do you want, I know the engines found in a range rover but you're not planning on doing the dakar in it are you?
The stiffness of the suspension is controlled by the damper settings not the ride height, I haven't cut the springs on standard shocks like what chavs do with novas. My damper settings are the same as a few people on here, about half way up front and a bit less on the back to stop it skipping about, so my chassis is no more stressed than anyone else on ggpros.
s p a c e m a n said:
...The stiffness of the suspension is controlled by the damper settings not the ride height...
Like Danny says over a few undulating bumps the rear can sit down a bit and sometimes ground out, at night it's pretty cool with the sparks
There's a safety element here and you have totally ignored that fact.
So if your car can only travel a few inches you must set it up harder or your slamming the ground, yes or no!
Your rebound will be diabolical but whatever. If it handles so well why haven't we all done that.
That's a good question,
I just disagree entirely that the car will handle better, I've tried every which way and it does not handle better,different yes but better,,,,,, on a corner with positive camber maybe but that's it.
There's lots of us who are not techi and I'm trying to bring realism to this thread,
Have you done an emergency stop on a bumpy road, I doubt it.
If anything its your tyres doing all the work.
I wish I could agree with you but I just can't, sorry if that upsets you.
Ever seen a rally car sitting on the floor, they handle don't they!
Ever seen a race car go over a bump, pathetic at dealing with it!
End of rant. Excuse me for being sensible.
So if your car can only travel a few inches you must set it up harder or your slamming the ground, yes or no!
Your rebound will be diabolical but whatever. If it handles so well why haven't we all done that.
That's a good question,
I just disagree entirely that the car will handle better, I've tried every which way and it does not handle better,different yes but better,,,,,, on a corner with positive camber maybe but that's it.
There's lots of us who are not techi and I'm trying to bring realism to this thread,
Have you done an emergency stop on a bumpy road, I doubt it.
If anything its your tyres doing all the work.
I wish I could agree with you but I just can't, sorry if that upsets you.
Ever seen a rally car sitting on the floor, they handle don't they!
Ever seen a race car go over a bump, pathetic at dealing with it!
End of rant. Excuse me for being sensible.
spaceman
,your car looks great. its close to what i prefer. maybe 1 cm higher for me. and it seems to work on that high.
(we have 2 chimaeras here which are very low. close to yours. they are export cars. one came to Germany and the otherone came over Japan to us. its original factory suspension. its a sport package. same springs with stiffer dampers. with more ore deeper grooves in the damper.there is a small article in "the tvr Griffith story"by roger a. Shackleton.)
how many cm do you have from outrigger to the bottom? and have you some thread left,or are you on the bottom.?
and which springs do you use? 400/325
I'd tried this on Gaz classic. but I would go for 450/400 any recommendations about that?
Dennis
,your car looks great. its close to what i prefer. maybe 1 cm higher for me. and it seems to work on that high.
(we have 2 chimaeras here which are very low. close to yours. they are export cars. one came to Germany and the otherone came over Japan to us. its original factory suspension. its a sport package. same springs with stiffer dampers. with more ore deeper grooves in the damper.there is a small article in "the tvr Griffith story"by roger a. Shackleton.)
how many cm do you have from outrigger to the bottom? and have you some thread left,or are you on the bottom.?
and which springs do you use? 400/325
I'd tried this on Gaz classic. but I would go for 450/400 any recommendations about that?
Dennis
Alun450 said:
There's a safety element here and you have totally ignored that fact.
So if your car can only travel a few inches you must set it up harder or your slamming the ground, yes or no!
Your rebound will be diabolical but whatever. If it handles so well why haven't we all done that.
That's a good question,
I just disagree entirely that the car will handle better, I've tried every which way and it does not handle better,different yes but better,,,,,, on a corner with positive camber maybe but that's it.
There's lots of us who are not techi and I'm trying to bring realism to this thread,
Have you done an emergency stop on a bumpy road, I doubt it.
If anything its your tyres doing all the work.
I wish I could agree with you but I just can't, sorry if that upsets you.
Ever seen a rally car sitting on the floor, they handle don't they!
Ever seen a race car go over a bump, pathetic at dealing with it!
End of rant. Excuse me for being sensible.
So if your car can only travel a few inches you must set it up harder or your slamming the ground, yes or no!
Your rebound will be diabolical but whatever. If it handles so well why haven't we all done that.
That's a good question,
I just disagree entirely that the car will handle better, I've tried every which way and it does not handle better,different yes but better,,,,,, on a corner with positive camber maybe but that's it.
There's lots of us who are not techi and I'm trying to bring realism to this thread,
Have you done an emergency stop on a bumpy road, I doubt it.
If anything its your tyres doing all the work.
I wish I could agree with you but I just can't, sorry if that upsets you.
Ever seen a rally car sitting on the floor, they handle don't they!
Ever seen a race car go over a bump, pathetic at dealing with it!
End of rant. Excuse me for being sensible.
These cars handle far better with the original amount of travel and soft springs and damping. I had mine set up on the firm side, after a day spent at Centre of Gravity it handles a million times better and is what could best be described as 'floaty'.Dennis,
I'm using a set of Gaz Gold Pros with the spring rate of Front:450 Rear:375 which I would say are optimal for track work, if I was just going to use it on the road I would have used Front:400 Rear:325. I just measured my outriggers and it is Front:110mm Rear:120mm, what you have to remember though is that my wheels are not the original size so the amount of height adjustment that I used would not be the same on original wheels, I had about 5 threads of adjustment remaining on the front and more on the back. My wheels are 17" and 40 profile tyres on the front, 45 rear. The gap between all of the wheels and the arch is one finger, none of the wheels catch or rub, but again they are not original wheels.
Alun, have you had a liquid lunch? I like you, but you're miles off the mark My settings are the same as everyone else bar the ride height, so I have the same amount of travel, the same damping and the only time that it hits the floor is when I come across a mountain of a speed bump (I stopped shopping in Tescos because they built what could only be described as a dam at the entrance to their car park).
The reason why no one else has their suspension as low as me is because it is not optimal for tyre contact at extreme cornering angles, you could adjust the static camber to compensate for this to a point (which is what I guess APM probably do as mentioned above) but without looking I think my height with my wheels and tyres would be outside of the adjustment area.
As with all things though, everything is down to personal taste, what you want and what compromises you are happy to make. I am happy to compromise a bit of tyre contact patch at the edge of suspension movement to have my car sit a little lower because as I said earlier, if I wanted to get around a track as quick as possible I wouldn't have bought a chim. There's nothing dangerous or damaging about my set up (apart from the nut behind the wheel)
Look, this man's personal taste requires a suspension setup from a cadillac..
These cars handle far better with the original amount of travel and soft springs and damping. I had mine set up on the firm side, after a day spent at Centre of Gravity it handles a million times better and is what could best be described as 'floaty'.Honestly we all use our cars for different things and they were originally designed to be the softer version of the griff, a gt sporty tourer type of thing and the original set up is perfect for that. I drive for a living though and am used to owning cars that are more track orientated so 'floaty' is definitively not something I aim for
I'm using a set of Gaz Gold Pros with the spring rate of Front:450 Rear:375 which I would say are optimal for track work, if I was just going to use it on the road I would have used Front:400 Rear:325. I just measured my outriggers and it is Front:110mm Rear:120mm, what you have to remember though is that my wheels are not the original size so the amount of height adjustment that I used would not be the same on original wheels, I had about 5 threads of adjustment remaining on the front and more on the back. My wheels are 17" and 40 profile tyres on the front, 45 rear. The gap between all of the wheels and the arch is one finger, none of the wheels catch or rub, but again they are not original wheels.
Alun, have you had a liquid lunch? I like you, but you're miles off the mark
My settings are the same as everyone else bar the ride height, so I have the same amount of travel, the same damping and the only time that it hits the floor is when I come across a mountain of a speed bump (I stopped shopping in Tescos because they built what could only be described as a dam at the entrance to their car park). The reason why no one else has their suspension as low as me is because it is not optimal for tyre contact at extreme cornering angles, you could adjust the static camber to compensate for this to a point (which is what I guess APM probably do as mentioned above) but without looking I think my height with my wheels and tyres would be outside of the adjustment area.
As with all things though, everything is down to personal taste, what you want and what compromises you are happy to make. I am happy to compromise a bit of tyre contact patch at the edge of suspension movement to have my car sit a little lower because as I said earlier, if I wanted to get around a track as quick as possible I wouldn't have bought a chim. There's nothing dangerous or damaging about my set up (apart from the nut behind the wheel)
Look, this man's personal taste requires a suspension setup from a cadillac..
WinstonWolf said:
These cars handle far better with the original amount of travel and soft springs and damping. I had mine set up on the firm side, after a day spent at Centre of Gravity it handles a million times better and is what could best be described as 'floaty'.Oh yeah, get back over to your own side 
I tried soft, hard, different front to back ratios, heights and all sorts of things when I first stuck them on in the summer and soft seemed to correspond with loose when I was playing about. It was fun and gave a good ride but not the sort of set up I like, I'm hoping to have more of a play about with settings this year though as I was too busy getting used to the car, making sure it was reliable and swapping bits about last year.
I tried soft, hard, different front to back ratios, heights and all sorts of things when I first stuck them on in the summer and soft seemed to correspond with loose when I was playing about. It was fun and gave a good ride but not the sort of set up I like, I'm hoping to have more of a play about with settings this year though as I was too busy getting used to the car, making sure it was reliable and swapping bits about last year.
I agree, decent geometry setup is one of the main factors in a cars handling, you can stick on and upgrade as much stuff as you want but if it's not all pointing where it should then it's not going to work. £400 is a lot of wedge though, I'm used to £80 to play about on a hunter machine, how far did they go for that?
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