Injection out, carbs in.
Discussion
Several reasons why people do this conversion. Carburettor is the older conventional system and some people believe it's more reliable than fuel injection based on the fact that there are less moving parts. Also, it's simpler to maintain as there is no ECU or fuel metering units, fuel pressure settings etc. Carbs usually have a manual choke system so it's again easier to maintain and more reliable for morning cold starts. In summary, people do the conversion in the belief that the car will be more reliable, easier to maintain and cheaper to run. However, converting a V8 wedge to a carburettor makes the car non original as all V8's were made as fuel injection from new, as far as I'm aware.
Tony. TCB.
Tony. TCB.
Put it this way - I have EFi on my blown 400SX and it's good for 320 (to be confirmed) bhp.
People chop it out because they can't be arsed to solve problems with it, you need some specialist kit to test it fully (though you can test 90% with a multimeter and a few lights), and carbs are easier to understand.
Apart from the power drop that Zig mentioned, economy can suffer too - so the worst of both worlds.
People chop it out because they can't be arsed to solve problems with it, you need some specialist kit to test it fully (though you can test 90% with a multimeter and a few lights), and carbs are easier to understand.
Apart from the power drop that Zig mentioned, economy can suffer too - so the worst of both worlds.
Ha! You can make it as difficult as you like!
There are lots of things that can go wrong and the "trick" if you can call it that is to work through everything methodically.
I've tried advising people over the forum and it's a bit hit-and-miss, some people will follow and measure stuff and report back, others won't and then get frustrated.
We could do with a symptoms/fault finding flow chart, one day maybe.
There are lots of things that can go wrong and the "trick" if you can call it that is to work through everything methodically.
I've tried advising people over the forum and it's a bit hit-and-miss, some people will follow and measure stuff and report back, others won't and then get frustrated.
We could do with a symptoms/fault finding flow chart, one day maybe.
JumboBeef said:
How expensive/difficult can the efi be to fix?
OK. Say the ECU is playing up. Considering you won't be able to buy a new one, you'd be looking at repairing the old one, or buying a second hand unit. If you could buy a new one, it would probably cost a fortune anyway. Then, there is the matter of, is it the ECU playing up? You have to use elimination to solve the problem, and considering there are a dozen other things it could be, confusion sets in. Followed by frustration and possibly head banging against the garage wall. I think you probably get the idea.Having said all that though, there are a lot of people on this forum in the know about such matters and would be able to advise you on many aspects of maintaining your Wedge.
Tony. TCB.
ElvisWedgely said:
JumboBeef said:
How expensive/difficult can the efi be to fix?
OK. Say the ECU is playing up. Considering you won't be able to buy a new one, you'd be looking at repairing the old one, or buying a second hand unit. If you could buy a new one, it would probably cost a fortune anyway. Then, there is the matter of, is it the ECU playing up? You have to use elimination to solve the problem, and considering there are a dozen other things it could be, confusion sets in. Followed by frustration and possibly head banging against the garage wall. I think you probably get the idea.Having said all that though, there are a lot of people on this forum in the know about such matters and would be able to advise you on many aspects of maintaining your Wedge.
Tony. TCB.
Having driven Rover V8's as my main car for the past 30 years, Rover P5, P6, P6 then three injected wedges, I would say EFi is more reliable every time. Not only for starting, but for power delivery. So I don't mind a bit of junk (cripes I've got even more what with the blower and assorted measurement gauges.)
JumboBeef said:
So is it more time/effort than cost? I've had the V8 efi before, in 3x different Land Rovers (3.9/4.2) and never had problems beyond replacing plugs/leads/cap.
Don't get me wrong. The efi engine is reliable and fairly bulletproof. However, should things go wrong, diagnosing a problem on an efi would be more involved compared to a carburettor. Both time and money wise.Tony.TCB.
mrzigazaga said:
To eradicate the issues facing them with the efi...Also to loose some power...
When I swapped over to Carbs my throttle response for example was instant and rapid even on overtake - more so than the Efi it replaced. My car feels quicker and a lot more responsive as a result. There a number of factors that need to be looked at such as the carb used and how it's jetted and tuned to get the most of the carb's benefits.My reasons for changing over were to fix contestant fuelling issues, non start and idle probs. In fact most of the issues posted on here and other forums linked to Efi just do not exist with carbs. I now know that if I had a starting issue it would take me a couple of minutes to sus out as opposed to maybe a couple of hours trying to find the issue linked to Efi
It's a matter of choice and since I have no intentions of selling my car it suits me fine to run with carbs as it's much easier to maintain, tune and fix...
I like the way everyone thinks carbs are so simple. When I trained as a motor mechanic there were entire weeks devoted to the why, how and which of carburettors. I reckon there are as many people mystified as to the workings of them as injection - in some ways injection is easier to understand and to anyone with an electronics background, it's not difficult to fault-find.
Wedg1e said:
I like the way everyone thinks carbs are so simple. When I trained as a motor mechanic there were entire weeks devoted to the why, how and which of carburettors. I reckon there are as many people mystified as to the workings of them as injection - in some ways injection is easier to understand and to anyone with an electronics background, it's not difficult to fault-find.
I'm not claiming that carburettors are simple or easy to understand it's delicate woking mechanism, but the beauty of carburettors is that you can just change them for a new or a reconditioned unit. That in itself would solve most of the problems. All you have to do then, is learn how to set them up properly, and job done.Tony.TCB.
As I understand it, the original ECU is a sort of 'half-half' analogue and digital design, which is now very obsolete, and difficult to diagnose and repair.
If I had a V8, I would consider an aftermarket all digital system (like an Emerald), as it's got potential to be more efficient than carbs and the original ECU, and can be adjusted for best performance, etc, etc., and you can keep all the injection hardware, but probably simplify it ?
I've just got the all mechanical K series on the 2.8 to enjoy - it's been very reliable so far....
If I had a V8, I would consider an aftermarket all digital system (like an Emerald), as it's got potential to be more efficient than carbs and the original ECU, and can be adjusted for best performance, etc, etc., and you can keep all the injection hardware, but probably simplify it ?
I've just got the all mechanical K series on the 2.8 to enjoy - it's been very reliable so far....
In the extremes: twin DCOEs that need fettling every 1000 miles or so, or a daily driver that reaches 150k miles with no fettling of the fuel injection system at all?
4 barrel Holley is probably more reliable than twin 40s, but will still need fettling. The biggest issue with a 30 year old flapper system is deterioration of components, not the original design. (Modern EFi is far easier to work on than carbs, providing you have the right tools and info)
4 barrel Holley is probably more reliable than twin 40s, but will still need fettling. The biggest issue with a 30 year old flapper system is deterioration of components, not the original design. (Modern EFi is far easier to work on than carbs, providing you have the right tools and info)
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