Cassettes as good as CD's?
Discussion
...I regularly use tapes in my MX-5 as, well it only has a tape deck. Browsing through freecycle and a tape deck was up for grabs, so I picked it up, connected it to my main Hi-FI expecting to be underwhelmed, and f
k me if I can tell the difference between the cassette and the CD version of the same album (tested with radiohead, 'the bends')....
k me if I can tell the difference between the cassette and the CD version of the same album (tested with radiohead, 'the bends')....Funk said:
Tape is equivalent to about 5-6bit depth, CD is 16bit.
So no, in terms of dynamic range it's nowhere close. The limitation is what you're playing it through, not the source media.
,.to me, on my, say, mid range set-up, to my 40 year old ears, they sounded the same...that's all I can say...So no, in terms of dynamic range it's nowhere close. The limitation is what you're playing it through, not the source media.
sunnygym said:
What about when you want to skip a track ?
A decent quality tape deck can do this (albeit it takes a little longer).However, they do not sound as good. A good recording on a decent quality tape played back on a decent quality head unit its first few times and there's no reason it can't sound good. But if it sounds as good as your CD set up, then you have a poor quality CD set up!
h0b0 said:
I think and hope you know that that's entirely irrelevant! Also, the question is about quality, not quantity 
If you're happy with the sound that's all that matters to you.
However tapes are nowhere near CD quality. As already said, they're the equivalent of 5/6-bits at best.
This presentation mentions tapes just to give you an idea of how bad even the best tape decks are... http://xiph.org/video/vid2.shtml
However tapes are nowhere near CD quality. As already said, they're the equivalent of 5/6-bits at best.
This presentation mentions tapes just to give you an idea of how bad even the best tape decks are... http://xiph.org/video/vid2.shtml
CDs have the technical capability to offer higher sound quality than cassettes but they often don't and my ears tell me that the same music on most of my cassettes recorded from vinyl on a LP12 or live broadcasts years ago sound as good as or better than most of the same digitally remastered albums played on my Naim CD player. There's only a few of my CDs that sound better than all of my cassettes.
The same applies in my car - tape playback sounds mostly as good as or better than CD.
It's completely missing the point to judge an analogue medium by digital standards and then dismiss it as it doesn't have enough bits and chances are any cassette deck you'll be able to listen to now will be seriously compromised by wear and age and have a much reduced frequency response, dynamic range and loss of mechanical stability and rigidity in the transport mechanism. I'll bet there's not many people under 30 or so who have heard just how good cassette recording and playback can be on high end Hi Fi equipment using a high quality source and premium tape like TDK SA or TDK metal. On a 3 head deck using tape monitor to carefully set recording levels and bias in most cases it's almost impossible to tell the difference between source and recording.
The real problem is compared to older analogue so many digital sources are horribly compressed, distorted and harsh and have such a restricted and engineered frequency response that it doesn't matter what the storage medium is, they'll still sound shyite.
The same applies in my car - tape playback sounds mostly as good as or better than CD.
It's completely missing the point to judge an analogue medium by digital standards and then dismiss it as it doesn't have enough bits and chances are any cassette deck you'll be able to listen to now will be seriously compromised by wear and age and have a much reduced frequency response, dynamic range and loss of mechanical stability and rigidity in the transport mechanism. I'll bet there's not many people under 30 or so who have heard just how good cassette recording and playback can be on high end Hi Fi equipment using a high quality source and premium tape like TDK SA or TDK metal. On a 3 head deck using tape monitor to carefully set recording levels and bias in most cases it's almost impossible to tell the difference between source and recording.
The real problem is compared to older analogue so many digital sources are horribly compressed, distorted and harsh and have such a restricted and engineered frequency response that it doesn't matter what the storage medium is, they'll still sound shyite.
Jaguar steve said:
The real problem is compared to older analogue so many digital sources are horribly compressed, distorted and harsh and have such a restricted and engineered frequency response that it doesn't matter what the storage medium is, they'll still sound shyite.
That's nothing to do with digital sources, as you're basically saying all digital recording equipment (i.e. the source) is crap. It's to do with the mastering of the recording, which as you correctly say will sound pants whichever medium it's put onto, be that CD, tape, vinyl or wax cylinder.If you think the number of bits is unimportant, I suggest you watch that video I posted a link to, it shows you how the number of bits affect things like noise etc.
I found it a very enlightening video tbh.
probedb said:
Jaguar steve said:
The real problem is compared to older analogue so many digital sources are horribly compressed, distorted and harsh and have such a restricted and engineered frequency response that it doesn't matter what the storage medium is, they'll still sound shyite.
That's nothing to do with digital sources, as you're basically saying all digital recording equipment (i.e. the source) is crap. It's to do with the mastering of the recording, which as you correctly say will sound pants whichever medium it's put onto, be that CD, tape, vinyl or wax cylinder.If you think the number of bits is unimportant, I suggest you watch that video I posted a link to, it shows you how the number of bits affect things like noise etc.
I found it a very enlightening video tbh.
- is capable of a much better quality than it's so often fed from digital processing.Criticising cassettes for their inferior technical performance compared to digital storage is not really addressing the real problem which is the loss of information and distortion of the original sound. If you loose that you have no reference to compare the two with and both will sound equally bad.
Just because cassettes are old tech and don't perform as well as CD on paper is no reason to dismiss them as inferior. I have stunning analogue recordings on cassette and really dire digital ones on CD. My ears in the real world tell me which of the two I'd rather listen too.
Funk said:
Tape is equivalent to about 5-6bit depth, CD is 16bit.
So no, in terms of dynamic range it's nowhere close. The limitation is what you're playing it through, not the source media.
Given how compressed most contemporary pop releases are, 5bits is much more than enough to capture the dynamic range effectively So no, in terms of dynamic range it's nowhere close. The limitation is what you're playing it through, not the source media.
Jaguar steve said:
CDs have the technical capability to offer higher sound quality than cassettes but they often don't
I think that's backwards. Cassettes have the technical capability to offer higher sound quality than CD's. You'll need a really good deck though (Nakamichi?) and cassettes in A+ condition.Gassing Station | Home Cinema & Hi-Fi | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff