Nutrition for 320m ride over 2 days
Discussion
I'm after a bit of advise regarding nutrition as will be doing a 320m ride over 2 days next weekend. So 160m per day it will be, on road bikes from Wales to near Cambridge.
I am planning porridge for breakfast, plenty of fluids with electrolytes and numerous gels for the bumpy bits. What I'm not sure about is general ride food, as due to the distance we're looking at a steady pace, so will be lots of hours in the saddle both days. I've done 100m sportives before, so have a little idea of riding decent distances, but this is further than I've done before, Nd back to back days, so it's what to eat and when that I'd like some guidance on if possible.
I am planning porridge for breakfast, plenty of fluids with electrolytes and numerous gels for the bumpy bits. What I'm not sure about is general ride food, as due to the distance we're looking at a steady pace, so will be lots of hours in the saddle both days. I've done 100m sportives before, so have a little idea of riding decent distances, but this is further than I've done before, Nd back to back days, so it's what to eat and when that I'd like some guidance on if possible.
Muesli has more calories and more nutrients than porridge, gram for gram.
Eat every 30-60 minutes on the bike. Keep it carb rich.
Recovery drink, or similar when you finish. Another meal within 45-60 minutes.
Carb snacks later in the night if you are hungry. Graze rather than stuff yourself.
Basic stuff is keep it carb heavy when riding, add protein afterwards.
Eat every 30-60 minutes on the bike. Keep it carb rich.
Recovery drink, or similar when you finish. Another meal within 45-60 minutes.
Carb snacks later in the night if you are hungry. Graze rather than stuff yourself.
Basic stuff is keep it carb heavy when riding, add protein afterwards.
It takes about 25-30 minutes for gels to have any effect so factor that in, they are not an instant power source and any immediate benefit is psychological.
As others have said, real food like bananas and ham rolls are perfect, easy to eat on the go and easier for your gut to digest. They also fill your stomach up rather than just passing through (so to speak) as a gel has no substance so you avoid stomach cramps.
Personally, a top tube bag stuffed with haribo would probably be my choice for mid ride treat rather than a gel, easy to share and good for morale too. Post ride, refuel within in an hour on real food, cold bath and a 30 minute stretch.
As others have said, real food like bananas and ham rolls are perfect, easy to eat on the go and easier for your gut to digest. They also fill your stomach up rather than just passing through (so to speak) as a gel has no substance so you avoid stomach cramps.
Personally, a top tube bag stuffed with haribo would probably be my choice for mid ride treat rather than a gel, easy to share and good for morale too. Post ride, refuel within in an hour on real food, cold bath and a 30 minute stretch.
pablo said:
cold bath and a 30 minute stretch.
Defo this after each ride. I dropped my ass and legs into a cold bath right after the first day of a 2 day ride and it worked wondered on my legs. Felt like I'd done nothing with them the next morning. Amazing the difference it makes. Didn't cold bath them after the second day and I can really feel it today. It's hard work dropping your self in though!!Gels defiantly work for me. But as well as bananas, flapjack and pasta. Try squeezing the runnier ones into you fluids to avoid sticky mess situations.
Good luck on the ride. That's a hell of a distance.
MHB said:
I'm after a bit of advise regarding nutrition as will be doing a 320m ride over 2 days next weekend. So 160m per day it will be, on road bikes from Wales to near Cambridge.
I am planning porridge for breakfast, plenty of fluids with electrolytes and numerous gels for the bumpy bits. What I'm not sure about is general ride food, as due to the distance we're looking at a steady pace, so will be lots of hours in the saddle both days. I've done 100m sportives before, so have a little idea of riding decent distances, but this is further than I've done before, Nd back to back days, so it's what to eat and when that I'd like some guidance on if possible.
I tend to try to eat real food - flap jack works for me. I feel grim after I eat so always go easy. TBH, as long as I don't push too hard, I can get away with most things. I did a winter 200km on two bottles of milkshake and 3 snicker duos a while back. Am partial to those torx gels. No idea of the science, but the rhubarb crumble one and the banoffee pie one are just yum.I am planning porridge for breakfast, plenty of fluids with electrolytes and numerous gels for the bumpy bits. What I'm not sure about is general ride food, as due to the distance we're looking at a steady pace, so will be lots of hours in the saddle both days. I've done 100m sportives before, so have a little idea of riding decent distances, but this is further than I've done before, Nd back to back days, so it's what to eat and when that I'd like some guidance on if possible.
Doesn't make too much difference when or what you calories are to be honest. Just that you get them regularlyanddon't leave long gaps in between.
What is certain is that having only one type of food available will mena you won't eat it, especially when its your third or fourth portion.
So mix it up, take a variety of stuff to suit your mood. Personally I can't stomach gels but accept that for some people they are a key plank of feeding.
I would, take hlaf flat lemonade to water mix in my bidons.
Flapjacks, couple of small pork pies (snack versions) pocket of jelly babies. I would plan a 30 minute stop somewhere and have a decent stretch, food, bottle of choccy milk. Assuming this isn't a race and you want to "enjoy" it. maybe some malt loak slices and four or five fun size chocolate bars.
Another good option is Macademian Nuts or Cashews...
Aim to eat something every hour.
Cold water bath, yes great for short term relief.
Disco You said:
Real food, lots of it.
Quite, for something that isn't too time sensitive, just eat properly when you can.A mate of mine rode from Newcastle to London on Friday night in one go, which was about 330 miles, he stopped and ate a big meal here and there, it almost doesn't matter what you eat when you are mid-ride doing something like that, he ate fry ups, burgers, all sorts, and have maltloaf for when he was on the bike between main meals, and waterbottles of course.
Anyone else think we need a nutrition sticky for this forum?
Nutrition is:
a) somewhat personal
b) very very very (get the idea?) very dependent upon intensity - e.g. I could happily ride a century on fish and chips at a decent, but not terribly intense pace with no issues, or I could get major issues going flat out on something far easier to digest.
The problem is that the harder you work, the higher the energy demand, but also the lower the ability to digest (more of the blood flow is prioritised away from the gut) - there's obviously a crossover point where demand exceeds ability to consume (primary reason to start eating early on long/intense sessions). Digestion and gut emptying will slow/shut down with increasing intensity, the vast majority of 'gastro' problems, cramps etc are down to the gut not emptying and everything just sloshing around. (If you're sloshy, stop drinking/eating for a bit). The 60g/cho per hour that always comes up is a rule of thumb - you need to see what you can cope with, that's why it's always recommended that you experiment before the main event.
Gels are as close to 'instant' as you'll get - they do require a little time, more like 10-15min in my experience. The whole point is that they require minimal digestion. They do not 'pass through'. If you're working at high intensity, then use them. Some need water along with, some less so.
Ham sandwiches etc (real food) are great - *If* you're going slowly enough to digest. Solid food is not easier to digest than gels.
Harribo, Jelly babies etc., Great too. Somewhere between sandwiches and gels.
As to fat/carbs - fat is a great source, IF you can burn it. 3.5kg fat >30,000cal 3.5kg is 5% fat on a 75kg body. Pretty sure almost all of us have more than that
It can fuel you a long way if you go slowly enough. Fat metabolism however is entirely aerobic. You can train to improve your ability to run off fat, but you'll never run off it entirely.
In comparison you're looking at something around 2000cal of carbs. On the other hand they can be used anaerobically (which is pretty inefficient), as well as aerobically (about 10x more energy for the amount of carb in) and they're easier to access than fat - to use a tenuous motoring analogy, fat = diesel, carb = petrol (except you actually access both at the same time, so if you can improve your diesel efficiency, it helps considerably)
Equally, your brain needs carbs, it cannot run off protein / fat, so if you run out of carbs, the body will shut down to stop you killing yourself - one of the primary causes of the dreaded 'bonk' is a lack of carbs going up top.
To the OP, my advice will be that you can probably eat pretty much what you want. Have a mix - some real food that you'll want to eat (I go nuts for sticky ginger cake), plenty of water (personal, but I prefer to separate fuel and drink - sometimes I want/need one without the other), and take a few gels for when you need a fast(ish) pick me up, or when you just can't face chewing anything. Finally ensure there's some stretching (with or without a foam roller, it's just a tool) at the end of the day, it *will* make day 2 easier.
Nutrition is:
a) somewhat personal
b) very very very (get the idea?) very dependent upon intensity - e.g. I could happily ride a century on fish and chips at a decent, but not terribly intense pace with no issues, or I could get major issues going flat out on something far easier to digest.
The problem is that the harder you work, the higher the energy demand, but also the lower the ability to digest (more of the blood flow is prioritised away from the gut) - there's obviously a crossover point where demand exceeds ability to consume (primary reason to start eating early on long/intense sessions). Digestion and gut emptying will slow/shut down with increasing intensity, the vast majority of 'gastro' problems, cramps etc are down to the gut not emptying and everything just sloshing around. (If you're sloshy, stop drinking/eating for a bit). The 60g/cho per hour that always comes up is a rule of thumb - you need to see what you can cope with, that's why it's always recommended that you experiment before the main event.
Gels are as close to 'instant' as you'll get - they do require a little time, more like 10-15min in my experience. The whole point is that they require minimal digestion. They do not 'pass through'. If you're working at high intensity, then use them. Some need water along with, some less so.
Ham sandwiches etc (real food) are great - *If* you're going slowly enough to digest. Solid food is not easier to digest than gels.
Harribo, Jelly babies etc., Great too. Somewhere between sandwiches and gels.
As to fat/carbs - fat is a great source, IF you can burn it. 3.5kg fat >30,000cal 3.5kg is 5% fat on a 75kg body. Pretty sure almost all of us have more than that
It can fuel you a long way if you go slowly enough. Fat metabolism however is entirely aerobic. You can train to improve your ability to run off fat, but you'll never run off it entirely.In comparison you're looking at something around 2000cal of carbs. On the other hand they can be used anaerobically (which is pretty inefficient), as well as aerobically (about 10x more energy for the amount of carb in) and they're easier to access than fat - to use a tenuous motoring analogy, fat = diesel, carb = petrol (except you actually access both at the same time, so if you can improve your diesel efficiency, it helps considerably)
Equally, your brain needs carbs, it cannot run off protein / fat, so if you run out of carbs, the body will shut down to stop you killing yourself - one of the primary causes of the dreaded 'bonk' is a lack of carbs going up top.
To the OP, my advice will be that you can probably eat pretty much what you want. Have a mix - some real food that you'll want to eat (I go nuts for sticky ginger cake), plenty of water (personal, but I prefer to separate fuel and drink - sometimes I want/need one without the other), and take a few gels for when you need a fast(ish) pick me up, or when you just can't face chewing anything. Finally ensure there's some stretching (with or without a foam roller, it's just a tool) at the end of the day, it *will* make day 2 easier.
Did 85miles on 4slices of buttered Soreen at the weekend, topped up with a bag of jelly babies. Also JB's warmly accepted by rather knackered chap I passed in the last 10miles, we where both suffering but he looked like he needed them more than me :-)
A year ago I'd have needed a bag of food and twice the fluid for that ride, now I go faster and ate better the night before so it is very personal as others have said.
These days I take a tenner and Debit Card with me- can always stop a buy proper meal and a pint if it all goes wrong :-)
A year ago I'd have needed a bag of food and twice the fluid for that ride, now I go faster and ate better the night before so it is very personal as others have said.
These days I take a tenner and Debit Card with me- can always stop a buy proper meal and a pint if it all goes wrong :-)
+1 for real foods and lots of it.
A mate has just ridden 1,700 miles in 17 days from Bradford to Gibraltar (I joined him for 7 days). His biggest challenge was not terrain, weather, mechanicals etc, it was nutrition! He rode hard every day but factored in 2 stops, one 2 hours into the day for a coffee and snack, then 2-3 hours later for lunch - in between the stops we were grazing on cereal bars/bananas and drinking plenty of fluids.
Breakfast was typically muesli, scrambled egg on toast, natural yoghurt with a sprinkle of nuts and a banana or two. Mid morning snack was whatever we could get our hands on, lunch would be pretty much like breakfast then dinner would be a gorge-fest of meat and greens! The UK leg was pretty easy but Spain was a killer, temperature was 36'+ every day and we were working hard meaning we were burning circa 8,000+ calories a day - the challenge then was actually eating enough wothout being sick!
Pauls ride was sponsored by OTE so we used their hydration mix and food bars for in-flight re-fuelling, and their recovery shake post rides but these were no substitute for 'real' food. As for gels, we only broke those out in an emergency, they work well but only give you a short lift, also when you are in the saddle for 7+ hours the potential side effects of too many gels is not something you would want to be dealing with!!
As long as you are used to long days in the saddle I would say you will be fine on 'normal' foods for 2 days, longer than a few days and I would suggest that you would need a nutrition strategy (one of the learning points from our recent challenge! - don't assume you can get what you need en-route!)....
A mate has just ridden 1,700 miles in 17 days from Bradford to Gibraltar (I joined him for 7 days). His biggest challenge was not terrain, weather, mechanicals etc, it was nutrition! He rode hard every day but factored in 2 stops, one 2 hours into the day for a coffee and snack, then 2-3 hours later for lunch - in between the stops we were grazing on cereal bars/bananas and drinking plenty of fluids.
Breakfast was typically muesli, scrambled egg on toast, natural yoghurt with a sprinkle of nuts and a banana or two. Mid morning snack was whatever we could get our hands on, lunch would be pretty much like breakfast then dinner would be a gorge-fest of meat and greens! The UK leg was pretty easy but Spain was a killer, temperature was 36'+ every day and we were working hard meaning we were burning circa 8,000+ calories a day - the challenge then was actually eating enough wothout being sick!
Pauls ride was sponsored by OTE so we used their hydration mix and food bars for in-flight re-fuelling, and their recovery shake post rides but these were no substitute for 'real' food. As for gels, we only broke those out in an emergency, they work well but only give you a short lift, also when you are in the saddle for 7+ hours the potential side effects of too many gels is not something you would want to be dealing with!!
As long as you are used to long days in the saddle I would say you will be fine on 'normal' foods for 2 days, longer than a few days and I would suggest that you would need a nutrition strategy (one of the learning points from our recent challenge! - don't assume you can get what you need en-route!)....
Many thanks to all for your comments, they're really appreciated and give me pretty much everthing I need to know to make sure I don't 'bonk' on the day. The cold bath wasn't something I would have considered, but definately will be doing.
The ride isn't a race, just something a group of friends have organised to raise funds for the local Food Bank.
The ride isn't a race, just something a group of friends have organised to raise funds for the local Food Bank.
Do you have anything in the way of support or just what you can carry/buy? How long are you planning on riding for?
Either way, don't worry about it. Eat a decent breakfast, lunch and dinner and a few snacks and you should be fine. Don't forget to consider having to buy energy drinks. The caveat being you're reasonably well prepared with your current riding.
Last years 24hr TT consisted of a 2 x Nuttela tortillas, 2 x brunch type bars, 1 x water and 1 x home made energy drink per 2 hour stint. But I did have a support team prepping and passing. Not one gel or energy type product (apart from the home made drink), and I had a tray in my roll cab full of various foods. Every one is different.
If the worst happens, you'll limp to the nearest shop and stuff your face with whatever you can find, then carry on.
Either way, don't worry about it. Eat a decent breakfast, lunch and dinner and a few snacks and you should be fine. Don't forget to consider having to buy energy drinks. The caveat being you're reasonably well prepared with your current riding.
Last years 24hr TT consisted of a 2 x Nuttela tortillas, 2 x brunch type bars, 1 x water and 1 x home made energy drink per 2 hour stint. But I did have a support team prepping and passing. Not one gel or energy type product (apart from the home made drink), and I had a tray in my roll cab full of various foods. Every one is different.
If the worst happens, you'll limp to the nearest shop and stuff your face with whatever you can find, then carry on.
Have a look here, some good advice that I used on my last long ride http://ultracycling.com/sections/articles/nutritio...
See you in Worcester
See you in Worcester
Edited by Spyder5 on Thursday 22 May 10:13
Also....
These are quite nice - http://www.fuelyour10khours.com/#products_single/
They are available in Tesco's near the Muesli bars for about a £1
I'd set my alarm for 2 hours before the ride start time and drink this then go back to sleep. Then, get up just before the ride and then have a massive breakfast - this should give you some energy for the first couple of hours before your breakfast kicks in.
These are quite nice - http://www.fuelyour10khours.com/#products_single/
They are available in Tesco's near the Muesli bars for about a £1
I'd set my alarm for 2 hours before the ride start time and drink this then go back to sleep. Then, get up just before the ride and then have a massive breakfast - this should give you some energy for the first couple of hours before your breakfast kicks in.
Gargamel said:
Doesn't make too much difference when or what you calories are to be honest. Just that you get them regularlyanddon't leave long gaps in between.
It does matter, but as someone else posted, intensity is important.If its high intensity, then where you get your calories is very important.
Real food is a good idea if you are not going too fast, but don't discount energy foods.
I've finished 24hr races using nothing but Torq energy drink and Torq energy gels with no side affects.
That said, I wouldn't do that outside of a race situation and even then, you need to practice to see what brands of products you can stomach.
Torq use natural flavours, which most people tend to get on well with, unlike most brands.
Just do your ride in a slightly tinpot country where your ATM card doesn't work outside of the major cities.
Buy two loaves of stale bread for 4 pesos each and fill your water bottles from a stream and you'll be fine. It's amazing how little you can survive on when you really need to. Camp in the bushes near the road for the full effect.
Buy two loaves of stale bread for 4 pesos each and fill your water bottles from a stream and you'll be fine. It's amazing how little you can survive on when you really need to. Camp in the bushes near the road for the full effect.
Gassing Station | Pedal Powered | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff