Ballsed up a job! whats my best way out?
Discussion
Basically i am an electrical installer that has started to go into the CCTV market. (big mistake)
I recently got contacted by a company who wanted cctv in 2 small warehouses (5 ip cams)
I quoted a fixed price, which they accepted as long as they can view remotely. I checked and the recorder is capable of this. (i assumed they would just need to check every now and again)
As i was installing, it soon came apparent that these camera's were for full time surveillance of their staff remotely (this is when i should have apologised for wasting there time, and recommend they find a contractor with experience in this)
But i decided the NVR will be no good for this so bought a much more expensive one at my expense, which had better network capability.
Now i freely admit i got completely out of my depth here, and it was probably obvious i didn't really know what i was doing regarding port forwarding etc! i am no IT person!
Now everything seemed to work ok, i admit the remote footage is not great, which is mainly due to the fact their broadband is not great, 0.5Meg upload speed.
Now my customer is not happy, does not like the remote footage quality/keeps freezing, says the NVR recorder sounds like its going to explode! (combination of a small fan and hard drive working) And wants it sorted before payment.
I have £800 of equipment installed, and have not taken a penny from them. And at my quoted price i will not have made any money (just about break even)
I completely regret taking this job on, but not sure how to rectify! I just want it put to bed.
I have obviously lost the customer for any future work now, but do not want a local PR disaster!
I see my options are:
1. keep at it, loose more money, try and compromise with customer?
2. Apologise for wasting their time, remove equipment, and put down to experience.
3. Leave equipment as a gift, they can then get someone else to finish. and put the big loss down to experience.
If anyone has any advice on this, it would be much appreciated.
I recently got contacted by a company who wanted cctv in 2 small warehouses (5 ip cams)
I quoted a fixed price, which they accepted as long as they can view remotely. I checked and the recorder is capable of this. (i assumed they would just need to check every now and again)
As i was installing, it soon came apparent that these camera's were for full time surveillance of their staff remotely (this is when i should have apologised for wasting there time, and recommend they find a contractor with experience in this)
But i decided the NVR will be no good for this so bought a much more expensive one at my expense, which had better network capability.
Now i freely admit i got completely out of my depth here, and it was probably obvious i didn't really know what i was doing regarding port forwarding etc! i am no IT person!
Now everything seemed to work ok, i admit the remote footage is not great, which is mainly due to the fact their broadband is not great, 0.5Meg upload speed.
Now my customer is not happy, does not like the remote footage quality/keeps freezing, says the NVR recorder sounds like its going to explode! (combination of a small fan and hard drive working) And wants it sorted before payment.
I have £800 of equipment installed, and have not taken a penny from them. And at my quoted price i will not have made any money (just about break even)
I completely regret taking this job on, but not sure how to rectify! I just want it put to bed.
I have obviously lost the customer for any future work now, but do not want a local PR disaster!
I see my options are:
1. keep at it, loose more money, try and compromise with customer?
2. Apologise for wasting their time, remove equipment, and put down to experience.
3. Leave equipment as a gift, they can then get someone else to finish. and put the big loss down to experience.
If anyone has any advice on this, it would be much appreciated.
I admire your honesty 
What would be the additional cost to get it "right"? This might show the best way forward. For example -
As things stand you can only bill £800. If it costs another £400 to get things up and running, you will only have a £400 loss (£1200 outlay less £800 income). OTOH if it costs more than another £800 you might as well apologise and walk away, thereby limiting your losses to the £800 you've put in (plus labour).
These things happen to the best of us. Worst case scenario - you've been on a training course which cost you £800
What would be the additional cost to get it "right"? This might show the best way forward. For example -
As things stand you can only bill £800. If it costs another £400 to get things up and running, you will only have a £400 loss (£1200 outlay less £800 income). OTOH if it costs more than another £800 you might as well apologise and walk away, thereby limiting your losses to the £800 you've put in (plus labour).
These things happen to the best of us. Worst case scenario - you've been on a training course which cost you £800
coyft said:
Doesn't sound like you've done a bad job. They have a system that is capable of viewing remotely (subject to their low bandwidth) and they have a recorder. If they want a better system they'll have to invest in more bandwidth and a quieter recorder.
Presumably they had other quotes, no doubt you were the cheapest what did they expect?
On reflection - probably this...Presumably they had other quotes, no doubt you were the cheapest what did they expect?
BEEN THERE DONE THAT!!! They think you're "at fault" when really it's barely down to you, you've done what you said for the price you said.
Are they happy with the local viewing, playback and functionality?
If so you can argue the broadband issue, if not then you might be stuck at replacing the DVR. I'm assuming it's a fairly cheap system if the materials were only £800? I've had this previously and I just argued that their broadband wasn't up for it, the system meets the spec and quality I'd quoted for and the remote viewing issue was down to outside factors that they had to deal with themselves.
Send me an email via here and I'll send you a copy of my "technical services additional terms & conditions" it basically says we're not responsible for s
t broadband or st computers (IP systems), nor are we responsible for making sure the system is recording (that is the customers responsibility ultimately!)
I'll also let you in on some easy install products that acheive everything you want, easy to spec, easy to install, cost is okay but not worth going too cheap as cheap CCTV jobs generally cause more hassle than they are worth.
Don't be put off CCTV, but don't price yourself in the DIY market as you'll just have problem after problem. I now will only install NVR IP systems, fed up of dealing with problems relating to customers IT equipment that has nothing to do with us.
Are they happy with the local viewing, playback and functionality?
If so you can argue the broadband issue, if not then you might be stuck at replacing the DVR. I'm assuming it's a fairly cheap system if the materials were only £800? I've had this previously and I just argued that their broadband wasn't up for it, the system meets the spec and quality I'd quoted for and the remote viewing issue was down to outside factors that they had to deal with themselves.
Send me an email via here and I'll send you a copy of my "technical services additional terms & conditions" it basically says we're not responsible for s
t broadband or st computers (IP systems), nor are we responsible for making sure the system is recording (that is the customers responsibility ultimately!)I'll also let you in on some easy install products that acheive everything you want, easy to spec, easy to install, cost is okay but not worth going too cheap as cheap CCTV jobs generally cause more hassle than they are worth.
Don't be put off CCTV, but don't price yourself in the DIY market as you'll just have problem after problem. I now will only install NVR IP systems, fed up of dealing with problems relating to customers IT equipment that has nothing to do with us.
I doubt it's as easy as just saying sorry & walking away, either with or without the equipment. The OP has contracted to provide an installation & it hasn't been delivered. The client is likely to be entitled to offer the OP the chance of rectifying the issue & if he doesn't then they can get someone else in & recover the cost from the OP.
I suspect the best option is to get someone in who can get the installation working & can then defend why the uplink speed is the issue. It may well be the cause of the problem, but he he has to be able to prove it, perhaps by demonstrating it work adequately on the internal network.
I suspect the best option is to get someone in who can get the installation working & can then defend why the uplink speed is the issue. It may well be the cause of the problem, but he he has to be able to prove it, perhaps by demonstrating it work adequately on the internal network.
NVR noise - normal? I doubt it - could be faulty - return to manufacturer
Remote issues - get them to fix broadband.
The problem you have when your customer knows you're on the back foot they can smell the free installation a mile away.
£800 is so cheap at the cheap end of IP that the customer was always going to be disappointed.
If you get any CCTV jobs in the future drop me a line.
Remote issues - get them to fix broadband.
The problem you have when your customer knows you're on the back foot they can smell the free installation a mile away.
£800 is so cheap at the cheap end of IP that the customer was always going to be disappointed.
If you get any CCTV jobs in the future drop me a line.
Thanks Guys, and yes i agree, it is at the very cheap end of the market, which i will avoid in future.
But TBH the system all works fine on site, the picture quality is very good (customer commented the picture quality is fantastic), records, does everything most want out of a CCTV system.
I am about to send an email to try and get a compromise with them. i will explain the real issue is their broadband, and that they will never be satisfied with the system , so will offer either for me to take equipment back, or leave cams in place at cost price of cams, take NVR etc away and they can get someone else in. (who i believe will have the same problem.
Will see why they say.
But TBH the system all works fine on site, the picture quality is very good (customer commented the picture quality is fantastic), records, does everything most want out of a CCTV system.
I am about to send an email to try and get a compromise with them. i will explain the real issue is their broadband, and that they will never be satisfied with the system , so will offer either for me to take equipment back, or leave cams in place at cost price of cams, take NVR etc away and they can get someone else in. (who i believe will have the same problem.
Will see why they say.
If they get some other quotes in they should quickly realise that if they have a half decent system in they should just pay up and put up. The IP cameras we used at my old place started at about £250 each and you couldnt touch a professional NVR for under a grand just for perspective.
Get the live feed out of the back via USB to a computer in the office, then set up a Skype account for the company.
Staff will then be able to sign into the Skype account and view the work place desktop, open on the selected desk computer top will be the cameras.
Edit to add:
Do a test on their broadband using this: http://speedtest.btwholesale.com/
If it's below 3.00 Mbps it will struggle to give good live pics, also 'Frames Per Second' will give different quality live feeds regardless of broadband speed.
Staff will then be able to sign into the Skype account and view the work place desktop, open on the selected desk computer top will be the cameras.
Edit to add:
Do a test on their broadband using this: http://speedtest.btwholesale.com/
If it's below 3.00 Mbps it will struggle to give good live pics, also 'Frames Per Second' will give different quality live feeds regardless of broadband speed.
Edited by Bebee on Wednesday 4th June 21:16
Before you scrap it or any small part of it have a look at Icode software.
It is brilliant, uses ip cameras and full viewable over the Internet and on iPads and iPhones even with the upload speeds used at home broadband connections.
If you want to view my two camera system here I'll happily give you access.
Talk to Huw at Icode if you want to find out more.
V.
It is brilliant, uses ip cameras and full viewable over the Internet and on iPads and iPhones even with the upload speeds used at home broadband connections.
If you want to view my two camera system here I'll happily give you access.
Talk to Huw at Icode if you want to find out more.
V.
Thanks for all suggestions.
grovveling email sent, i will expect an abusive phone call in morning
I have offered them all 5 camera's installed FOC, and i will remove the recorder etc.
will have to wait and see what they say. but i just really want to draw a line under it, as the whole job has driven me nuts!!
grovveling email sent, i will expect an abusive phone call in morning
I have offered them all 5 camera's installed FOC, and i will remove the recorder etc.
will have to wait and see what they say. but i just really want to draw a line under it, as the whole job has driven me nuts!!
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