selling old tyres as new!
Discussion
bough two Vredestein Ultrac Sessanta for the front of my VXR8, and have steering wheel wobble at all speeds and have had then balanced twice , checked the tyre and they have flat spots, and then i find they were made in November 2012, they said there is no guarantee as i have done 1k on them.
from what i have read bad storage for over 6 months will permanently damage the tyres. And new would normally mean up to a year old?
Edited by MatrixXXx on Tuesday 17th June 11:05
Edited by eybic on Friday 20th June 19:43
MatrixXXx said:
Anyone else suffering flat spots on this brand of Tyre? I am sure the other day I thought I had a flat at the rear "thump thump thump" got out checked it and it was OK a few miles later it went?
I recently had these tyres fitted all round on my CV8, only done 500 miles so far, but all I can say is very pleased with them so far. I only have stock power, and there is grip a-plenty and very quiet too. I ordered mine from CamSkill with no issues.Others on the forum have had this tyre with no issues (one of the reasons I chose them as wasn't sure what to go for, and cost was a consideration as I don't consider I need the MPSS's yet which are much more expensive).
007 VXR said:
Is nov 2012 old for a tyre
and how could it get a flat spot if its never been fitted to a car?
If they're stored upright, (not on their side), tyres can get flat spots, but generally, only ever heard of it when fitted and has weight (ie, bike, car etc). That's why they say for example, if you are not cycling for months, hang the bike on a wall bracket or turn it upside down when in storage and leaving tyres on.and how could it get a flat spot if its never been fitted to a car?
A lot of classic cars that don't get driven for months on end get put in garages and axle stands, with the wheels removed for that reason.
Car tyres especially should always be stored on their side. But would have thought it'd take longer than a year to develop a flat spot, unless the conditions it was stored in were not ideal (and I have no idea what they may be!)
From what I have read , normally flat spots disappear once the tyre warms up , but if stored incorrectly after six months they can become permanent.
If you spin the wheel you can see it clearly , I was expecting to see a raised spot not a flat spot. 18 Months of bad storage -- un fixable , the seller is not bothered thet say contact the manufacturer , I can see this becoming a nightmare.
If you spin the wheel you can see it clearly , I was expecting to see a raised spot not a flat spot. 18 Months of bad storage -- un fixable , the seller is not bothered thet say contact the manufacturer , I can see this becoming a nightmare.
I'm guessing you've read about age and storage somewhere? Have you tried contacting the manufacturer, or their UK representatives, for their recommendations - after all, they make the things.
Are you sure they are flat-spotted, and it's not a manufacturing defect? - Or incorrect fitment? I've had tyres sitting around a lot longer than 18 months, without any problem, and I'm not always particularly careful about storage.
Are you sure they are flat-spotted, and it's not a manufacturing defect? - Or incorrect fitment? I've had tyres sitting around a lot longer than 18 months, without any problem, and I'm not always particularly careful about storage.
Edited by ARAF on Tuesday 17th June 15:45
It might be worth taking the car to another good tyre fitter and having them all re-balanced and the alignment checked. You might have lost a weight just after you left the place where you bought these. I have lost a few stick on weights over the years and also found some tyre fitters are better at using their machines than others.
I would try this first before you go any further. Are you sure you have flat spots?
I would try this first before you go any further. Are you sure you have flat spots?
For the following you'll need:
1) A video camera
2) A means to attach it to the car or a friend to hold the camera
3) A quiet stretch of private road
Then proceed to rev the car to 4k and side step the clutch then bury the accelerator whilst applying sufficient brake pressure to stop the car rolling forward. Continue until rear tyres are thoroughly cooked
Once finished upload resultant video to YouTube and purchure some MPSS
1) A video camera
2) A means to attach it to the car or a friend to hold the camera
3) A quiet stretch of private road
Then proceed to rev the car to 4k and side step the clutch then bury the accelerator whilst applying sufficient brake pressure to stop the car rolling forward. Continue until rear tyres are thoroughly cooked
Once finished upload resultant video to YouTube and purchure some MPSS
I have spun the wheel slowly holding a piece of wood 1mm from the tread at one point you clearly see the tyre move inward about 4-5mm for about a lenghth of 15cm, which to me is just about the footprint of a stationary tyre.
The wobble on the steering wheel is felt at a virtually all speeds from 5 mph to over a 100mph worst around 55-85 mph, there is no vibration just steering wheel wobble which is worst turning right, the flat spot is more prominent on the on the near side wheel.
i also find if if i get the tyres very hot it almost dissapears.
The wobble on the steering wheel is felt at a virtually all speeds from 5 mph to over a 100mph worst around 55-85 mph, there is no vibration just steering wheel wobble which is worst turning right, the flat spot is more prominent on the on the near side wheel.
i also find if if i get the tyres very hot it almost dissapears.
EmmaJ said:
For the following you'll need:
1) A video camera
2) A means to attach it to the car or a friend to hold the camera
3) A quiet stretch of private road
Then proceed to rev the car to 4k and side step the clutch then bury the accelerator whilst applying sufficient brake pressure to stop the car rolling forward. Continue until rear tyres are thoroughly cooked
Once finished upload resultant video to YouTube and purchure some MPSS
good idea, but front tyres and I have an auto!1) A video camera
2) A means to attach it to the car or a friend to hold the camera
3) A quiet stretch of private road
Then proceed to rev the car to 4k and side step the clutch then bury the accelerator whilst applying sufficient brake pressure to stop the car rolling forward. Continue until rear tyres are thoroughly cooked
Once finished upload resultant video to YouTube and purchure some MPSS
Did think about a track day and wear them out. usually about 4 laps?
stigmundfreud said:
its taken a 1000 miles to raise as a problem? Unless you do 200 miles a day I really can't undertand why it took so long. They are not selling old tyres as new and this is a bit s
t to say they are
moon -> stick
Did the tyres have an issue from the 1st day they were fitted ? or after 1000mile of driving ?t to say they aremoon -> stick
007 VXR said:
stigmundfreud said:
its taken a 1000 miles to raise as a problem? Unless you do 200 miles a day I really can't undertand why it took so long. They are not selling old tyres as new and this is a bit st to say they are
moon -> stick
Did the tyres have an issue from the 1st day they were fitted ? or after 1000mile of driving ?t to say they aremoon -> stick
stigmundfreud said:
its taken a 1000 miles to raise as a problem? Unless you do 200 miles a day I really can't undertand why it took so long. They are not selling old tyres as new and this is a bit st to say they are
moon -> stick
I can do 1500 miles a week, I work away from home. t to say they aremoon -> stick
Edited by MatrixXXx on Wednesday 18th June 12:59
stigmundfreud said:
its taken a 1000 miles to raise as a problem? Unless you do 200 miles a day I 
really can't undertand why it took so long. They are not selling old tyres as new and this is a bit st to say they are
moon -> stick
normally they tell you to use them for a while to bed them in, then see if the problem is still there. really can't undertand why it took so long. They are not selling old tyres as new and this is a bit st to say they aremoon -> stick
it was two trip to site, in between I had them re balanced which made them worse. while away I had no chance to do anything about it.
I think is Sh**t to sell old tyres ( up to a year old is classed as new)and offer no support or guarantee, on my planet any way.
tyres do have a shelf life, and they say 5 years is their working life, after that they start to deteriorate, so 18 months is well into its working life.
MatrixXXx said:
normally they tell you to use them for a while to bed them in, then see if the problem is still there.
it was two trip to site, in between I had them re balanced which made them worse. while away I had no chance to do anything about it.
I think is Sh**t to sell old tyres ( up to a year old is classed as new)and offer no support or guarantee, on my planet any way.
tyres do have a shelf life, and they say 5 years is their working life, after that they start to deteriorate, so 18 months is well into its working life.
With regard to the tyres working life, that should really be a minimum of 5 years from the date they have been fitted to a car, except in exceptional circumstances. The 18 months that they have been on the shelf have NOT eaten into that working life, as they haven't started their heat cycling. The life of a tyre from manufacture to knackered is more like a 10 year minimum. it was two trip to site, in between I had them re balanced which made them worse. while away I had no chance to do anything about it.
I think is Sh**t to sell old tyres ( up to a year old is classed as new)and offer no support or guarantee, on my planet any way.
tyres do have a shelf life, and they say 5 years is their working life, after that they start to deteriorate, so 18 months is well into its working life.
If having them re-balanced made them worse, do you not think that might be the problem? Quite a few people had problems with balancing tyres (many times over in some cases) on VXR8s, a few years ago. Maybe you have this same problem, and the machine isn't well calibrated?
quote" How old is too old? The five year test
After five years or more in service, your tyres should be thoroughly inspected at least once per year. If the need arises, follow the recommendations of the vehicle manufacturer regarding replacing the original equipment tyres. As a precaution, if the tyres have not been replaced 10 years from their date of manufacture (see how to read a tyre sidewall), Michelin recommends replacing them with new tyres. Even if they appear to be in usable condition and have not worn down to the tread wear indicator.
Consumer Advisory: Factors to Consider in the Life of Your Tires
The following elements each play an important part in your tire's safety. Throughout the life of the tires it is necessary to see how each of these plays a different role. Excludes trailer tires.
Up to 6 Years:
Visual tire inspections and monthly air pressure checks are recommended.
Tire Quality/Construction: Features and Benefits help to describe capabilities of tires during this period.
Service Conditions/Maintenance: Rotate tires every 6-8,000 miles, check air pressure monthly and check tire balance every 12-16,000 miles. Tire Manufacturers suggest most tires are out of service at 3-4 years based on wear.
Tire Wear/Condition: Less than new tread changes traction and stability capabilities in extreme weather conditions (such as: snow, ice, rain, dirt/mud).
Environmental Conditions: Exposure to heat and ultraviolet rays may cause structural changes in the tire not found in more moderate climates.
Tire DOT Number*: Tire age is not the major consideration during this portion of the tire's life.
6 to 10 Years:
Replacement is recommended.
Tire Quality/Construction: Are more valid concerns as some tires are designed to be nearing the end of their service life based on average consumer travel of 12-15,000 miles annually.
Service Conditions/Maintenance: Tires that have not been serviced or maintained properly are typically at the end of their service life.
Wear/Condition: Less tread reduces traction and stability in all weather conditions as well as propensity to punctures.
Environmental Conditions: Exposure to heat and ultraviolet rays causes ozone/weather cracking and structural changes.
Tire DOT Number*: Now, one of the important considerations as some vehicle manufacturers recommend replacement and tire manufacturer warranties expire.
More Than 10 Years:
No service on tires with a DOT beyond 10 years.
Tire Quality/Construction, Service Conditions/ Maintenance, Tire Wear/Condition, Environmental Conditions: Regardless of all of these conditions, tires reach the end of their life.
Tire DOT Number*: Tire age is the most important consideration during this portion of the tire life as tire manufacturers recommend replacement of any tires regardless of service, including spares.
Reading the code. The code is pretty simple. The three-digit code was used for tyres manufactured before 2000. So for example 1 7 6 means it was manufactured in the 17th week of 6th year of the decade. In this case it means 1986. For tyres manufactured in the 90's, the same code holds true but there is a little triangle after the DOT code. So for this example, a tyre manufactured in the 17th week of 1996 would have the code 176triangle
After 2000, the code was switched to a 4-digit code. Same rules apply, so for example 3 0 0 3 means the tyre was manufactured in the 30th week of 2003.
As part of the DOT code (G in the tyre marking above), there is a tyre manufacture date stamped on the sidewall. Oddly this code is sometimes only one one sidewall so you might need to get under your car and look at the inward-facing side of the tyre. Take a look at yours - there will be a three- or four-digit code. This code denotes when the tyre was manufactured, and as a rule-of-thumb, you should never use tyres more than 6 years old.
Read more: http://www.carbibles.com/tyre_bible.html#ixzz34zVO...
I will keep digging but it looks like six years is the safe working life of tyres. 10 at the max--
After five years or more in service, your tyres should be thoroughly inspected at least once per year. If the need arises, follow the recommendations of the vehicle manufacturer regarding replacing the original equipment tyres. As a precaution, if the tyres have not been replaced 10 years from their date of manufacture (see how to read a tyre sidewall), Michelin recommends replacing them with new tyres. Even if they appear to be in usable condition and have not worn down to the tread wear indicator.
Consumer Advisory: Factors to Consider in the Life of Your Tires
The following elements each play an important part in your tire's safety. Throughout the life of the tires it is necessary to see how each of these plays a different role. Excludes trailer tires.
Up to 6 Years:
Visual tire inspections and monthly air pressure checks are recommended.
Tire Quality/Construction: Features and Benefits help to describe capabilities of tires during this period.
Service Conditions/Maintenance: Rotate tires every 6-8,000 miles, check air pressure monthly and check tire balance every 12-16,000 miles. Tire Manufacturers suggest most tires are out of service at 3-4 years based on wear.
Tire Wear/Condition: Less than new tread changes traction and stability capabilities in extreme weather conditions (such as: snow, ice, rain, dirt/mud).
Environmental Conditions: Exposure to heat and ultraviolet rays may cause structural changes in the tire not found in more moderate climates.
Tire DOT Number*: Tire age is not the major consideration during this portion of the tire's life.
6 to 10 Years:
Replacement is recommended.
Tire Quality/Construction: Are more valid concerns as some tires are designed to be nearing the end of their service life based on average consumer travel of 12-15,000 miles annually.
Service Conditions/Maintenance: Tires that have not been serviced or maintained properly are typically at the end of their service life.
Wear/Condition: Less tread reduces traction and stability in all weather conditions as well as propensity to punctures.
Environmental Conditions: Exposure to heat and ultraviolet rays causes ozone/weather cracking and structural changes.
Tire DOT Number*: Now, one of the important considerations as some vehicle manufacturers recommend replacement and tire manufacturer warranties expire.
More Than 10 Years:
No service on tires with a DOT beyond 10 years.
Tire Quality/Construction, Service Conditions/ Maintenance, Tire Wear/Condition, Environmental Conditions: Regardless of all of these conditions, tires reach the end of their life.
Tire DOT Number*: Tire age is the most important consideration during this portion of the tire life as tire manufacturers recommend replacement of any tires regardless of service, including spares.
- Department of Transportation Number is stamped
Reading the code. The code is pretty simple. The three-digit code was used for tyres manufactured before 2000. So for example 1 7 6 means it was manufactured in the 17th week of 6th year of the decade. In this case it means 1986. For tyres manufactured in the 90's, the same code holds true but there is a little triangle after the DOT code. So for this example, a tyre manufactured in the 17th week of 1996 would have the code 176triangle
After 2000, the code was switched to a 4-digit code. Same rules apply, so for example 3 0 0 3 means the tyre was manufactured in the 30th week of 2003.
As part of the DOT code (G in the tyre marking above), there is a tyre manufacture date stamped on the sidewall. Oddly this code is sometimes only one one sidewall so you might need to get under your car and look at the inward-facing side of the tyre. Take a look at yours - there will be a three- or four-digit code. This code denotes when the tyre was manufactured, and as a rule-of-thumb, you should never use tyres more than 6 years old.
Read more: http://www.carbibles.com/tyre_bible.html#ixzz34zVO...
I will keep digging but it looks like six years is the safe working life of tyres. 10 at the max--
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