Girlfriend given disciplinary at new job
Discussion
Hi guys 
Sorry for the wall of text, I really am!
Girlfriend has recently started a new job as a hotel receptionist 2 months ago and is still learning everything but is getting there. The other day she did a refund for a guest that had stopped as they were not happy with their stay, this was over the phone and after they has left.
When you do this, the system shows any other recent stays that the customer had where they also got a refund, my girlfriend, being new, didn't realize and just thought it was showing her other recent stays. Trying to make conversation, she says, "oh I see you stopped at X hotel recently" As the guest gave her a one word yes, and sounded a bit off, she decided not to continue with the small talk and just continued with the normal spiel for the refund.
Anyway, next thing she knows, the customer has then phoned up a week or so later to make a complaint as they felt like she had mentioned the other stay in a kind of "Oh I see you had your money back here too" kind of tone. This is where it escalates very quickly...
2 days after the complaint she gets taken into a room, she has 2 managers, one acts as the note taker. Before any questions were even asked they tell her that she will shortly be getting a letter notifying her of an up-coming Disciplinary. They say that they view her mentioning the other stay as releasing confidential information of a guests stay over the phone, to someone that she could not verify was the actual guest that had stopped. (even though she was doing a refund for them and to do so had already confirmed, name, address, reservation number, stay details etc) They had no problem with the refund she did, just the fact that she had mentioned this other stay at another Hotel to the guest.
At this point she became a bit emotional as they started mentioning potential gross Misconduct etc. They continued this meeting/interview despite her crying and did not give her the option of a break. Due to it being nearly a few weeks ago now she didn't really remember too many details and she was not shown any specific details of the complaint to help her remember, just a general run down from the manager. Her responses to their questions were written down and then at the end she was asked to read and sign it. She did mention to them that in a few of her answers what she had said in tone etc was lost in the written word and it sounded different from what she had meant when she said it but she was told they could not change it and she just had to sign it.
She was then told as she left that she would receive her Disciplinary letter in the post and then would be given 48 hours notice from the letter to tell her when the hearing would be once she had received it. She is still working as normal in the mean time.
The training she has received on the job has been a bit sporadic and hard for her to master as she has had 4 different people training her and they all do it different ways so she has got a little confused and then if she was doing it person 1's way whilst with person 2 they would say she was doing it wrong and then show her their way. This has happened quite a lot from what I gather.
The only real proof of training that she has signed is a "core skills book" that she was told not to bother filling in anyway, this is something she brings home with her too. Most of it is not filled in and nothing in it mentions what you can and can not say to guests in terms of confidential information. She has been trained in terms of not shouting out single females room numbers, not giving out current guests details to random callers over the phone or at the desk etc unless it has been ok'd by the guest before-hand but nothing to say she can not mention a guests previous stay when, as far as she is concerned, they have verified who they are already.
My problem with it is this...I would take this "meeting" she had to be an investigatory interview but she was not informed of what it was before, during or after. Also, during the investigation it seems they had decided she was having a disciplinary before they had even finished investigating it. Is this not wrong?
When we get the Disciplinary letter back I was thinking of writing a reply asking them to explain what this meeting was as well as asking for proof of all training she has received whilst there and then going down the route of defending it as she has not been trained in it as they have no records to prove it. If they reply with "it was an investigation meeting" then I will write back (as her obviously) asking why they had decided she was guilty and required a disciplinary before they had even concluded the meeting (they documented themselves telling her about the disciplinary in the notes!)
To be honest, I think its a little bit of "face doesn't fit" as it seems a little OTT to get a disciplinary for this, especially considering she is new. Why could they not have simply trained/re-trained her in what she had done wrong, given her a talking to and then moved on?
I was wondering if anyone else could offer any more advice? Is there a particular way that a disciplinary must be handled?
Thanks!
Sorry for the wall of text, I really am!Girlfriend has recently started a new job as a hotel receptionist 2 months ago and is still learning everything but is getting there. The other day she did a refund for a guest that had stopped as they were not happy with their stay, this was over the phone and after they has left.
When you do this, the system shows any other recent stays that the customer had where they also got a refund, my girlfriend, being new, didn't realize and just thought it was showing her other recent stays. Trying to make conversation, she says, "oh I see you stopped at X hotel recently" As the guest gave her a one word yes, and sounded a bit off, she decided not to continue with the small talk and just continued with the normal spiel for the refund.
Anyway, next thing she knows, the customer has then phoned up a week or so later to make a complaint as they felt like she had mentioned the other stay in a kind of "Oh I see you had your money back here too" kind of tone. This is where it escalates very quickly...
2 days after the complaint she gets taken into a room, she has 2 managers, one acts as the note taker. Before any questions were even asked they tell her that she will shortly be getting a letter notifying her of an up-coming Disciplinary. They say that they view her mentioning the other stay as releasing confidential information of a guests stay over the phone, to someone that she could not verify was the actual guest that had stopped. (even though she was doing a refund for them and to do so had already confirmed, name, address, reservation number, stay details etc) They had no problem with the refund she did, just the fact that she had mentioned this other stay at another Hotel to the guest.
At this point she became a bit emotional as they started mentioning potential gross Misconduct etc. They continued this meeting/interview despite her crying and did not give her the option of a break. Due to it being nearly a few weeks ago now she didn't really remember too many details and she was not shown any specific details of the complaint to help her remember, just a general run down from the manager. Her responses to their questions were written down and then at the end she was asked to read and sign it. She did mention to them that in a few of her answers what she had said in tone etc was lost in the written word and it sounded different from what she had meant when she said it but she was told they could not change it and she just had to sign it.
She was then told as she left that she would receive her Disciplinary letter in the post and then would be given 48 hours notice from the letter to tell her when the hearing would be once she had received it. She is still working as normal in the mean time.
The training she has received on the job has been a bit sporadic and hard for her to master as she has had 4 different people training her and they all do it different ways so she has got a little confused and then if she was doing it person 1's way whilst with person 2 they would say she was doing it wrong and then show her their way. This has happened quite a lot from what I gather.
The only real proof of training that she has signed is a "core skills book" that she was told not to bother filling in anyway, this is something she brings home with her too. Most of it is not filled in and nothing in it mentions what you can and can not say to guests in terms of confidential information. She has been trained in terms of not shouting out single females room numbers, not giving out current guests details to random callers over the phone or at the desk etc unless it has been ok'd by the guest before-hand but nothing to say she can not mention a guests previous stay when, as far as she is concerned, they have verified who they are already.
My problem with it is this...I would take this "meeting" she had to be an investigatory interview but she was not informed of what it was before, during or after. Also, during the investigation it seems they had decided she was having a disciplinary before they had even finished investigating it. Is this not wrong?
When we get the Disciplinary letter back I was thinking of writing a reply asking them to explain what this meeting was as well as asking for proof of all training she has received whilst there and then going down the route of defending it as she has not been trained in it as they have no records to prove it. If they reply with "it was an investigation meeting" then I will write back (as her obviously) asking why they had decided she was guilty and required a disciplinary before they had even concluded the meeting (they documented themselves telling her about the disciplinary in the notes!)
To be honest, I think its a little bit of "face doesn't fit" as it seems a little OTT to get a disciplinary for this, especially considering she is new. Why could they not have simply trained/re-trained her in what she had done wrong, given her a talking to and then moved on?
I was wondering if anyone else could offer any more advice? Is there a particular way that a disciplinary must be handled?
Thanks!
Edited by ymwoods on Sunday 29th June 23:02
They could just let her go now and be done with it; it's a hotel, that kind of thing happens. It's s
tty, but so is working in a hotel. Probably better to just resign now and find something better.
If you can actually be bothered to fight it then I would ask for a copy of the code of conduct and a copy of the company's data protection policy.
tty, but so is working in a hotel. Probably better to just resign now and find something better. If you can actually be bothered to fight it then I would ask for a copy of the code of conduct and a copy of the company's data protection policy.
To be honest, I was wondering why they didn't just say goodbye as she has been there less than a year so they don't really need ANY reason.
As they are doing it via a Disciplinary, and for the fact that she doesn't believe she has actually done anything wrong, she would like to fight it. If she looses and then has to go then its no big deal to be honest. Better to try and leave with a clear record though...
In terms of code of conduct, do you mean the Disciplinary code of conduct or one for the staff? Would they have just a "general" one?
Thanks for your comments. I work in a completely different kind of place so have never had to deal with a disciplinary. If you screw up everyone takes the piss for a few weeks and then its forgotten about once someone else cocks up. If your a real doughnut then you might get a quiet word in the office and that's about as far as it goes unless its something more serious or continual.
As they are doing it via a Disciplinary, and for the fact that she doesn't believe she has actually done anything wrong, she would like to fight it. If she looses and then has to go then its no big deal to be honest. Better to try and leave with a clear record though...
In terms of code of conduct, do you mean the Disciplinary code of conduct or one for the staff? Would they have just a "general" one?
Thanks for your comments. I work in a completely different kind of place so have never had to deal with a disciplinary. If you screw up everyone takes the piss for a few weeks and then its forgotten about once someone else cocks up. If your a real doughnut then you might get a quiet word in the office and that's about as far as it goes unless its something more serious or continual.
Edited by ymwoods on Sunday 29th June 23:24
I'm struggling to understand what she's done wrong. Seems to me she's identified a potential serial complainer who tries to fraudulently get free hotel accommodation. Shouldn't she be thanked?
If it's disclosing confidential information - even though she'd already identified the person she was speaking with, I'd ask had she actually been trained specifically on that issue?
If it's disclosing confidential information - even though she'd already identified the person she was speaking with, I'd ask had she actually been trained specifically on that issue?
Now she is trained, she works on her own which she enjoys to be honest as she can just get on and she enjoys talking to the guests and doing the normal flirty talk with the single (for that night anyway ) men checking in.
She didn't enjoy the training at all though, as I said before, I just think the others have decided her face doesn't fit. As she is now trained though she only sees other members of staff for the first 5 mins and the last 5 mins of her shift as they swap over.
Obviously its a very female dominated environment however so its very bhy during the swap overs, they all just moan about the last person they swapped with from what I gather.
They have been a little vague to be honest, just told her that she has given out confidential information about the guest stopping at a previous hotel. As far as she is concerned she had verified their details enough for her to issue a refund to their credit card so why was it not verified enough for her to talk about a previous stay that was on the system?
The training she has received is a little hit and miss and none of it specifically covered what other bits of information she can and can not mention when talking to them over the phone, so I would say, no she hasn't. As I said before, I think we will ask for everything that's signed by her that is to do with training and then just go through it all and see if their is anything. If not, can she just go, well I wasn't trained in it?
) men checking in.She didn't enjoy the training at all though, as I said before, I just think the others have decided her face doesn't fit. As she is now trained though she only sees other members of staff for the first 5 mins and the last 5 mins of her shift as they swap over.
Obviously its a very female dominated environment however so its very b
hy during the swap overs, they all just moan about the last person they swapped with from what I gather.RichB said:
I'm struggling to understand what she's done wrong. Seems to me she's identified a potential serial complainer who tries to fraudulently get free hotel accommodation. Shouldn't she be thanked?
If it's disclosing confidential information - even though she'd already identified the person she was speaking with, I'd ask had she actually been trained specifically on that issue?
I'm guessing that is probably why the system shows up what other hotels they have been refunded from, but by the looks of it they don't do anything about it. Their loss I suppose.If it's disclosing confidential information - even though she'd already identified the person she was speaking with, I'd ask had she actually been trained specifically on that issue?
They have been a little vague to be honest, just told her that she has given out confidential information about the guest stopping at a previous hotel. As far as she is concerned she had verified their details enough for her to issue a refund to their credit card so why was it not verified enough for her to talk about a previous stay that was on the system?
The training she has received is a little hit and miss and none of it specifically covered what other bits of information she can and can not mention when talking to them over the phone, so I would say, no she hasn't. As I said before, I think we will ask for everything that's signed by her that is to do with training and then just go through it all and see if their is anything. If not, can she just go, well I wasn't trained in it?
Edited by ymwoods on Sunday 29th June 23:37
Terminator X said:
ymwoods said:
To be honest, I was wondering why they didn't just say goodbye as she has been there less than a year so they don't really need ANY reason.
It's at any time <2 years now ...Edited by ymwoods on Sunday 29th June 23:24
TX.
otolith said:
Giving a moocher a reason to come sniffing for compo, and the hotel not having the balls to tell them they'll see them in court.
This.Poor training. Difficult I know but g/f might want to look back at her reaction to the situation. It is hard when you are 'ambushed' but once you are aware of the situation it can often be balanced by a swift reply on reflection. I'm very much all for accepting your own failings and errors but to allow people to criticise you for something that you have had no training on and where there has been no breach is not the way forward either. I'm all for s
t eating grins but they (stirred by serial complainer) are accusing her of failures that, by the sound of the posts you have made, she was not guilty of and that she could not have known were failures.As posted by others - Look for a better employer.
ymwoods said:
To be honest, I think its a little bit of "face doesn't fit" as it seems a little OTT to get a disciplinary for this, especially considering she is new. Why could they not have simply trained/re-trained her in what she had done wrong, given her a talking to and then moved on?
What size of company is this?I know someone in this business and recruiting and retaining front-desk staff is an absolute nightmare so I'd be surprised that if she's otherwise getting on OK they'd be so hard on her. Perhaps it really is just that her face doesn't fit.
Sy1441 said:
Breach of DPA is a serious incident however if the DPA questions were confirmed as above and she happened to mention a previous stay, unless its explicitly detailed that this is against policy then I don't really see any issue.
I am not convinced that what was said, if set out above, is in any way a breach of the DPA. Maybe I need to go back and read the act, but if the customer was identified then that is that.A clear case of a poor manager. In a customer facing job such as a hotel, causing a customer complaint is quite understandably automatically very serious. A good manager however should be able to consider what the customer is complaining about, check the customer's history and work out if the complaint is reasonable or not. I bet you receive nothing more in writing, just a ticking off. I agree that finding another job may be best.
To be fair, they did tell her that the Disciplinary letter would be dropping last Fri or over the weekend at the latest. I know we are relying on the Royal Mail here but i'm a little hopeful that this landed on another managers desk and they saw the stupidity in it. On the other hand, it could just be late.
She also asked for a copy of the minutes of this "meeting" she had the other day and was told by the manager (that asked the questions in it) that she was not sure if she could get them for her??
This all seems a little weird to be honest with you...
The size of the company is national, but they seem to run each hotel they own as a separate small business. They do also indeed seem to have trouble keeping the staff. She was originally brought in to cover a P/T staff members absence on a temporary contract, another team member then left so she was offered the chance to take a, F/T, permanent contract a few days after starting, which she accepted.
Would the Data protection act state anywhere what details would need to be confirmed with a customer before details of their account could be given out?
She also asked for a copy of the minutes of this "meeting" she had the other day and was told by the manager (that asked the questions in it) that she was not sure if she could get them for her??
This all seems a little weird to be honest with you...
The size of the company is national, but they seem to run each hotel they own as a separate small business. They do also indeed seem to have trouble keeping the staff. She was originally brought in to cover a P/T staff members absence on a temporary contract, another team member then left so she was offered the chance to take a, F/T, permanent contract a few days after starting, which she accepted.
Would the Data protection act state anywhere what details would need to be confirmed with a customer before details of their account could be given out?
Edited by ymwoods on Tuesday 1st July 22:18
I currently work as a hotel receptionist, and that sounds very OTT.
Where I work, refunds are handles by either the reservations department and then passed to the accounts department (who go through senior management). Reception staff very rarely do them.
It shouldn't be coming down on a trainee if it was an honest mistake. Sounds like they are coming down harshly if that is really all there is to it.
Complaints (and online reviews) are taken extremely seriously by management, so maybe that is why they are going for her.
What has her manager got to say about it all?
Where I work, refunds are handles by either the reservations department and then passed to the accounts department (who go through senior management). Reception staff very rarely do them.
It shouldn't be coming down on a trainee if it was an honest mistake. Sounds like they are coming down harshly if that is really all there is to it.
Complaints (and online reviews) are taken extremely seriously by management, so maybe that is why they are going for her.
What has her manager got to say about it all?
Sorry to hear about this.
I was given a job around a year ago and was released from it after 2 months. I didn't do anything wrong, always on time, work fine etc. Was called into the office and told to leave. Was given my weeks noticed payment, no real reason as the manager made a swift exit straight after. As it was a small company of 5 people i think they realised they could manage on there own without the extra help. I was pretty shocked but they are in the right to get rid of you as easy as that.
I was given a job around a year ago and was released from it after 2 months. I didn't do anything wrong, always on time, work fine etc. Was called into the office and told to leave. Was given my weeks noticed payment, no real reason as the manager made a swift exit straight after. As it was a small company of 5 people i think they realised they could manage on there own without the extra help. I was pretty shocked but they are in the right to get rid of you as easy as that.
ymwoods said:
To be fair, they did tell her that the Disciplinary letter would be dropping last Fri or over the weekend at the latest. I know we are relying on the Royal Mail here but i'm a little hopeful that this landed on another managers desk and they saw the stupidity in it. On the other hand, it could just be late.
She also asked for a copy of the minutes of this "meeting" she had the other day and was told by the manager (that asked the questions in it) that she was not sure if she could get them for her??
This all seems a little weird to be honest with you...
The size of the company is national, but they seem to run each hotel they own as a separate small business. They do also indeed seem to have trouble keeping the staff. She was originally brought in to cover a P/T staff members absence on a temporary contract, another team member then left so she was offered the chance to take a, F/T, permanent contract a few days after starting, which she accepted.
Would the Data protection act state anywhere what details would need to be confirmed with a customer before details of their account could be given out?
You should document these things. Write an email which confirms that conversation re the minutes. Save it and file it. She also asked for a copy of the minutes of this "meeting" she had the other day and was told by the manager (that asked the questions in it) that she was not sure if she could get them for her??
This all seems a little weird to be honest with you...
The size of the company is national, but they seem to run each hotel they own as a separate small business. They do also indeed seem to have trouble keeping the staff. She was originally brought in to cover a P/T staff members absence on a temporary contract, another team member then left so she was offered the chance to take a, F/T, permanent contract a few days after starting, which she accepted.
Would the Data protection act state anywhere what details would need to be confirmed with a customer before details of their account could be given out?
Edited by ymwoods on Tuesday 1st July 22:18
latest bit of news.
She heard off a member of staff on Friday (member of staff nothing to do with disciplinary hearing) that she would be having a "meeting" on Monday. Still no Disciplinary letter.
I got back from some business this afternoon so as soon as I heard this I called the manager in charge of the Hotel that had told this staff member and asked her to clarify what this meeting was. I was told it was the disciplinary hearing.
I explained to her that we were yet to get a copy of the Disciplinary letter, and as such, had not been given the right to request our own evidence and that as such she would not be able to attend as she did not have all the required information to defend herself. The hearing has now been postponed. The letter was apparently posted this Friday just gone even though she was told she would receive it last week. I didn't even bother talking about how the letter probably will not have been picked up until Sat morning from the postbox and as such the earliest we would have ever received it is the same day as the hearing...
Her reply to me asking why this member of staff had been told was that she needed to explain to the staff member why she would be watching the desk on Monday...surely that information is not required to watch the reception desk, if the staff member refused to do it then its "refusing a reasonable request" A manager should not have to explain every decision to the staff...
I don't think we are going to bother going down the grievance route for the above, unless someone feels we are stupid for not doing so?
I feel it would be best to ask for a statement off the manager asking her to detail and show evidence (was done over text) of what was said to the employee about it and then ask for a statement from her regarding why she thought it was appropriate to discuss it with the member of staff and why she felt they needed to know to do their job properly. we then plan to bring this up in the hearing and show how even the company can not keep confidential information secure within its own management.
...or, do does she just bang two grievances in, one for breaching HER confidentiality and then another (once we have the evidence) to say that they had decided a disciplinary was being held before the investigation was complete?
She heard off a member of staff on Friday (member of staff nothing to do with disciplinary hearing) that she would be having a "meeting" on Monday. Still no Disciplinary letter.
I got back from some business this afternoon so as soon as I heard this I called the manager in charge of the Hotel that had told this staff member and asked her to clarify what this meeting was. I was told it was the disciplinary hearing.
I explained to her that we were yet to get a copy of the Disciplinary letter, and as such, had not been given the right to request our own evidence and that as such she would not be able to attend as she did not have all the required information to defend herself. The hearing has now been postponed. The letter was apparently posted this Friday just gone even though she was told she would receive it last week. I didn't even bother talking about how the letter probably will not have been picked up until Sat morning from the postbox and as such the earliest we would have ever received it is the same day as the hearing...
Her reply to me asking why this member of staff had been told was that she needed to explain to the staff member why she would be watching the desk on Monday...surely that information is not required to watch the reception desk, if the staff member refused to do it then its "refusing a reasonable request" A manager should not have to explain every decision to the staff...
I don't think we are going to bother going down the grievance route for the above, unless someone feels we are stupid for not doing so?
I feel it would be best to ask for a statement off the manager asking her to detail and show evidence (was done over text) of what was said to the employee about it and then ask for a statement from her regarding why she thought it was appropriate to discuss it with the member of staff and why she felt they needed to know to do their job properly. we then plan to bring this up in the hearing and show how even the company can not keep confidential information secure within its own management.
...or, do does she just bang two grievances in, one for breaching HER confidentiality and then another (once we have the evidence) to say that they had decided a disciplinary was being held before the investigation was complete?
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