Unfinished welding
Discussion
Hi,
Need some advice please;
A garage in Bucks claiming to specialise in Jaguars has had my Daimler Coupe for over 2 years - the main work to be done was replace the inner and outer cill on one side.
They removed the old cill quite quickly but over the last two years have constantly failed to finish the work.
Last week they told me that the work was almost complete and that the car was at the trimmers to replace the carpet, then they said it was being road tested and had stalled, the owner was in the car at the time and was awaiting recovery, then a story about ordering a fuel tank change-over valve - although due to pick up the car on Saturday we agreed that it was best that they investigated further to make sure the car was perfect. I had paid £1000 'on-account' but was expecting the main invoice on collection.
Today I received a mail telling me that no work has been done and asking that I remove the vehicle from the premises - and that it was preferable to do this with a recovery vehicle.
I have searched the internet for similar cases but all I can find is cases where work has been invoiced but poorly completed - not where the car has been dismantled in advance of work and then that work not carried out or an invoice raised - so other than reminding me how gullable I have been can anyone offer advice based on similar experience.
I posted here and not in SP&L as I thought it more relevant to the Classic Car world.
Many thanks,
John.
Need some advice please;
A garage in Bucks claiming to specialise in Jaguars has had my Daimler Coupe for over 2 years - the main work to be done was replace the inner and outer cill on one side.
They removed the old cill quite quickly but over the last two years have constantly failed to finish the work.
Last week they told me that the work was almost complete and that the car was at the trimmers to replace the carpet, then they said it was being road tested and had stalled, the owner was in the car at the time and was awaiting recovery, then a story about ordering a fuel tank change-over valve - although due to pick up the car on Saturday we agreed that it was best that they investigated further to make sure the car was perfect. I had paid £1000 'on-account' but was expecting the main invoice on collection.
Today I received a mail telling me that no work has been done and asking that I remove the vehicle from the premises - and that it was preferable to do this with a recovery vehicle.
I have searched the internet for similar cases but all I can find is cases where work has been invoiced but poorly completed - not where the car has been dismantled in advance of work and then that work not carried out or an invoice raised - so other than reminding me how gullable I have been can anyone offer advice based on similar experience.
I posted here and not in SP&L as I thought it more relevant to the Classic Car world.
Many thanks,
John.
A very strange story indeed, my advice would be to draw a line under this as you will waste lots of time trying to get them to either finish the job or compensate you and just get your car back.
I know this is easy to say as I would take it very personally if this happened to me, if you want the number of a good fabricator/welder in Manchester PM me for his details.
I know this is easy to say as I would take it very personally if this happened to me, if you want the number of a good fabricator/welder in Manchester PM me for his details.
Nightmare story . There must be some legal comeback here.
I would collect the car ASAP .
If you want the work doing correctly , I would suggest usin XJ Restorations on south coast , plenty of info on them if you google and they quite regularly seem to be sorting out other garages botches.
Best of luck . I had one of these coupes and they are a lovely thing.
I would collect the car ASAP .
If you want the work doing correctly , I would suggest usin XJ Restorations on south coast , plenty of info on them if you google and they quite regularly seem to be sorting out other garages botches.
Best of luck . I had one of these coupes and they are a lovely thing.
My concern would be the vulnerability of the car currently. Since the garage have done no work,apparently, I would immediately arrange collection to protect the investment. And keep your car safe. Sadly you will be ought of pocket but clearly the garge have conned you. My concern would therefore be that the garge may fold leving you minus a car. You may recover your costs via litigation in time but currently I think the primary concern must be the security of the vehicle. Get the car back and then proceed against the less than honest garge.
This is a rather more common story than it should be and I have known cars go missing in just these circumstances. I would not delay recovery. The garage clearly have no intention and indeed have had no intention for some time, to actually carry out the work. Unpalatable, but protecting your car now is crucial.
This is a rather more common story than it should be and I have known cars go missing in just these circumstances. I would not delay recovery. The garage clearly have no intention and indeed have had no intention for some time, to actually carry out the work. Unpalatable, but protecting your car now is crucial.
Many thanks for the responses.
I had arranged for a transporter truck to meet me at the workshop in order that I could decide the best course of action and remove the car if necessary.
The discussion was fraught and very difficult to remain calm with someone who had so blatantly lied to me - he now tells me he is to cease trading but not seek insolvency - so possibly another near-truth.
It seems the guy has taken on too much work and possibly over-ambitious premises as there were a large number of cars that had clearly been started with no sign of being finished - an E-Type roadster stripped to a bare shell had been sorted and primed and looked good - but now stuck in limbo.
The coupe is now back with me and at least the car had been braced before the old cill was removed so I doubt any damage has been done in the move - extremely dusty inside and out which appears to have dried out the leather dramatically.
As suggested I contacted XJRestoration and am waiting on a call back; I'll also have a look at the online small claims site.
Hopefully I will be able to move on with the work and ultimately end up with a great car - when I saw it today I remembered what a handsome car it is and feel better that it is back in my hands.
Cheers,
John.
I had arranged for a transporter truck to meet me at the workshop in order that I could decide the best course of action and remove the car if necessary.
The discussion was fraught and very difficult to remain calm with someone who had so blatantly lied to me - he now tells me he is to cease trading but not seek insolvency - so possibly another near-truth.
It seems the guy has taken on too much work and possibly over-ambitious premises as there were a large number of cars that had clearly been started with no sign of being finished - an E-Type roadster stripped to a bare shell had been sorted and primed and looked good - but now stuck in limbo.
The coupe is now back with me and at least the car had been braced before the old cill was removed so I doubt any damage has been done in the move - extremely dusty inside and out which appears to have dried out the leather dramatically.
As suggested I contacted XJRestoration and am waiting on a call back; I'll also have a look at the online small claims site.
Hopefully I will be able to move on with the work and ultimately end up with a great car - when I saw it today I remembered what a handsome car it is and feel better that it is back in my hands.
Cheers,
John.
Good luck to you in getting the car completed. I regret to say such threads are not infrequent. I worked in the insolvency buiness for many years and this story has been repeated, many, many times. As I said in my earlier post at least you have the car. I have known cases where the car has never been recovered. Civil Matter according to the Police. I disagree but that is their approach.
Having got the car back you could try a statutory demand for the monies paid. That has often worked for me indeed it is my first line of attack with such characters. If it is for a serious amount I sometimes serve the SD on the bank of the business as well. Only when the matter has reached the point of being arguably a fraud and unarguably due. That technique can be effective and does tend to rattle the debtors.
However it sounds to me that the business concerned has no money and therefore I would consider carefully the cat of litigation before proceeding. Once the SD has been served if the debtor ignores the demand you can immediately apply for a judgement debt using the SD as grounds. Beyond that point I think you are looking at more losses which are pointless. You cannot get blood from a stone. As I can trestify after many years of trying.
Get the car done and enjoy it on the road. At least you have the car!
Having got the car back you could try a statutory demand for the monies paid. That has often worked for me indeed it is my first line of attack with such characters. If it is for a serious amount I sometimes serve the SD on the bank of the business as well. Only when the matter has reached the point of being arguably a fraud and unarguably due. That technique can be effective and does tend to rattle the debtors.
However it sounds to me that the business concerned has no money and therefore I would consider carefully the cat of litigation before proceeding. Once the SD has been served if the debtor ignores the demand you can immediately apply for a judgement debt using the SD as grounds. Beyond that point I think you are looking at more losses which are pointless. You cannot get blood from a stone. As I can trestify after many years of trying.
Get the car done and enjoy it on the road. At least you have the car!
Sadly it seems that many restoration businesses work this way today. Too much money is taken out of the business before that money, although paid to the business, has actually been earnt. The money you paid no doubt went towards paying to finish someone elses car as the money they'd paid had been spent elswhere. Over time this snowballs and any money paid in advance only goes to pay off debts already incurred and overdue. Eventually cash flow runs dry.
Glad you got your car back - in that respect I think you have to count yourself as very fortunate.
Glad you got your car back - in that respect I think you have to count yourself as very fortunate.
having dealt with some bad classic car businesses (both still running and both still with a good reputation despite other customers getting 'poor' service from them) I'd say unless it's very easy and inexpensive to get your money back then totally forget about it and the bloke concerned, don't waste any more money, time, hassle and emotion on this guy
you've gained £1,000 of life experience
I wish I'd learnt at such a low cost
you've gained £1,000 of life experience
I wish I'd learnt at such a low cost
Online small claim lodged - a £70 bet that made me feel very much better about the whole thing.
Or perhaps it was the uplifting e-mail chat with Keith from XJrestorations and the tentative booking to have the repairs carried out by a professional
Also, I have learned how to spell that particular part of the car correctly - I have no idea why I have *always* believed it began with a 'C'
Again many thanks for the responses - it is interesting and ultimately very disappointing that this does not seem to be an isolated case - but the lesson has been learned and more due diligence and no pre-payment in the future.
Or perhaps it was the uplifting e-mail chat with Keith from XJrestorations and the tentative booking to have the repairs carried out by a professional
Also, I have learned how to spell that particular part of the car correctly - I have no idea why I have *always* believed it began with a 'C'
Again many thanks for the responses - it is interesting and ultimately very disappointing that this does not seem to be an isolated case - but the lesson has been learned and more due diligence and no pre-payment in the future.
rallycross said:
Hope you get it sorted
For the benefit of any other Jag owners give some details on who ripped you off without the name and shame rule being used .
Hi Mr Cross,For the benefit of any other Jag owners give some details on who ripped you off without the name and shame rule being used .
I have pained myself over the naming and shaming rule and in the end I didn't think it was fair to the relaxed top gear driving people of Mursley
I guess I left it so long because I believed all the bull the guy told me;
Workshop move - this one was true.
His new paint booth went on fire when being tested for fume extraction
Burst appendix
Knocked off Motorbike.
Despite these 'setbacks' I believed he was making progress because he told me he was - and at one point I did mail to suggest that if he didn't want the work then he only had to let me know.
On the day that I went to his workshop and he told me the car was at the trimmers I should have had a better look as I now know it was at the back of the workshop covered in dust.
My problem seems to be that I could not believe that anyone would lie the absurd way that he did; as I mentioned in the original post the absolute cracker was that last Thursday he was out for a test drive and had broken down!!!
Workshop move - this one was true.
His new paint booth went on fire when being tested for fume extraction
Burst appendix
Knocked off Motorbike.
Despite these 'setbacks' I believed he was making progress because he told me he was - and at one point I did mail to suggest that if he didn't want the work then he only had to let me know.
On the day that I went to his workshop and he told me the car was at the trimmers I should have had a better look as I now know it was at the back of the workshop covered in dust.
My problem seems to be that I could not believe that anyone would lie the absurd way that he did; as I mentioned in the original post the absolute cracker was that last Thursday he was out for a test drive and had broken down!!!
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