Releasing information
Discussion
Does this bug others?
The Ultima factory site is information rich in terms of a possible purchasers requirements but when it comes to build information it lacks much information. Lets take an example, just this morning in Stigs "discussion" with Andygtt in the "hot topic!", he let me know that the factory are now recommending blocking off the Canam air scoop to reduce heat into the cockpit.
I could have raised the heat issue with the factory or they could have let this information out on this forum or have a build section on their website. What would have been best? I think that the pre-emptive methods are the best.
Lots of information is gleaned during builders conversations with the factory, but wouldn't it be better to put it out in an open forum rather than buried in owners build sites that in some cases have had build methods that maybe the factory don't fully agree with. (eg lagging water pipes through the side pods - OK the factory may not have that view so don't shoot)
The Ultima factory site is information rich in terms of a possible purchasers requirements but when it comes to build information it lacks much information. Lets take an example, just this morning in Stigs "discussion" with Andygtt in the "hot topic!", he let me know that the factory are now recommending blocking off the Canam air scoop to reduce heat into the cockpit.
I could have raised the heat issue with the factory or they could have let this information out on this forum or have a build section on their website. What would have been best? I think that the pre-emptive methods are the best.
Lots of information is gleaned during builders conversations with the factory, but wouldn't it be better to put it out in an open forum rather than buried in owners build sites that in some cases have had build methods that maybe the factory don't fully agree with. (eg lagging water pipes through the side pods - OK the factory may not have that view so don't shoot)
But Phil, the fact that it appeared here kind of answers your question doesn't it? 
Again, it's one of the reasons that I'm doing the Can-Am site, so that a lot of these little queries get answered for future builders (Not that everyone appreciates it
). But I agree, it would be nice. Perhaps it could form a FAQ on here for the odd build questions?
Again, it's one of the reasons that I'm doing the Can-Am site, so that a lot of these little queries get answered for future builders (Not that everyone appreciates it
). But I agree, it would be nice. Perhaps it could form a FAQ on here for the odd build questions?Stig, apart from the casual inclusion of the remark in a very unrelated topic we would have to rely on your new website to pass this nugget on. How many builders are suffering or will face the same problem before it is posted on your bulletin board?
You say that your website will answer a lot of these little queries. Dont take this the wrong way but that makes it sound officially sanctioned and that all your views can be taken as the factory view.
I think it proves my point that the dissemination of up to date build and parts info needs thinking about by the factory from a factory perspective.
By the way, I dont think that blocking the scoop provides the complete answer... just part of the jigsaw.
Keep ing
>> Edited by canam-phil on Friday 10th December 14:49
You say that your website will answer a lot of these little queries. Dont take this the wrong way but that makes it sound officially sanctioned and that all your views can be taken as the factory view.
I think it proves my point that the dissemination of up to date build and parts info needs thinking about by the factory from a factory perspective.
By the way, I dont think that blocking the scoop provides the complete answer... just part of the jigsaw.
Keep
ing >> Edited by canam-phil on Friday 10th December 14:49
Phil, I can categorically say that my websites are neither factory sanctioned nor do they purely reflect factory views. If they were, you can bet your life that the coolant lagging saga would have been removed a long time ago!
That's where the forum and the websites come in, to fill in the gaps. Half the fun is working out the solutions for yourself after all (but it's good to have a 'cheat' manual handy )
I'd heard about the scoop heat issue from Andygtt and Crazyofcookham a long time ago too. Again, that's the great thing about sharing our collective experiences here. Warts and all!
That's where the forum and the websites come in, to fill in the gaps. Half the fun is working out the solutions for yourself after all (but it's good to have a 'cheat' manual handy
) I'd heard about the scoop heat issue from Andygtt and Crazyofcookham a long time ago too. Again, that's the great thing about sharing our collective experiences here. Warts and all!
I agree with Phil. I think it would be useful if the factory posted changes to spec and build recommendations as they become available. I generally manage to find out about them anyway, and it wouldn't be a substitute for the info on different approaches taken by people here and on build sites. But it would make it easier if there was a single, easily accessible list of factory changes (either posted on their website or emailed to customers for example). It might even generate more business for the factory. An example perhaps being when the 'rear clip open' warning bits were introduced.
Stig, you still have ignored the point that the factory need to play a large part in dissemination of information.
After all, we individually may not realise we need to ask the factory but as sure as hell, the factory will have been asked many times for the same information. Thats the benefit of FAQs. Perhaps like many here, I have first hand knowledge of running technical help desks and knowledge-based systems and just the effort of setting up an FAQ based on each months "popular" questions reduced our workload month on month quite dramatically.
Andygtt did raise and discuss the heat issue and had posted his solutions. I may be wrong but as far as I recall blocking the scoop was not a factory proposed action. It works great on my Canam though and looks good too.
Cliveg mentioned the rear clip warning system matter. I agree that is an example of an issue that had been discussed on here a number of times and people were suggesting mods they were doing to reduce the risk.
What about the driveshaft boot splitting problem? I did not have the sketch sent to me with the driveshafts nor was it sent to me. The letter is dated April 2003 and was on this forum August 2004. How many of us could have damaged the boots in that time?
Factory publish on a website or send to all owners by email. No cost there then. And it would be fantastic for customer care.
I would love to set up this sort of knowledge system for them.
Nuf sed.
After all, we individually may not realise we need to ask the factory but as sure as hell, the factory will have been asked many times for the same information. Thats the benefit of FAQs. Perhaps like many here, I have first hand knowledge of running technical help desks and knowledge-based systems and just the effort of setting up an FAQ based on each months "popular" questions reduced our workload month on month quite dramatically.
Andygtt did raise and discuss the heat issue and had posted his solutions. I may be wrong but as far as I recall blocking the scoop was not a factory proposed action. It works great on my Canam though and looks good too.
Cliveg mentioned the rear clip warning system matter. I agree that is an example of an issue that had been discussed on here a number of times and people were suggesting mods they were doing to reduce the risk.
What about the driveshaft boot splitting problem? I did not have the sketch sent to me with the driveshafts nor was it sent to me. The letter is dated April 2003 and was on this forum August 2004. How many of us could have damaged the boots in that time?
Factory publish on a website or send to all owners by email. No cost there then. And it would be fantastic for customer care.
I would love to set up this sort of knowledge system for them.
Nuf sed.
[quote=canam-phil]......Factory publish on a website or send to all owners by email. No cost there then. And it would be fantastic for customer care....../quote]
If the issue for the factory is an 'airing dirty linen' stigma if they put this sort of FAQ up on the factory web site then a customer only page would work fine to keep their paying customers informed. Login and password protected with access granted when your first payment cheque clears.
Steve
If the issue for the factory is an 'airing dirty linen' stigma if they put this sort of FAQ up on the factory web site then a customer only page would work fine to keep their paying customers informed. Login and password protected with access granted when your first payment cheque clears.
Steve
Steve talks about "airing dirty linen ". It depends on your viewpoint.
It should be construed as changes and improvements through constant evaluation, development and experience.
Take the rear clip matter - it must be viewed as constant development for safety reasons and I for one welcome that.
Take the driveshaft boot splitting. Came to light by one maybe two people experiencing this problem. Better to publish and be recognised as responsive rather than not publishing and thereby have it come out later.
I know what I would rather do. Air dirty linen in public because even though it might be discretely published, the word will out anyway if its of any significance.
And another thing, just having customer only webpages does not address completely the issue. Its the culture of disclosure that has to go along with it and the commitment to the time it takes to do it well.
It should be construed as changes and improvements through constant evaluation, development and experience.
Take the rear clip matter - it must be viewed as constant development for safety reasons and I for one welcome that.
Take the driveshaft boot splitting. Came to light by one maybe two people experiencing this problem. Better to publish and be recognised as responsive rather than not publishing and thereby have it come out later.
I know what I would rather do. Air dirty linen in public because even though it might be discretely published, the word will out anyway if its of any significance.
And another thing, just having customer only webpages does not address completely the issue. Its the culture of disclosure that has to go along with it and the commitment to the time it takes to do it well.
Sounds to me like something like a user "User Manual" like Wikipedia is what's wanted. Password protected to owners only, edited and moderated by the Factory and trusted contributors but contributed to by all (copyright owned by the Factory).
I'd run the server and do the admin if I thought it would ever take off...
I'd run the server and do the admin if I thought it would ever take off...
Let me start this reply by saying that having talked to many Ultima owners and builders in North America, the general concensus is "we love the car, but hate the factory". In my case,I wouldn't use the word hate, but if I could put the phrase "doesn't seem to give a s--- after we have your money" into one word I'd use it. Perhaps the factory has to be a little more friendly to it's customers that are not over 3000 miles and an ocean away.
Perhaps next to Andy, I think I have more miles on an CanAm than anyone else (close to 9000 miles at this writing). I have driven the car in temps from 24'F. to 105'F.
As per the heat problem, I addressed this last year
www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=48974&f=20&h=0
I was burned (literally) that the factory did not make me aware of this problem while I was building the car.
As per the clip opening problem we also addressed it last year after ours opened (my fault)
www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=72520&f=20&h=0 photos 250-255.
Ted didn't think much of it, but I can tell you that it's saved my clip many times. I couldn't think of driving the car without it.
I see the factory's point of view on some problem issues, but having to make the builder suffer through problems that are very apparent is not acceptable.
I've even hear it said that this is a factory "that can do no wrong"
Jack
Perhaps next to Andy, I think I have more miles on an CanAm than anyone else (close to 9000 miles at this writing). I have driven the car in temps from 24'F. to 105'F.
As per the heat problem, I addressed this last year
www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=48974&f=20&h=0
I was burned (literally) that the factory did not make me aware of this problem while I was building the car.
As per the clip opening problem we also addressed it last year after ours opened (my fault)
www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=72520&f=20&h=0 photos 250-255.
Ted didn't think much of it, but I can tell you that it's saved my clip many times. I couldn't think of driving the car without it.
I see the factory's point of view on some problem issues, but having to make the builder suffer through problems that are very apparent is not acceptable.
I've even hear it said that this is a factory "that can do no wrong"
Jack
canam-phil said:
he let me know that the factory are now recommending blocking off the Canam air scoop to reduce heat into the cockpit.
I could have raised the heat issue with the factory or they could have let this information out on this forum or have a build section on their website. What would have been best? I think that the pre-emptive methods are the best.
Ted recomended I do this on my first test 3 years ago. There is a very good reason for me not doing this in the end which is well documented on here and the reason I developed some side ducts for my canam.
But it has been said before that these little nuggets of information are not easy to come across.
You guys that are building cars now have far more of a chance than we did a few years ago as there are far more build sites and they are more comprehensive now..... you also have this forum/site that is a huge advantage.
Maybe a Hits and tips bit attached to this forum?
andygtt said:
Ted recomended I do this on my first test 3 years ago. There is a very good reason for me not doing this in the end which is well documented on here and the reason I developed some side ducts for my canam.
Andy, the tip does not appear on the build CDs that I have (or maybe it is but which one?) and my grill kit still included a grill for the scoop and not a blank.
All goes to show that these tips are nuggets of information that are not collated anywhere. All I'm stressing is that a systematic release using change notes is vital for the cars. And thats not the same as disseminating information ad hoc via build sites and this forum. - email lists or factory website, it matters not). Its a factory responsibility rather than a owners group responsibility I think.
But I love my Canam even on a cold day like this.
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