Unofficial Gibraltar Referendum
Discussion
I would just like to express my delight at the prospect of the people of Gibraltar having a Referendum on Britain's negotiations (selling out of British Subjects) with Spain.
Today an unofficial Referendum for the people of Gibraltar was announced.
Both the UK and Spanish governements have quickly advised they will ignore the result.
I am looking forward to watching Tony "Democratic International Statesman"
B'liar explaining how he can ignore the wishes of an entire country in the democratic west, whilst negotiating their future.
DAZ
Putting the Bollinger on ice........
Today an unofficial Referendum for the people of Gibraltar was announced.
Both the UK and Spanish governements have quickly advised they will ignore the result.
I am looking forward to watching Tony "Democratic International Statesman"
B'liar explaining how he can ignore the wishes of an entire country in the democratic west, whilst negotiating their future. DAZ
Putting the Bollinger on ice........
They might say that now but if the results were strong they'd be hard to ignore.
Here's a comparable situation:
In 1994/5 the then Tory gov't was considering privatising the Scottish water idustry. Until then it had been run by local authorities.
Strathclyde Regional Council (containing about 45% of the population of Scotland) ran its own referendum on this point. The result was an overwhelming "No".
Now this was clearly an unofficial referendum and didn't even cover the whole population. However, this result was though to be a major factor in the water industry here NOT being privatised. The tory gov't at the time were not excactly renowned for listening to the electorate.
(one bunch of arrogant to$$ers, replaced by another. And they wonder why there's a low turnout in elections.)
Here's a comparable situation:
In 1994/5 the then Tory gov't was considering privatising the Scottish water idustry. Until then it had been run by local authorities.
Strathclyde Regional Council (containing about 45% of the population of Scotland) ran its own referendum on this point. The result was an overwhelming "No".
Now this was clearly an unofficial referendum and didn't even cover the whole population. However, this result was though to be a major factor in the water industry here NOT being privatised. The tory gov't at the time were not excactly renowned for listening to the electorate.
(one bunch of arrogant to$$ers, replaced by another. And they wonder why there's a low turnout in elections.)
"more proof that the Beeb is now a stronghold of slimy, sycophantic, bliarite socialism"
Chief Exec - Greg Dyke - lifelong labour supporter
Chairman - can't rememebr the name - labour supporter
New Communications czar announced yesterday - Lord Curry, I think - Labour peer (but he's resigned te whip, so it's ok...)
do I see a pattern emerging?
the last time there was a referendum, it was approximately 27,500 against 44. the people spoke.
>> Edited by yum on Friday 26th July 11:20
Chief Exec - Greg Dyke - lifelong labour supporter
Chairman - can't rememebr the name - labour supporter
New Communications czar announced yesterday - Lord Curry, I think - Labour peer (but he's resigned te whip, so it's ok...)
do I see a pattern emerging?
the last time there was a referendum, it was approximately 27,500 against 44. the people spoke.
>> Edited by yum on Friday 26th July 11:20
quote:
"more proof that the Beeb is now a stronghold of slimy, sycophantic, bliarite socialism"
Chief Exec - Greg Dyke - lifelong labour supporter
Chairman - can't rememebr the name - labour supporter
New Communications czar announced yesterday - Lord Curry, I think - Labour peer (but he's resigned te whip, so it's ok...)
do I see a pattern emerging?
the last time there was a referendum, it was approximately 27,500 against 44. the people spoke.
>> Edited by yum on Friday 26th July 11:20
To be fair, just because it wasn't organised by the government doesn't mean it was either democratic or undemocratic. Unless you know exactly how it was organised, how many were asked the question, how the question was posed and what the question was, it's impossible to say either way. Personally, I don't have those facts at my disposal but if someone else does, please share.
Jeez, why do you guys feel that everything's a conspiracy?
Good God I'm defending Tony, get me my sanity pills.
Our PM has said that there will be a referendum before any changes are accepted. There is as yet no agreed formula or detailed proposal so what does the unofficial referendum mean, apart from an honest display of sentiment not a lot. A NO vote is almost inevitable.
A referendum held in relation to an actual proposal would be more realistic and difficult to ignore. Who knows what will be on offer?
If each Gibraltarian was offered £1M and a passport of their choice I'd expect a yes vote, okay that offer is unlikely but there may be an acceptable offer at the end of what promises to be a long long process.
Had Drake failed and Spain taken control of Plymouth I'd be pretty sure that we would be asking for it to be handed back, that part of the arguement is difficult to deny as is the basic principle that any deal must be acceptable to ALL parties.
Our PM has said that there will be a referendum before any changes are accepted. There is as yet no agreed formula or detailed proposal so what does the unofficial referendum mean, apart from an honest display of sentiment not a lot. A NO vote is almost inevitable.
A referendum held in relation to an actual proposal would be more realistic and difficult to ignore. Who knows what will be on offer?
If each Gibraltarian was offered £1M and a passport of their choice I'd expect a yes vote, okay that offer is unlikely but there may be an acceptable offer at the end of what promises to be a long long process.
Had Drake failed and Spain taken control of Plymouth I'd be pretty sure that we would be asking for it to be handed back, that part of the arguement is difficult to deny as is the basic principle that any deal must be acceptable to ALL parties.
As I understand it from Radio 4 the other day, Britain and Spain are to reach an "understanding" about Gibraltar and joint sovreignty.
They'll then thrash out some detailed plans, and only then will they announce a referendum. The referendum will be to ask the people about the detailed plans.
If the plans are booted out (hmmm, wonder how *that* vote will go), the "understanding" between Spain and the UK remains "on the table".
As I understand it, it's that ever present threat that people are miffed about, and it's that understanding upon which people will be voting.
They'll then thrash out some detailed plans, and only then will they announce a referendum. The referendum will be to ask the people about the detailed plans.
If the plans are booted out (hmmm, wonder how *that* vote will go), the "understanding" between Spain and the UK remains "on the table".
As I understand it, it's that ever present threat that people are miffed about, and it's that understanding upon which people will be voting.
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