Rubber sump gaskets and Loctite 5980

[Chuffmeister]

First of all, for anybody that is considering purchasing a rubber sump gasket off a well know auction site, then save your money. They're utter crap! I've done about 200 miles with this on, before it started to leak. Took the sump off again today, only to find the gasket in this state... Obviously a really poor quality part!



I was considering using Loctite SI5980 to seal the sump as it is available locally. Any opinions? My only concern is getting it on properly without smearing the bead as I,m working on axle stands. Otherwise, I'm tempted to get the fibre gasket that I purchased last time and that I know worked really well.

Cheers
Chuffy

[TheRealFingers99]

The trick to using the instant gasket type materials is to degrease both surfaces (panel wipe or acetone), apply the gloop, tighten up, but not to full torque, let the material cure (overnight if you can), torque up, add oil.

The plus side is that done properly it's incredibly reliable (which is why mainstream manufacturers use it). The downside is that the sump will be an absolute bugger to remove.

[spend]

Chuffmeister said:

First of all, for anybody that is considering purchasing a rubber sump gasket off a well know auction site, then save your money. They're utter crap! I've done about 200 miles with this on, before it started to leak. Took the sump off again today, only to find the gasket in this state... Obviously a really poor quality part!



I was considering using Loctite SI5980 to seal the sump as it is available locally. Any opinions? My only concern is getting it on properly without smearing the bead as I,m working on axle stands. Otherwise, I'm tempted to get the fibre gasket that I purchased last time and that I know worked really well.

Cheers
Chuffy

How tight did you torque the sump up? ~ TBH it should only be a little over finger tight & IMO overtightening is ripe on TVRs in many places

[Sardonicus]

If that was on any other vehicle I would say that's def been over tightened ........... but not using one of this style/brand before then its possibly just a poor material just my cents worth this is why so many manufacturers put in those little ferrule's around the stud/bolts holes to stop this happening I will continue with my good quality cork gaskets and non hard setting compound on the bolts gently nipped never had any issues with this method in over 8 years

Edited by Sardonicus on Monday 11th August 16:36

[carsy]

I put some of this on mine at the start of the year and got poo pood when mentioning it on another sump gasket thread.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/10x5mm-5M-Self-Adhesive-...

All i know is that i am still completely leak drip free.

I will drop the sump in the Winter to check its condition when i change the oil and replace with some new. This will take all of 30mins and i will have another year leak free.

[spend]

carsy said:

I put some of this on mine at the start of the year and got poo pood when mentioning it on another sump gasket thread.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/10x5mm-5M-Self-Adhesive-...

All i know is that i am still completely leak drip free.

I will drop the sump in the Winter to check its condition when i change the oil and replace with some new. This will take all of 30mins and i will have another year leak free.

I only remember commenting on your choice of material not being suitable for oils? ie EPDM instead of nitrile? It is much easier to make a flange seal as long as you seal the threads of the bolts that have open tappings into the block (note which bolt holes got nipped up on the OP's picture )

[Chuffmeister]

How tight do you tighten them then? I originally didn't put them in that tight, but it began to drip, to I nipped it up a little more. It appears to be brittle in places and almost fell apart when I took it off. As for the Loctite, I've picked it up from Halfrauds, but I'm concerned about it falling back I into the sump.

I was going to degrease, clean the mating surfaces with thinners and then apply a bead all around the sump. My plan was to apply a couple of nuts to help hold the sump on and then tighten until it begins to just squeeze out the sides. Then leave it, before re tightening tomorrow? Or perhaps I should just go for the fibre gasket, which is more expensive, but easier?

[Hoofa]

Well I have tried fibre and vw oil pan sealant and still leaks

Yes right torques etc, thread sealant on bolts and still no good

[spend]

Oil sump to cylinder block is only 8ftlbs... Don't get confused with the old SD1 that had a sump closed at the back where you use the spreader plate which was specced differently at 17 ftlbs on the rear bolts...

8ftlbs is nothing BTW only like a strong tweak on a screwdriver!
They are the settings I have for when original gaskets were used, the later sealant only go up to 12-15ftlbs IIRC.

[SILICONEKID345HP]

They all leak just like good old British motorbikes ,keeps the rust away on the lower chassis area

[Pupp]

When did you see a sump on an old Brit bike Daz?

[Chuffmeister]

SILICONEKID345HP said:

They all leak just like good old British motorbikes ,keeps the rust away on the lower chassis area

I had a nice clean rust free chassis... Which is now covered in oil. Almost looks as if it's been blowing out.

[Chuffmeister]

spend said:

Oil sump to cylinder block is only 8ftlbs... Don't get confused with the old SD1 that had a sump closed at the back where you use the spreader plate which was specced differently at 17 ftlbs on the rear bolts...

8ftlbs is nothing BTW only like a strong tweak on a screwdriver!
They are the settings I have for when original gaskets were used, the later sealant only go up to 12-15ftlbs IIRC.

Thanks spend. So if I use a HT silicone, then I need to tighten to about 12-15ftlbs?

[caduceus]

I used Dirko-S when doing mine. Plus that plate at the back on the sump.

[TVR Beaver]

Loctite 5900 is what you want... it won't leak.. but you may have to spend 30 mins to get it off if you need to

[Chuffmeister]

Cheers for that. Not much in it between the 5900 and 5980 for the sump. Found this which some may find useful.

http://www.henkel.com/com/content_data/228756_HE09...

To be fair, the EBay seller has given me a refund.

[Sardonicus]

If your going no sump gasket then I highly recommend Wurth RTV used the stuff for years and IMO its the best non smelly RTV I have used I have a feeling I use this kind of thing a lot more often than many of you on PH I also know the Dirko S is another good product absolute oil free surfaces is the key with RTV and I don't mean just wiped over with an old rag I am talking faces cleaned with Carb/Brake cleaner or similar solvent and a clean cloth before application of your chosen sealer and applied thus

Edited by Sardonicus on Tuesday 12th August 11:24

[Chuffmeister]

Thanks Simon.

How much do you torque down and how?

[Chuffmeister]

Thanks for all your replies. Much appreciated.

Okay, I had the Loctite 5980 so I used it and did the sump this afternoon. Cleaned both mating surfaces thoroughly, removing all debris, old sealants etc with a sponge scourer and a little white spirit. Then cleaned with thinners, then cleaned with brake cleaner. Applied the sealant in a continuous bead and around the bolt holes. Tightened the bolts just enough to flatten the spring washers this time and left the spreader plate off as per Spend's post. All side bolts sealed with blue Loctite to stop them loosening. Front two and back two bolts sealed with the Loctite sump sealant. I'll leave it 24hrs now before refilling with oil.

If that doesn't work, I'm getting somebody else to do it.... after I throw my toys out of the pram!

Edited by Chuffmeister on Tuesday 12th August 19:13

[Chuffmeister]

Jus a quickie, but a purchased one of the Allen key sump plugs recommended by ChimpOnGas. Do I need to seal the threads on it?

The silicone gasket Seems to have set well. Had a peep inside the sump pan with a bore scope to make sure I don't have any issues like Daz had! All seems okay. I applied a bead of about 3mm. The proof of the pudding though!