Will there ever...

[Jimmyarm]

Be a replacement for the nut & bolt, stud & nut, bolt & threaded hole etc etc.

I work as a spanner monkey and I was undoing some beautifully accessible nuts holding a turbo onto a Pug 807 manifold earlier and it got me thinking.

Will there ever be a replacement for the threaded fixing, they are pretty much everywhere you look in one form or another.

Some sort of repeatable, reverse-able weld perhaps ?

[vx220]

...a boy that swims faster than a shark?

[FredClogs]

Rivets. They're the future...

Oh wait a minute...

[SteveSteveson]

Gaffer tape.

[Tunku]

Magnets, really strong electromagnets, just don't let the battery go flat.

[ezi]

[Snowboy]

From an engineering perspective there are better options already.
From a cost prspective - nuts and bolts will be around for a long time to come.

[Rawwr]

vx220 said:

...a boy that swims faster than a shark?

Hah, that's exactly what I thought when I saw the thread title

[Another Fluffer]

Snowboy said:

From an engineering perspective there are better options already.
From a cost prspective - nuts and bolts will be around for a long time to come.

Intrigued... better options?

[FredClogs]

Another Fluffer said:

Snowboy said:

From an engineering perspective there are better options already.
From a cost prspective - nuts and bolts will be around for a long time to come.

Intrigued... better options?

There isn't a better option I can think of, Nyloc nuts are a step forward but don't under estimate the cost and engineering that goes into making nuts and bolts, it's only the quantities which make them seem cheap.

[RB Will]

Would the push fit stuff used in plumbing be adaptable?

[Krikkit]

Eventually there will probably be some kind of fancy carbon nanotube-reinforced polymer which you can knit together seamlessly with the wave of a tool... But for now we'll have to make do with the humble nut and bolt! I only wish they'd do away with stupid Torx on bolts that are weather-facing.

[The Vambo]

How strong are stainless steel cable ties?

[colonel c]

[FredClogs]

colonel c said:

Velcro - what a rip off...

- Tim Vine.

[MysteryLemon]

I have no issues with nuts and bolts. My issue is car manufacturers using so many fking different types, often on the same component...

I changed the wishbone on my car the other night. of the 4 bolts actually holding it to the chassis, 3 were 15mm, the other 14mm. Then the ball join securing pin was 17mm, the shock absorber bottom bolts were 19mm, the top bolts 15mm, the ARB drop pin securing bolt was 17mm, the actual drop pin bush bolt was 15mm.

I recently did the brake pads and disks too. The calipers had combinations of hex bolts, torx bolts and ribe bolts, all in differing sizes.

Don't get me started on when I did the head gasket in another car

Just stick to one fking type and minimise the different sizes needed. Also, FIAT, if you need to drop the engine out of the car to change the cambelt because there is about 2mm if clearence, you designed it wrong...

[AyBee]

Rawwr said:

vx220 said:

...a boy that swims faster than a shark?

Hah, that's exactly what I thought when I saw the thread title

And me

[Captain Muppet]

MysteryLemon said:

I have no issues with nuts and bolts. My issue is car manufacturers using so many fking different types, often on the same component...

I changed the wishbone on my car the other night. of the 4 bolts actually holding it to the chassis, 3 were 15mm, the other 14mm. Then the ball join securing pin was 17mm, the shock absorber bottom bolts were 19mm, the top bolts 15mm, the ARB drop pin securing bolt was 17mm, the actual drop pin bush bolt was 15mm.

I recently did the brake pads and disks too. The calipers had combinations of hex bolts, torx bolts and ribe bolts, all in differing sizes.

Don't get me started on when I did the head gasket in another car

Just stick to one fking type and minimise the different sizes needed. Also, FIAT, if you need to drop the engine out of the car to change the cambelt because there is about 2mm if clearence, you designed it wrong...

You have obviously never tried to get an OEM's purchasing department to buy a small hex M8x45 hex flange bolt, rather than the standard hex M8x45 hex flange bolt they have been using for the last 40 years. Ignoring the organisational inertia you still have to add all the cost and greif of another component to track, store, order, fit, not mix up with the other one that works just fine everywhere else and updating all the documentation that goes with every step, all so a chap you'll never meet doesn't have to pop another socket on his wrench.

There are several perfectly good, sound, logical reasons to have different heads on different sized bolts, and even different head types on the same sized bolts. Every engineering system is a balance of compromises, even something as simple as a bolt.

If a Fiat needs the engine dropping to change the cam belt then it hasn't been designed wrong, it's just been designed with manufacturing cost as a higher priority than ease of servicing. If your priority is ease of servicing then you bought your car wrong.

[MysteryLemon]

Captain Muppet said:

You have obviously never tried to get an OEM's purchasing department to buy a small hex M8x45 hex flange bolt, rather than the standard hex M8x45 hex flange bolt they have been using for the last 40 years. Ignoring the organisational inertia you still have to add all the cost and greif of another component to track, store, order, fit, not mix up with the other one that works just fine everywhere else and updating all the documentation that goes with every step, all so a chap you'll never meet doesn't have to pop another socket on his wrench.

There are several perfectly good, sound, logical reasons to have different heads on different sized bolts, and even different head types on the same sized bolts. Every engineering system is a balance of compromises, even something as simple as a bolt.

If a Fiat needs the engine dropping to change the cam belt then it hasn't been designed wrong, it's just been designed with manufacturing cost as a higher priority than ease of servicing. If your priority is ease of servicing then you bought your car wrong.

Surely it costs more to use multiple different bolt sides and heads than it does to try and stick to the same size/type unless absolutely necessary?

As far as the cambelt point goes, when the manufacturers dealer network is reluctant to take on a job because it's such a ball ache (even when they can charge £800+VAT to do it), I think someone, somewhere could have done a better job at designing it.

[Captain Muppet]

MysteryLemon said:

Captain Muppet said:

You have obviously never tried to get an OEM's purchasing department to buy a small hex M8x45 hex flange bolt, rather than the standard hex M8x45 hex flange bolt they have been using for the last 40 years. Ignoring the organisational inertia you still have to add all the cost and greif of another component to track, store, order, fit, not mix up with the other one that works just fine everywhere else and updating all the documentation that goes with every step, all so a chap you'll never meet doesn't have to pop another socket on his wrench.

There are several perfectly good, sound, logical reasons to have different heads on different sized bolts, and even different head types on the same sized bolts. Every engineering system is a balance of compromises, even something as simple as a bolt.

If a Fiat needs the engine dropping to change the cam belt then it hasn't been designed wrong, it's just been designed with manufacturing cost as a higher priority than ease of servicing. If your priority is ease of servicing then you bought your car wrong.

Surely it costs more to use multiple different bolt sides and heads than it does to try and stick to the same size/type unless absolutely necessary?

As far as the cambelt point goes, when the manufacturers dealer network is reluctant to take on a job because it's such a ball ache (even when they can charge £800+VAT to do it), I think someone, somewhere could have done a better job at designing it.

You would be amazed at how often it is necessary. Plus most fastener standards will give you several hundred off-the-shelf options to play with. Using an M8 where an M6 would do could cost the OEM tens of thousands of pounds a year, and for no benefit to the manufacturer.

It's not that they couldn't do a better job, it's that the job they were doing is not the one you think they should have been doing. I bet 99.8% of the people who bought them new quite liked that it wasn't more expensive to buy.