If Scottish Vote Yes, What next for Rosyth & Carrier Builds?

[Lincsblokey]

Just struck me, yes we know Salmond says no trident in an independent Scotland.

But also, what about Rosyth, the decommed subs, surface vessels, QE carrier builds etc?

Not only would they make a security hole for the scots, but also surely a HUGE jobs loss?

[Lost soul]

fk em close it all down and move it south

[grumbledoak]

We'll have it, gladly.

I think the Scottish people should seriously consider their future usefulness to NATO if they go all hippy on us. Still, I'm sure Salmon has it all under control.

(not really ).

[aeropilot]

Subs would all move down to Devonport - would cost 'us' a fortune, but a lot of the infrastructure is already there.

Carrier's would be finished as per contract at Rosyth.....they might be the last ever ships built for the RN in Scotland though if the jocks vote yes next week.

[wijit]

Government (UK) word is that ALL work on Royal navy vessels will stop. Scotland would be a foreign country in their eyes and the policy is to not use foreign companies for Navy work. That very question was raised on a debate recently.

[Godalmighty83]

If it comes down to it then construction of the new OPV's *may* continue in Scotland but it is far more likely that everything will move south, this would be a massively expensive endeavour for England but it would be a one off cost and decent internal investment as England hasn't had any functioning large dock's for far too long. Such a move could be with 10,000 jobs to the south coast.

Salmond in the meantime will be having fun trying to support whole communities who were once dependant on the Royal Navy.

If the Scots want to hang themselves let them, many will happily take those jobs here.

[creampuff]

Godalmighty83 said:

England hasn't had any functioning large dock's for far too long.

Don't forget BAE (formerly Vickers) building nuclear submarines in Barrow-in-Furness.

[jamieduff1981]

Godalmighty83 said:

If it comes down to it then construction of the new OPV's *may* continue in Scotland but it is far more likely that everything will move south, this would be a massively expensive endeavour for England but it would be a one off cost and decent internal investment as England hasn't had any functioning large dock's for far too long. Such a move could be with 10,000 jobs to the south coast.

Salmond in the meantime will be having fun trying to support whole communities who were once dependant on the Royal Navy.

If the Scots want to hang themselves let them, many will happily take those jobs here.

I agree with all of that, but implore you to keep in mind that "the Scots" are firmly divided on the subject of hanging themselves. I for one am very proud of my British nationality and am a staunch unionist.

[Godalmighty83]

jamieduff1981 said:

I agree with all of that, but implore you to keep in mind that "the Scots" are firmly divided on the subject of hanging themselves. I for one am very proud of my British nationality and am a staunch unionist.

My apologise, I didn't intend to tar all with the same brush.

[Piersman2]

I'm fairly confident these ship building contracts were only ever assigned to Scotland because of the scarcity of oher work in these areas and were fiercely fought over with several sites in the rUK.

Those sites will be more than happy to take on the work.

With regards to the ships in progress, I would expect they will be completed to basic shell , and then moved south for completion and fit out of technology,

[jamieduff1981]

Godalmighty83 said:

jamieduff1981 said:

I agree with all of that, but implore you to keep in mind that "the Scots" are firmly divided on the subject of hanging themselves. I for one am very proud of my British nationality and am a staunch unionist.

My apologise, I didn't intend to tar all with the same brush.

No apologies necessary my friend. I'm just trying to distance myself from these nationalist lunatics idealogically. Many of them suggest that the half of the population who were actually happy with their environment should relocate to England since we're all traitors anyway. I'd argue that it's they who should have left long ago if they didn't like it.

Sadly I fear that everything written above will be correct. I can see no inventive for the rUK to give tax payer funded military contracts to a foreign country. It (and the withdrawal of Trident) will decimate the local areas. It doesn't appear to directly affect the average Yes voter personally therefore any such negative impact on other people is a price deemed worth paying by these feckless wasters.

[aeropilot]

Piersman2 said:

I'm fairly confident these ship building contracts were only ever assigned to Scotland because of the scarcity of oher work in these areas and were fiercely fought over with several sites in the rUK.

Anything to do with the proximity of Gordon Browns consitituency to Rosyth.


Of course not.

[Fittster]

wijit said:

Government (UK) word is that ALL work on Royal navy vessels will stop. Scotland would be a foreign country in their eyes and the policy is to not use foreign companies for Navy work.

So there's no involvement from Thales in the new carriers?

[davepoth]

Fittster said:

wijit said:

Government (UK) word is that ALL work on Royal navy vessels will stop. Scotland would be a foreign country in their eyes and the policy is to not use foreign companies for Navy work.

So there's no involvement from Thales in the new carriers?

But the boats are being built in the UK, even if it is by the French. That's the difference.

[andy97]

aeropilot said:

Piersman2 said:

I'm fairly confident these ship building contracts were only ever assigned to Scotland because of the scarcity of oher work in these areas and were fiercely fought over with several sites in the rUK.

Anything to do with the proximity of Gordon Browns consitituency to Rosyth.


Of course not.

Of course not. The fact is that Rosyth is the only existing place in Britain that the Carriers could have been assembled due to their size and draft.

More to the point it is the only place where they can be docked in the future for re fits and maintenance periods. What happens then? May have to dock the Carriers abroad and I don't mean at Rosyth as there probably won't be enough work for Babcock to keep it open on the basis of a potential Carrier docking every 5(?) years or so.

[andy97]

davepoth said:

But the boats are being built in the UK, even if it is by the French. That's the difference.

The Carriers are being built by the "Aircraft Carrier Alliance", an Alliance of BAe, Babcock and Thales UK.

[spitfire-ian]

I caught a brief bit on the radio last night (wasn't really listening too intently so I may have got it slightly wrong) which said that if there is a "Yes" vote, there is then a negotiation period of a few years before anything really changes so it's not a case of downing tools the morning after if the vote goes that way.

[jamieduff1981]

spitfire-ian said:

I caught a brief bit on the radio last night (wasn't really listening too intently so I may have got it slightly wrong) which said that if there is a "Yes" vote, there is then a negotiation period of a few years before anything really changes so it's not a case of downing tools the morning after if the vote goes that way.

18 months. 18 months to achieve the mammoth task of convincing lots of 3rd parties to agree to act in Scotland's best interests rather than their own, and with no actual plan or clear vision to work towards. The Yes group still dance around the White Paper "Scotland's Future" but even most Yes voters admit that it is simply an uncosted fantasy and argue that Scotland has opportunities not problems which can all be resolved later. There are many conflicting visions for Scotland within the Yes camp and it's not practical to think that there can be broad agreement by the electorate on what to work towards within that timescale*, let alone actually implement it.

• Not least because around half the population do not want separation in the first place.

[anonymous-user]

And what about the 3 new OPVs that BAE won a Contract for in the summer? I assume they would no longer be built on the Clyde as planned but move to Barrow?

To be honest, given the new Tide class (I know they are RFA but to most people they are big and grey and belong to the RN) are being built in South Korea, its not inconceivable that a new class of warship would be built away from UK shores. The Scots will obviously feel that they would be the recipients of such contracts but EU law would have to be pursued and, by and large, the cheapest, compliant, bid would win and there is no way a Scottish bid would be the cheapest.

[andy97]

pablo said:

To be honest, given the new Tide class (I know they are RFA but to most people they are big and grey and belong to the RN) are being built in South Korea, its not inconceivable that a new class of warship would be built away from UK shores. The Scots will obviously feel that they would be the recipients of such contracts but EU law would have to be pursued and, by and large, the cheapest, compliant, bid would win and there is no way a Scottish bid would be the cheapest.

The Tide class ships are being built in S Korea but any equipment of a military nature to enable it conduct it's role (comms, RAS rig, self protection weapons and decoys etc) are to be fitted in a UK yard.