It's how heavy ?!?
Discussion
OK, planning a few trips to see tigers etc and obviously going to take some pic's. I look in the camera bag and the 100-400IS is me weapon...so I'm thinking I need a bit more reach. Choices, choices.
I've had my eye on a 400IS F2.8 for some time now (yes yes, it's costly but hey, happy Christmas to me eh?). Fly in ointment is it's 5.3KG. I can easily hand hold the 100-400 but that's only 1.3KG.
So the questions are :-
What can you handhold for more than 30 blood vessel busting seconds? (stop sniggering at the back there)
Is F2.8 really needed for wildlife (but I'm thinking of using 1.4x or 2x converters remember)?
Any other other lense suggestions?
Some notes:-
- I've played with Sigma's 50-500. Big, slow. Good for the money maybe but that isn't the issue.
- I'm not 100% sure about DO lenses but I could be convinced due to the weight savings.
- I'll need to use it handheld...
- Oh and I do know what 500mm is like to handhold (I've got a 500mm F5 telescope), but when I concentrate I'm quite still (and IS will hopefully help).
Thanks
Phil
I've had my eye on a 400IS F2.8 for some time now (yes yes, it's costly but hey, happy Christmas to me eh?). Fly in ointment is it's 5.3KG. I can easily hand hold the 100-400 but that's only 1.3KG.
So the questions are :-
What can you handhold for more than 30 blood vessel busting seconds? (stop sniggering at the back there)
Is F2.8 really needed for wildlife (but I'm thinking of using 1.4x or 2x converters remember)?
Any other other lense suggestions?
Some notes:-
- I've played with Sigma's 50-500. Big, slow. Good for the money maybe but that isn't the issue.
- I'm not 100% sure about DO lenses but I could be convinced due to the weight savings.
- I'll need to use it handheld...
- Oh and I do know what 500mm is like to handhold (I've got a 500mm F5 telescope), but when I concentrate I'm quite still (and IS will hopefully help).
Thanks
Phil
LongQ said:
Monopod?
And of course the weighty payment for the excess baggage for the lens!
Yeah monopods. Can't say I'm a big fan. If I take anything away with my it's a tripod so I can do some long exposure stuff. right I warned you, next one to giggle at the back gets lines
You can always use tripods as monopod's with their legs tied together anyway.
As for weight, well I tend to take this things on as hand luggage. As long as they don't see the veins sticking out on your arms as you walk to check-in, you get away with it.
ThatPhilBrettGuy said:
OK, planning a few trips to see tigers etc and obviously going to take some pic's. I look in the camera bag and the 100-400IS is me weapon...so I'm thinking I need a bit more reach. Choices, choices.
I've had my eye on a 400IS F2.8 for some time now (yes yes, it's costly but hey, happy Christmas to me eh?). Fly in ointment is it's 5.3KG. I can easily hand hold the 100-400 but that's only 1.3KG.
So the questions are :-
What can you handhold for more than 30 blood vessel busting seconds? (stop sniggering at the back there)
Is F2.8 really needed for wildlife (but I'm thinking of using 1.4x or 2x converters remember)?
Any other other lense suggestions?
Some notes:-
- I've played with Sigma's 50-500. Big, slow. Good for the money maybe but that isn't the issue.
- I'm not 100% sure about DO lenses but I could be convinced due to the weight savings.
- I'll need to use it handheld...
- Oh and I do know what 500mm is like to handhold (I've got a 500mm F5 telescope), but when I concentrate I'm quite still (and IS will hopefully help).
Thanks
Phil
400mm DO?
If you want to use a 2 x converter, then you ideally need an f2.8 lens.
You don't want to go over f5.6, as you lose autofocus and shutter speeds start to get too slow, so with the 1.4x converter losing 1 stop of light, you can fit this to an f4 lens with no problems, but the 2x converter which loses 2 stops will ideally need to be fitted to an f2.8 lens.
There's a review of the 400mm f4 here and also an article about the 500/600mm lens here
I use my 300mm f2.8 handheld with 2x converter, and it's OK for short periods, but I do start to struggle with it after a while. It's also a pain to carry around (literally!), and this one is only 2.5kg in weight! I think you'll probably need to look at monopods to be honest, or a few months beefing up down the gym first
In my opinion, the ideal combination is the 300 f2.8, 500 f4 and the 1.4x and 2x converters. This gives you 300mm, 420mm (300x1.4), 500mm, 600mm (300x2) and 700mm (500x1.4) for the cost of just two lenses.
You don't want to go over f5.6, as you lose autofocus and shutter speeds start to get too slow, so with the 1.4x converter losing 1 stop of light, you can fit this to an f4 lens with no problems, but the 2x converter which loses 2 stops will ideally need to be fitted to an f2.8 lens.
There's a review of the 400mm f4 here and also an article about the 500/600mm lens here
I use my 300mm f2.8 handheld with 2x converter, and it's OK for short periods, but I do start to struggle with it after a while. It's also a pain to carry around (literally!), and this one is only 2.5kg in weight! I think you'll probably need to look at monopods to be honest, or a few months beefing up down the gym first
In my opinion, the ideal combination is the 300 f2.8, 500 f4 and the 1.4x and 2x converters. This gives you 300mm, 420mm (300x1.4), 500mm, 600mm (300x2) and 700mm (500x1.4) for the cost of just two lenses.
material. 
V6GTO said:
I usually hand hold my 100-400 IS but do use a Manfrotto monopod whe the light drops.
Can't you do any research to find out how close your'e likely to get to the tigers? Will you be on elephant back or in a hide/lodge?
Martin.
Most probably on an elephant hence the hand held bit. Monopod on an elephant. Can you imagine!
I've just got back from 5 hours of Lakeside shopping, so at the moment all I want to do is hang myself....or go shooting... Ah, Christmas. Wake me up when it's over
I've never seen any of the wildlife pros hand holding this kind of beast. To be honest 5.3kg you're really going to struggle.
If you're on the back of an elephant, how do you sit on it? Not a daft question I hope..stay with me and you'll see what I'm on about.
If you're just sitting on a rug across the elephant's back then you're in true hand held territory, but if what if they get you to sit in a kind of frame to stop you falling off you may be able to rest the barrel of the lens on the frame itself using a small bean bag as cushioning. May be a solution.
The other thing is how close will you get? This could help you determine if you really need the reach of a 400mm. Maybe a fast 200mm will be sufficient.
Chris
If you're on the back of an elephant, how do you sit on it? Not a daft question I hope..stay with me and you'll see what I'm on about.
If you're just sitting on a rug across the elephant's back then you're in true hand held territory, but if what if they get you to sit in a kind of frame to stop you falling off you may be able to rest the barrel of the lens on the frame itself using a small bean bag as cushioning. May be a solution.
The other thing is how close will you get? This could help you determine if you really need the reach of a 400mm. Maybe a fast 200mm will be sufficient.
Chris
ThatPhilBrettGuy said:
400mm DO?
Like I said, I'd need convincing DO works OK.
Fair point. Apparently the recent 400mm DOs are much better than the early ones. I think general consensus is it's not as sharp as a 300mm 2.8 or 400mm 2.8 (is anything?), but much better than a 100-400 at 400mm.
I've been using a 75-300 DO for a couple of months, and I'm very impressed. It's not quite as sharp as my 100-400 (which seems to be a good example), but is so much more convenient. I'm getting shots I wouldn't/couldn't have got with the 100-400 due to having to use a monopod with it, and the fact it's not a carry round lens.
Only thing I have noticed is that the bokeh isn't as nice with my DO as my standard lenses.
CVP said:
If you're just sitting on a rug across the elephant's back then you're in true hand held territory...
That is the most likely, but I see your point about those frames...
CVP said:
The other thing is how close will you get? This could help you determine if you really need the reach of a 400mm. Maybe a fast 200mm will be sufficient.
Another good point. I have an idea it's not going to be very close.
srider said:
...have got with the 100-400 due to having to use a monopod with it, and the fact it's not a carry round lens.
I do use the 100-400IS as a carry round. It's not light but I don't find it an issue.
I think I've gone off the 400IS F2.8 now. After some playing with some weights to simulate it's 5.3Kg's I can safely say it'd be quite a job holding it all day. The 300IS F2.8 maybe a better bet however....
ThatPhilBrettGuy said:
I think I've gone off the 400IS F2.8 now. After some playing with some weights to simulate it's 5.3Kg's I can safely say it'd be quite a job holding it all day. The 300IS F2.8 maybe a better bet however....
This could be a great solution. I've just treated myself to a second hand 300mm f2.8 AFS plus the lovely new 1.7* converter. I can hand hold this (just) and it gives terriffic reach.
I'm still not looking forward to carrying it round all day and even then I'll be using monopod/tripod most of the time, but in an emergency you could definitely hand hold this type of combo and still get good AF performance.
HTH
Chris
Chris
V6GTO said:
Another thing, as I have found since moving to Spain, there will be a lot more light over there and it almost makes camera shake a thing of the past (unless shooting at dawn/dusk) so you can bang off shots quickly, thus spend less time having to hold the lens to your eye.
Martin.
If you go on about Spain much more you'll regret it....
...because I'll move there, end up being your neighbor and we'll end up spending all our money on petrol and tyres roaring up and down the mountains
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