Why no Up! s with City Emergency Brake?
Discussion
So..I'm starting to look at a "learnermobile" for my eldest daughter, and because I am "blessed" with several children, one option in the mix is to buy a new car and make it last the cycle.
VW do a £225 option called City Emergency Brake - a lidar based system that stops the car (provided you are doing less than 18mph) if you don't yourself.
Youtube tells me it works. I know its not a "life-saver" (ie rear ending another car at 18mph or less) , but at £225 if it saves you from just one phone call (at 17 or 18) to your insurance company over our planned 6yr tenure, then its massive win, protecting the NCB.
VW appear to think its a cool idea - it warrants 2No 1/3 page references in a 20page brochure. And I believe in Australia its a standard feature.
I cant find anywhere that says it can be retrofitted. (though I bet it probably can, as gut feel its an extra windscreen sensor that plugs into the existing ABS controller, though probably needs computer time to switch it on) But dealers say it cant be.
Anyway basically the gag is "You want City Emergency Brake? Certainly sir, your car will be 3months special build from the factory. You don't want City Emergency brake? OK, no probs, you can collect on Friday"
And if you trawl ebay, Autotrader and here - cant find any/many with it fitted at all.
(Now in our case, 3months is no biggy, our need isn't until Feb, but obviously it means I'd have to pass up any pre-reg bargains, or nearly news, or dealer offers, so in our case, its a much more - probably- than £225 option in terms of total cost)
But fundamentally, its a £225 option, that appears to make a lot of sense, how come I can find more cars with the £770 blingy alloys than Emergency brake?
VW do a £225 option called City Emergency Brake - a lidar based system that stops the car (provided you are doing less than 18mph) if you don't yourself.
Youtube tells me it works. I know its not a "life-saver" (ie rear ending another car at 18mph or less) , but at £225 if it saves you from just one phone call (at 17 or 18) to your insurance company over our planned 6yr tenure, then its massive win, protecting the NCB.
VW appear to think its a cool idea - it warrants 2No 1/3 page references in a 20page brochure. And I believe in Australia its a standard feature.
I cant find anywhere that says it can be retrofitted. (though I bet it probably can, as gut feel its an extra windscreen sensor that plugs into the existing ABS controller, though probably needs computer time to switch it on) But dealers say it cant be.
Anyway basically the gag is "You want City Emergency Brake? Certainly sir, your car will be 3months special build from the factory. You don't want City Emergency brake? OK, no probs, you can collect on Friday"
And if you trawl ebay, Autotrader and here - cant find any/many with it fitted at all.
(Now in our case, 3months is no biggy, our need isn't until Feb, but obviously it means I'd have to pass up any pre-reg bargains, or nearly news, or dealer offers, so in our case, its a much more - probably- than £225 option in terms of total cost)
But fundamentally, its a £225 option, that appears to make a lot of sense, how come I can find more cars with the £770 blingy alloys than Emergency brake?
I believe Run DMC did a musical discourse pertaining to this very subject (perhaps not the difficulty in finding a car with emergency auto braking, maybe they were looking for a car with spinners as standard?) in 'It's Like That (and that's the way it is)'.
Anyhow, are there not other available similar cars at similar prices with the kit as standard? I don't know so that's a genuine question. I'm thinking the new C1, Aygo, Fabia, mazda2, etc.
Anyhow, are there not other available similar cars at similar prices with the kit as standard? I don't know so that's a genuine question. I'm thinking the new C1, Aygo, Fabia, mazda2, etc.
There are a few other cars that have it too (same Conti system) bear in mind the Golf uses a radar system which imho is not as good. Fiesta has it, new Mazda3 will have it when its out next year, is it an option on the Seat Mii or Skoda versions of the same car?? (ETA It is available on the Citygo)
Look for top spec ex optioned up demo's with it would be my suggestion
Look for top spec ex optioned up demo's with it would be my suggestion
Just a thought... Perhaps if you do get this fancy-Dan braking system, don't tell the nippers. The last thing a child needs is carte blanche to bugger about while in traffic because "the car will take care of it". I'm sure your offspring are delightful (sounds sarcastic, isn't), but people, generally, will make full use of any latitude offered (why wouldn't we, that's why we strive for better technology. No one shuns the remote control in favour of changing channel manually).
Simon.
Simon.
NAS said:
Retro-fitting it is not as easy as you might think. It requires a radar in the front bumper, some crazy amount of calibration and updating all kinds of electronics in the car.
Dont think its in the bumper, but yeah, I've got to assume it cant be retrofitted. ModernAndy said:
Anyhow, are there not other available similar cars at similar prices with the kit as standard? I don't know so that's a genuine question. I'm thinking the new C1, Aygo, Fabia, mazda2, etc.
Yesterday was day1 of looking/researching. Visited 5dealers to look at 3cars. Up!, Fiesta & Yaris. All are 5* NCAP rated, but also we have local dealers for each. C1/Aygo are 4*. Nearest Skoda, Mazda & Seat (for Mii) dealers are some miles away, potential issue with dealer support long term etc.? Yaris was sort of rejected for being "uninspiring" (though am sure its incredibly competent but also they have really short lead times and we are in no rush) , but an Up! , in my opinion, is quite cool - and I <think> it'd get better looked after as a result (or worst case, I wouldn't mind it, if I had to confiscate it)
Fiesta I believe can have a similar system - and so it remains in the frame for that and other reasons, though it might fall out of the mix when I start doing dummy insurance quotes. (Up! is grp 1/2 , Fiesta 5+)
But overall, I remain staggered that something "safety related" and quite cheap, is so unpopular. And so, if the kids work their premiums down to something sensible, if it prevents one nudge that's win for the sake of £225.
Until every car on the road is fitted with such a device it's value is very limited.
It will not stop other vehicles smashing head on into your daughters car.
It may be useful in stopping her car while she is too busy texting/facebook on the phone or looking in her handbag,
doing make up etc and not noticing the traffic in front of her has stopped.
It will not stop other vehicles smashing head on into your daughters car.
It may be useful in stopping her car while she is too busy texting/facebook on the phone or looking in her handbag,
doing make up etc and not noticing the traffic in front of her has stopped.
Edited by lbc on Sunday 28th September 11:02
lbc said:
It will be useful in stopping her car while she is too busy texting/facebook on the phone or looking in her handbag,
doing make up etc and not noticing the traffic in front of her has stopped.
Good point, and in a similar vein, all 3 kids are permanently on their phones - so one of the reasons the Up! is in the frame is their "Maps & More" built in (but removable) phone, SatNav,music via Bluetooth thing. And (a bit) like the braking, am not really speccing it for their convenience or enjoyment, to me, is all about "I have provided a phone/music solution pre-installed in the car, if I see/hear/get told that you ever touch your handset in car, I'm having the keys - permanently, youre banned!" doing make up etc and not noticing the traffic in front of her has stopped.
But as for safety, - I can see it being very beneficial, to us, but also significantly to others. Yeah, it wont stop everything, and maybe I've not reinforced the safety benefits above. But, for example, and I know this is rare, but I've just been to drop her at the railway station, and had a "near miss" myself. Was car 2 at T-junction, estate road onto main road. Large multi-car gap appeared (ie road empty though still possibility of reckless speeders arriving, plus <1mile from Police and Fire Stations who could be traveling faster), we both set off, I remained looking L & R - and car 1 stalled half way across the junction - now, it was no big deal, I was looking forwards between each L & R plus I heard his engine cough, so stopped well short - but then I have 30yrs experience..
What about telling your kids to pay full attention when driving so they don't need these sorts of things. If there was a metal spike in the steering wheel instead of an air bag im sure they will pay more attention that way.
So many youngsters I see playing on there phones many a times ive had too take avoiding action against these morons texting or facebooking there mates, if you cant drive without your phone shouldn't be allowed on the road.
And no im not some 50 year old boring fart that not with the times im 22 have seen what can happen so many times in the last 5 years of driving.
So many youngsters I see playing on there phones many a times ive had too take avoiding action against these morons texting or facebooking there mates, if you cant drive without your phone shouldn't be allowed on the road.
And no im not some 50 year old boring fart that not with the times im 22 have seen what can happen so many times in the last 5 years of driving.
Baryonyx said:
Tell your child she can either look where she is going, or stay off the bloody road.
Ah yes, because that always works 
Don't see any harm in having a feature which could prevent an accident regardless of whether they're great drivers or not. I bet everyone reading this has, at some point in their lives, had a near miss when someone has stopped in front of them and they haven't been expecting it.
Geekman said:
Ah yes, because that always works
Don't see any harm in having a feature which could prevent an accident regardless of whether they're great drivers or not. I bet everyone reading this has, at some point in their lives, had a near miss when someone has stopped in front of them and they haven't been expecting it.
And you learn from those near (or not so near) misses. If the car stops for you you will always just go 'its OK the car stops for you'Don't see any harm in having a feature which could prevent an accident regardless of whether they're great drivers or not. I bet everyone reading this has, at some point in their lives, had a near miss when someone has stopped in front of them and they haven't been expecting it.
This sort of feature is part of the reason why driving standards are now so low because in the back of their mind, the driver will be thinking that the car will sort out any problem for you.
Don't get too hung up on NCAP, new model cars may have a lower NCAP rating than older designs however the testing is alot more stringent now; a 5 star NCAP car from a couple of years ago may now only achieve 3-4 stars now whereas a 4 star now would have most likely acheived 5 stars a few years ago.
NCAP also hammer manufacturers for frankly ridiculous things such as not having a chime or readout for whether rear seat belts are fastened now and, in the case of the Megane it is hammered as the digital readout for rear seat belt fastening status is not in all relevant languages, when it was launched in 2008 it was a 5 star car, the facelift is now a 3 star car.
Don't get too hung up on NCAP, new model cars may have a lower NCAP rating than older designs however the testing is alot more stringent now; a 5 star NCAP car from a couple of years ago may now only achieve 3-4 stars now whereas a 4 star now would have most likely acheived 5 stars a few years ago.
NCAP also hammer manufacturers for frankly ridiculous things such as not having a chime or readout for whether rear seat belts are fastened now and, in the case of the Megane it is hammered as the digital readout for rear seat belt fastening status is not in all relevant languages, when it was launched in 2008 it was a 5 star car, the facelift is now a 3 star car.
really like the idea of this system, and despite having nearly 20 years of driving experience and north a million miles under my belt id quite happily have it as an option especially if that's all it costs.
very surprised that most people who buy these don't spec it if its only £225 seems a piffling amount when taken in context of a new car that costs anywhere between 8 and 13 grand
very surprised that most people who buy these don't spec it if its only £225 seems a piffling amount when taken in context of a new car that costs anywhere between 8 and 13 grand
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