Discussion
Hi All, Merry Christmas to you.
While I'm sat here wondering if 2005 will see with achieve a lifetime wish of owning a Ferrari, I'm pondering the price of the Enzo.
I got a scale model of this wonderful car as a Christmas present and so pooring over its detail has been a great experience. Looking at at scale it does actually seem perfectly proportioned and a real leap in supercar design.
However, why do they cost so bloody much?! I doubt the bodywork, wheels, engine etc would cost anymore than any other v12 Ferrari, yet this one costs three times more than a Scag. How can this be? Is this price simply a prestige price-tag, in that this is Ferrari's latest work of art and simply demands that kind of price to keep it hyper exclusive?
What confuses me is they were hugely expensive at launch, unlike the relatively affordable F40 and then F50's which were inflated by greedy collectors.
As much as I love the Enzo it would seem to be a dream car even for the relatively wealthy! Lots of people now are millionaires or have decent chunks of disposable cash so that a 360 or equivalent isnt a dream buy, but even people with that kind of money must only be able to dream about an Enzo.
What a beatiful car it is, I think made even more desirable by the fact 95% of people could never get close to it.
While I'm sat here wondering if 2005 will see with achieve a lifetime wish of owning a Ferrari, I'm pondering the price of the Enzo.
I got a scale model of this wonderful car as a Christmas present and so pooring over its detail has been a great experience. Looking at at scale it does actually seem perfectly proportioned and a real leap in supercar design.
However, why do they cost so bloody much?! I doubt the bodywork, wheels, engine etc would cost anymore than any other v12 Ferrari, yet this one costs three times more than a Scag. How can this be? Is this price simply a prestige price-tag, in that this is Ferrari's latest work of art and simply demands that kind of price to keep it hyper exclusive?
What confuses me is they were hugely expensive at launch, unlike the relatively affordable F40 and then F50's which were inflated by greedy collectors.
As much as I love the Enzo it would seem to be a dream car even for the relatively wealthy! Lots of people now are millionaires or have decent chunks of disposable cash so that a 360 or equivalent isnt a dream buy, but even people with that kind of money must only be able to dream about an Enzo.
What a beatiful car it is, I think made even more desirable by the fact 95% of people could never get close to it.
they all cost. Designing and producing 400 examples of an engine with 100+ bhp/litre is never going to be terrifically economical. Neither is building it entirely out of a material (ie carbon composite) that has to layed up by hand.
OTOH, Ferrari know that people are prepared to pay tens of thousands of pounds effectively just for the little geegee on the nose.
OTOH, Ferrari know that people are prepared to pay tens of thousands of pounds effectively just for the little geegee on the nose.
I remember one of Flemke's comments, which was something along the lines of...
"i don't mind paying £600k for the Macca... as it cost more than that to actually make... so i'm getting value for money".
Somehow i don't see the Enzo as a loss-maker for Ferrari so it would be interesting to find out how much it actually costs Ferrari to make one Enzo.
Still love the thing though. Great car!
"i don't mind paying £600k for the Macca... as it cost more than that to actually make... so i'm getting value for money".
Somehow i don't see the Enzo as a loss-maker for Ferrari so it would be interesting to find out how much it actually costs Ferrari to make one Enzo.
Still love the thing though. Great car!
I remmeber reading that Ferrari were making a fairly hefty profit with the Enzo. Something in the region of £150,000. The price of the Enzo was most probably based on what the market would support not on the price it cost to build.
Comparing it to the Mclaren F1 price is not entirely justified. Mclaren had never built a road car before so they probably wasted vast amounts of money down deadends in the developement of that car. They then could only amortise these costs over less than 100 vehicles.
Ferrari on the otherhand had orders before they had even developed the car, a set budget and years of experiance producing the F50/F40 etc. There is very little on the Enzo that doesn't share some design heritage with other Ferrari products, and certain things from the Enzo will even be used in lesser Ferraris further lowering the developement costs.
Comparing it to the Mclaren F1 price is not entirely justified. Mclaren had never built a road car before so they probably wasted vast amounts of money down deadends in the developement of that car. They then could only amortise these costs over less than 100 vehicles.
Ferrari on the otherhand had orders before they had even developed the car, a set budget and years of experiance producing the F50/F40 etc. There is very little on the Enzo that doesn't share some design heritage with other Ferrari products, and certain things from the Enzo will even be used in lesser Ferraris further lowering the developement costs.
RR-Eng said:
I remmeber reading that Ferrari were making a fairly hefty profit with the Enzo. Something in the region of £150,000. The price of the Enzo was most probably based on what the market would support not on the price it cost to build.
Comparing it to the Mclaren F1 price is not entirely justified. Mclaren had never built a road car before so they probably wasted vast amounts of money down deadends in the developement of that car. They then could only amortise these costs over less than 100 vehicles.
Ferrari on the otherhand had orders before they had even developed the car, a set budget and years of experiance producing the F50/F40 etc. There is very little on the Enzo that doesn't share some design heritage with other Ferrari products, and certain things from the Enzo will even be used in lesser Ferraris further lowering the developement costs.
Mclaren lost money on EVERY car they made......
with the Enzo you are paying a lot of money for all sorts of parts that have been developed specifically for this car. It is basically a brand new car which is meant to represent the ultimate in technology that Ferrari can produce. So not only must it work better, it needs to not break instantly.
Also, in this day and age, they need to ensure that they make a profit on it. There is always a risk when producing a car like the Enzo that the supercar market could collapse during production, building in some margin can help protect them and keep the bean counters happy, thus ensuring that we, the public are lucky enough that these cars are actually made.
Of course many of the developments are now finding their way onto the more affordable Ferraris.
As far as the F40 goes, that was a development of an existing car (which was in itself a development) so the production costs are completely different.
Also, in this day and age, they need to ensure that they make a profit on it. There is always a risk when producing a car like the Enzo that the supercar market could collapse during production, building in some margin can help protect them and keep the bean counters happy, thus ensuring that we, the public are lucky enough that these cars are actually made.
Of course many of the developments are now finding their way onto the more affordable Ferraris.
As far as the F40 goes, that was a development of an existing car (which was in itself a development) so the production costs are completely different.
guydw said:
As far as the F40 goes, that was a development of an existing car (which was in itself a development) so the production costs are completely different.
IIRC Ferrari built several 288 Evos to test some of the F40's running gear - is this the car you are referring to Guy? But did the series production F40 actually use the 288 platform? Granted, the drivetrain was an evolution, but the back end of an F40 looks quite different to that of a 288 (underneath the body, natch) I've never seen the back end of a 288 Evo so can't comment on that.
It is interesting that the 288 GTO had a list price of circa £73k back in 1988 (last year of production) whilst the 1988 F40 (1st year of production) had a list price of £193k - a lot of extra dosh if indeed the latter was based on the former....
They made 5 288 GTO EVO's IIRC (they featured one in EVO a few months back). They made 2 as development cars for the F40 but then made a few more to satisfy a few very important collectors.
As for the Enzo I'm sure that they could have sold more than 399 if they wanted to. Plenty of people applied but got turned down (Arash Farboud for one)
People will pay a lot of money for a Ferrari. They only ever intended to build around 400 F40's but due to demand made over 1,300 making it the most profitable Ferrari ever.
As for the Enzo I'm sure that they could have sold more than 399 if they wanted to. Plenty of people applied but got turned down (Arash Farboud for one)
People will pay a lot of money for a Ferrari. They only ever intended to build around 400 F40's but due to demand made over 1,300 making it the most profitable Ferrari ever.
off the top of my head (I'm no expert) the 288 GTO Evo went quite a way towards the F40, body kit and all. Obviously the F40 was quite a development beyond the 288 GTO hence the price, but there is certainly a bloodline there.
IIRC the F50 is a completely new car, making it more exotic. As a matter of interest It's one of the best sounding Ferraris I've ever heard outside of classic racers etc.
IIRC the F50 is a completely new car, making it more exotic. As a matter of interest It's one of the best sounding Ferraris I've ever heard outside of classic racers etc.
Gassing Station | Supercar General | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff