I'd like a bit of info on two opposites of the V8 scale
Discussion
As the title says, I'm on the look out for some real world information on two cars (well three really). Hopefully within the next three to six months I'll be off loading the Alfa (scratched the Alfa itch), love the car but hating modern(ish) turbo diesel technology (I'd happily have a petrol version at some point), and I'm looking at getting into V8 territory while I can still afford to do so thanks to no major out goings (and a budget of ooo £12,000-ish, maybe bit more for the right car).
On one side there's the lure of TVR, Chimera being the obvious choice at this price point (though there is a repaired cat D Tuscan Speed Six in the region which, despite the god awful coloured interior looks rather good, up with TVRGlen if anyone's had any experience with them/him), minimal driver aides, manual, good looking drop top driving, home spanner-able and requires the car to be actually driven rather than piloted (and by all accounts can work quite happily on LPG if it's a keeper).
At the opposite end there's the Jag XK (2006+ model). A great looking car in my eye's, auto box only (with flappy paddles), can be driven rather than piloted if I chose to do so. Only potential drawbacks to the XF is that those in my budget range are 100,000+ miles numbers and the slew of gadgets (more to go, expensively, wrong). The mileage thing isn't really an issue/drawback mind as I had a 214SEi with 118,000 miles on the clock and it was the cleanest most reliable car I've had. My concerns with the Jag is the added complexity (obviously) and what mileage can do to the autobox and how does the 4.2 engine/car wear those miles.
In both cases they'd scratch an itch (big capacity, NA car that's got a bit of poke to it nad I've Rover 200 Coupe as my economical car of choice
) it's just that I know little of the cars in general and what I have read to date are generally derived from short term tests or vague barely useful user reviews.
On one side there's the lure of TVR, Chimera being the obvious choice at this price point (though there is a repaired cat D Tuscan Speed Six in the region which, despite the god awful coloured interior looks rather good, up with TVRGlen if anyone's had any experience with them/him), minimal driver aides, manual, good looking drop top driving, home spanner-able and requires the car to be actually driven rather than piloted (and by all accounts can work quite happily on LPG if it's a keeper).
At the opposite end there's the Jag XK (2006+ model). A great looking car in my eye's, auto box only (with flappy paddles), can be driven rather than piloted if I chose to do so. Only potential drawbacks to the XF is that those in my budget range are 100,000+ miles numbers and the slew of gadgets (more to go, expensively, wrong). The mileage thing isn't really an issue/drawback mind as I had a 214SEi with 118,000 miles on the clock and it was the cleanest most reliable car I've had. My concerns with the Jag is the added complexity (obviously) and what mileage can do to the autobox and how does the 4.2 engine/car wear those miles.
In both cases they'd scratch an itch (big capacity, NA car that's got a bit of poke to it nad I've Rover 200 Coupe as my economical car of choice
) it's just that I know little of the cars in general and what I have read to date are generally derived from short term tests or vague barely useful user reviews.alpha channel said:
As the title says, I'm on the look out for some real world information on two cars (well three really). Hopefully within the next three to six months I'll be off loading the Alfa (scratched the Alfa itch), love the car but hating modern(ish) turbo diesel technology (I'd happily have a petrol version at some point), and I'm looking at getting into V8 territory while I can still afford to do so thanks to no major out goings (and a budget of ooo £12,000-ish, maybe bit more for the right car).
On one side there's the lure of TVR, Chimera being the obvious choice at this price point (though there is a repaired cat D Tuscan Speed Six in the region which, despite the god awful coloured interior looks rather good, up with TVRGlen if anyone's had any experience with them/him), minimal driver aides, manual, good looking drop top driving, home spanner-able and requires the car to be actually driven rather than piloted (and by all accounts can work quite happily on LPG if it's a keeper).
At the opposite end there's the Jag XK (2006+ model). A great looking car in my eye's, auto box only (with flappy paddles), can be driven rather than piloted if I chose to do so. Only potential drawbacks to the XF is that those in my budget range are 100,000+ miles numbers and the slew of gadgets (more to go, expensively, wrong). The mileage thing isn't really an issue/drawback mind as I had a 214SEi with 118,000 miles on the clock and it was the cleanest most reliable car I've had. My concerns with the Jag is the added complexity (obviously) and what mileage can do to the autobox and how does the 4.2 engine/car wear those miles.
In both cases they'd scratch an itch (big capacity, NA car that's got a bit of poke to it nad I've Rover 200 Coupe as my economical car of choice ) it's just that I know little of the cars in general and what I have read to date are generally derived from short term tests or vague barely useful user reviews.
I can't comment on the TVR's I have never owned one having had a XK for around 9 months the car seemed pretty bullet proof electrics are as good as any other car maker the engine & box will go on for miles the only real issue is the heads coking up but a Teraclean or similar will sort that.On one side there's the lure of TVR, Chimera being the obvious choice at this price point (though there is a repaired cat D Tuscan Speed Six in the region which, despite the god awful coloured interior looks rather good, up with TVRGlen if anyone's had any experience with them/him), minimal driver aides, manual, good looking drop top driving, home spanner-able and requires the car to be actually driven rather than piloted (and by all accounts can work quite happily on LPG if it's a keeper).
At the opposite end there's the Jag XK (2006+ model). A great looking car in my eye's, auto box only (with flappy paddles), can be driven rather than piloted if I chose to do so. Only potential drawbacks to the XF is that those in my budget range are 100,000+ miles numbers and the slew of gadgets (more to go, expensively, wrong). The mileage thing isn't really an issue/drawback mind as I had a 214SEi with 118,000 miles on the clock and it was the cleanest most reliable car I've had. My concerns with the Jag is the added complexity (obviously) and what mileage can do to the autobox and how does the 4.2 engine/car wear those miles.
In both cases they'd scratch an itch (big capacity, NA car that's got a bit of poke to it nad I've Rover 200 Coupe as my economical car of choice
) it's just that I know little of the cars in general and what I have read to date are generally derived from short term tests or vague barely useful user reviews.They are two very different types of car so I think you need to workout what you want from the car.
I suspect the prices of TVR will flat line (probably already has) and will start to climb (slowly)
The Jag, will continue to depreciate like a stone, being a large engined, not-very-sort-after mainstream model.
If you can live with the foibles, and perhaps have access to another car to cover those emergency brake down days (weeks?? ;-) then get the TVR!
The Jag, will continue to depreciate like a stone, being a large engined, not-very-sort-after mainstream model.
If you can live with the foibles, and perhaps have access to another car to cover those emergency brake down days (weeks?? ;-) then get the TVR!
On TVR Glen: You know how this website has a no shame policy? Well TVR Glens reputation is so bad that they seem to let us post most of the bad stuff about them 
For £12k you've got about £3k too much for a good Chimaera, if you go over to the chim forum of this site they'll point you in the right direction. Price isn't a certainty on getting the best car, I've seen some stunners go for £9k and some nightmares advertised at £12k over the past year.
RV8 TVRs are generally more reliable and in better condition if they're used, things with low miles that have just sat in a garage tend to throw a wobbly when you try to use them. Buy on condition, preferably get someone who knows what they're looking at. It's virtually impossible to lose money on one if you buy well and don't get bitten by the modification bug, which most people are. Parts are very cheap, mostly Ford and Rover bits. There's a heavy TVR tax though if you have to take it to garages to work done on it, parts are Ford prices but labour is on the Porsche scale.
On reliability it's people who buy them and can't do simple things like change a rotor arm/dizzy cap that have problems, they're reliable if you can do basic maintenance. If you have to take your car to the dealer to change a wiper blade they're not the car for you.
For £12k you've got about £3k too much for a good Chimaera, if you go over to the chim forum of this site they'll point you in the right direction. Price isn't a certainty on getting the best car, I've seen some stunners go for £9k and some nightmares advertised at £12k over the past year.
RV8 TVRs are generally more reliable and in better condition if they're used, things with low miles that have just sat in a garage tend to throw a wobbly when you try to use them. Buy on condition, preferably get someone who knows what they're looking at. It's virtually impossible to lose money on one if you buy well and don't get bitten by the modification bug, which most people are. Parts are very cheap, mostly Ford and Rover bits. There's a heavy TVR tax though if you have to take it to garages to work done on it, parts are Ford prices but labour is on the Porsche scale.
On reliability it's people who buy them and can't do simple things like change a rotor arm/dizzy cap that have problems, they're reliable if you can do basic maintenance. If you have to take your car to the dealer to change a wiper blade they're not the car for you.
Edited by s p a c e m a n on Wednesday 31st December 16:00
TVRs are great - but do your research on the vendor of that Tuscan you mentioned. Tuscans cost a metric ****load more to maintain than Chimaeras though - the former being a wonderful yet labour intensive engine and lots of bespoke electronics whereas the latter is fairly lazy Rover V8 and working parts from mainstream cars.
The original X100 XK8s and XKRs have bottomed out now. The 2006> X150s probably have some way to go. The engine is not an issue - the 4.2 litre AJ-V8 is bomb proof. The 6 speed ZF gearbox is likewise extremely reliable although they benefit greatly from and oil and filter change against the "sealed for life" sales pitch. Most don't get that maintenance though as it costs a few hundred quid. If done, the ZF 6HPseries is great too. Bushes, dampers etc are likely past their best by that age and milage, although to people who have only ever owned s
t old cars they probably feel fine. Other stuff doesn't tend to pack in too often. It's not an XKR.
You'll bag a cracking example of a Chimaera 450 or 500 for the XK budget and you won't lose any money on it. I wouldn't personally want to leave a Chimaera parked outside in all weathers permanently though.
The original X100 XK8s and XKRs have bottomed out now. The 2006> X150s probably have some way to go. The engine is not an issue - the 4.2 litre AJ-V8 is bomb proof. The 6 speed ZF gearbox is likewise extremely reliable although they benefit greatly from and oil and filter change against the "sealed for life" sales pitch. Most don't get that maintenance though as it costs a few hundred quid. If done, the ZF 6HPseries is great too. Bushes, dampers etc are likely past their best by that age and milage, although to people who have only ever owned s
t old cars they probably feel fine. Other stuff doesn't tend to pack in too often. It's not an XKR.You'll bag a cracking example of a Chimaera 450 or 500 for the XK budget and you won't lose any money on it. I wouldn't personally want to leave a Chimaera parked outside in all weathers permanently though.
Well I can comment on the TVR option as I had a Chimaera for 4 years, great car and the only thing that went wrong was a starter motor, it wasn't a daily driver though so maybe different if doing a lot of miles. At your price point stay away from a Tuscan it will most certainly need a rebuild at this price and that is at least 5k anywhere decent.
A few years back I ran a Griff at the same time as an XKR. As you allude, they are immensely different cars. The Jag is a great car, with good oomph and you can just jump in it and go anywhere. The Tiv is much more of an occasion.
If the car is going to sit in a garage and be used at weekends for fun then bin the XKR idea as it will be dull but if it's going to be an everyday car used for normal chores then the XKR is an absolute cracker and the Tiv becomes a bit of a pain.
If the car is going to sit in a garage and be used at weekends for fun then bin the XKR idea as it will be dull but if it's going to be an everyday car used for normal chores then the XKR is an absolute cracker and the Tiv becomes a bit of a pain.
Thanks for the info so far, as for TVR Glen, wide birth put in place then 
and that's the top end of a potential budget, spending less is not unwelcome (and I have actually noticed a slight bump up in terms of TVR values). V8 isn't the be all and end all but it'd be nice to have that engine note in my life at least once. All being fair I'll get to sample both ends and I wouldn't even consider a car with a large capacity engine (and the thirst that goes along with them) if I didn't have another car lined up for those foible days (my Rover 200 Coupe's been pretty good over the past decade and hopefully for the decade to come and is damn near as efficient as my 159 which has had a few foible days itself).
Generally speaking I'm not too bad at doing things myself, the amount of work me and my father have done on my Coupe is pretty much testament that I'm not too scared of getting the spanners out (though I did have to outsource the top end engine rebuild/head skim). The one thing I can guarantee is that it wouldn't sit still for lengthy periods, I get erm... addicted... to a good engine note. As for modding? that'd have to be limited to the less expensive side of things as I'm in the process of doing a rolling restore of the old Coupe.
Edit - This wouldn't be a weekend toy, it'd be used on the commute alongside my Rover, I've a good mix of roads on the old commute that mix twists and long straight and virtually empty, in comparison to the rest of the country, roads (and the idea of getting my hands on a Rover V8 does appeal rather more to me than a bespoke potential pain in the bum, I have a tendency to like Rovers).
and that's the top end of a potential budget, spending less is not unwelcome (and I have actually noticed a slight bump up in terms of TVR values). V8 isn't the be all and end all but it'd be nice to have that engine note in my life at least once. All being fair I'll get to sample both ends and I wouldn't even consider a car with a large capacity engine (and the thirst that goes along with them) if I didn't have another car lined up for those foible days (my Rover 200 Coupe's been pretty good over the past decade and hopefully for the decade to come and is damn near as efficient as my 159 which has had a few foible days itself).Generally speaking I'm not too bad at doing things myself, the amount of work me and my father have done on my Coupe is pretty much testament that I'm not too scared of getting the spanners out (though I did have to outsource the top end engine rebuild/head skim). The one thing I can guarantee is that it wouldn't sit still for lengthy periods, I get erm... addicted... to a good engine note. As for modding? that'd have to be limited to the less expensive side of things as I'm in the process of doing a rolling restore of the old Coupe.
Edit - This wouldn't be a weekend toy, it'd be used on the commute alongside my Rover, I've a good mix of roads on the old commute that mix twists and long straight and virtually empty, in comparison to the rest of the country, roads (and the idea of getting my hands on a Rover V8 does appeal rather more to me than a bespoke potential pain in the bum, I have a tendency to like Rovers).
Edited by alpha channel on Wednesday 31st December 16:34
Judging by those words you'll be fine with a chim. The engines are more or less bulletproof (cam wear can be an issue at about 70k miles), all of the work involves either servicing or simple bolt on bits. As far as modifying, it's also cheap to do but once you start you'll end up doing everything. Full set of gaz gold coilovers are about £400, doing a bigger brake conversion to cosworth brakes normally comes in at about £2oo with etc etc
alpha channel said:
Thanks for the info so far, as for TVR Glen, wide birth put in place then and that's the top end of a potential budget, spending less is not unwelcome (and I have actually noticed a slight bump up in terms of TVR values). V8 isn't the be all and end all but it'd be nice to have that engine note in my life at least once. All being fair I'll get to sample both ends and I wouldn't even consider a car with a large capacity engine (and the thirst that goes along with them) if I didn't have another car lined up for those foible days (my Rover 200 Coupe's been pretty good over the past decade and hopefully for the decade to come and is damn near as efficient as my 159 which has had a few foible days itself).
Generally speaking I'm not too bad at doing things myself, the amount of work me and my father have done on my Coupe is pretty much testament that I'm not too scared of getting the spanners out (though I did have to outsource the top end engine rebuild/head skim). The one thing I can guarantee is that it wouldn't sit still for lengthy periods, I get erm... addicted... to a good engine note. As for modding? that'd have to be limited to the less expensive side of things as I'm in the process of doing a rolling restore of the old Coupe.
Edit - This wouldn't be a weekend toy, it'd be used on the commute alongside my Rover, I've a good mix of roads on the old commute that mix twists and long straight and virtually empty, in comparison to the rest of the country, roads (and the idea of getting my hands on a Rover V8 does appeal rather more to me than a bespoke potential pain in the bum, I have a tendency to like Rovers).
The Tiv seems a rather obvious choice given those criteria. I think you'd find the Jag too 'normal'. Besides, while the AJV8 is a stonking unit in an XK it is very quiet and very smooth so if you are doing this for the fun of a V8 then it really has to be a good old push rod unit for that classic reward. and that's the top end of a potential budget, spending less is not unwelcome (and I have actually noticed a slight bump up in terms of TVR values). V8 isn't the be all and end all but it'd be nice to have that engine note in my life at least once. All being fair I'll get to sample both ends and I wouldn't even consider a car with a large capacity engine (and the thirst that goes along with them) if I didn't have another car lined up for those foible days (my Rover 200 Coupe's been pretty good over the past decade and hopefully for the decade to come and is damn near as efficient as my 159 which has had a few foible days itself).Generally speaking I'm not too bad at doing things myself, the amount of work me and my father have done on my Coupe is pretty much testament that I'm not too scared of getting the spanners out (though I did have to outsource the top end engine rebuild/head skim). The one thing I can guarantee is that it wouldn't sit still for lengthy periods, I get erm... addicted... to a good engine note. As for modding? that'd have to be limited to the less expensive side of things as I'm in the process of doing a rolling restore of the old Coupe.
Edit - This wouldn't be a weekend toy, it'd be used on the commute alongside my Rover, I've a good mix of roads on the old commute that mix twists and long straight and virtually empty, in comparison to the rest of the country, roads (and the idea of getting my hands on a Rover V8 does appeal rather more to me than a bespoke potential pain in the bum, I have a tendency to like Rovers).
Edited by alpha channel on Wednesday 31st December 16:34
Buy intelligently and you should see some wise tinkering adding to the value of a Chimp but nothing you do to a Jag will positively increase value.
alpha channel said:
Jag too 'normal', :lol: take a look at my garage, the very definition of mundane, low rent and normal (though in one or two case decent handling). Anything with a bit of oomph to me is anything but normal.
It's refined and quiet. You seem to want to experience the joy of a V8, I don't think you'll get that with the XK. I loved mine but unless you Barry the exhaust then all you hear is the SC whine and you feel absolutely nothing as it is so well damped. That true 'V8 feeling' that we all live only really comes from the old school push rods like the RV8. In a Chimp you both feel it and hear it and live it so out of the two options it is the clear winner for the pure V8 experience.
I can just see the faces of the Vice principal (as she usually parks up next to me) and other more senior, and far better paid, members of staff as I pull up in a Bentley... actually might be worth it (not a fan of BMW's even though 500hp of Germanic V8 is kind of appealing, higher mileage successors to the e39 appearing to be hitting the £13/£14k mark now). Mind you I had a Chimera ad up on screen and one of the former IT tech staff wandered in and the first words out of his mouth (jokingly) - you can't drive that here.
(not a fan of BMW's even though 500hp of Germanic V8 is kind of appealing, higher mileage successors to the e39 appearing to be hitting the £13/£14k mark now). Mind you I had a Chimera ad up on screen and one of the former IT tech staff wandered in and the first words out of his mouth (jokingly) - you can't drive that here.Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff