Packaging fiasco!
Discussion
Today I sent the following letter to a very well known national computer retailer. Am I being reasonable in my assertions?
Dear Sirs,
Yesterday (the 8th of January 2005) I bought a three meter long Scart cable, thingie for £39.99 - as well as some other bits and bobs totalling £126.96 from your Basingstoke store. Please see a copy of the receipt, attached.
When I got home I attempted to open the packaging of the Scart cable using fingers, fingernails, teeth and various other body parts - all to no avail. The item seemed to be hermetically sealed in some type of bullet-proof plastic. Eventually, using a combination of pliers, knives, scissors, electric drill and a hammer I managed to remove the said article from its protective packaging. Unsurprisingly, the product was in mint condition but the packaging ended up looking like a fox on Boxing Day evening. I then had a cup of tea and a lie down to recover from my exertions.
When I linked up the cable to my Sky Box to a projector it wouldn’t work. My son then realised that we’d bought a “cable to Scart” rather than a “Scart to cable” (a common mistake I’m sure). Today I took the cable back to the store – but obviously the packaging was in a thousand pieces inside my vacuum cleaner. I had in mind to simply exchange the cable for the correct one, however there weren’t any correct ones available in the store so I asked for a refund.
I was somewhat surprised when the gentleman at customer services said I couldn’t have a refund unless the product was either with its original packaging or faulty. I explained to him my “packaging trauma” and pointed out that as a consumer I was acquiring the “product” not the “packaging” – which is primarily there for the good of the retailer. He then made some phone calls and I got the same message from his manager. I asked for the manager’s name so I could write a letter, but was told I couldn’t have it because of the “data protection act” – which was something of a surprise. Hence this letter is now addressed to you.
My point is this: If I chose to be a very naughty boy I could have broken the product in some way, said it was faulty and had a refund. Alternatively, I could have emptied the contents of my vacuum cleaner onto the till, along with the item. I chose not to, because I’m a fair minded and reasonable person.
In the light of the above, I was wondering whether your organisation might also be inclined to act in a similar (reasonable) fashion by offering me a refund on the product? After all, I have spent many thousands of Pounds in your store in recent years.
Lastly, I won’t now need to buy a three metre “Scart to cable” from you, because your employee recommended “Maplins Online”. As such, I’ve now ordered a FIVE metre cable from Maplins for just £11.99 – a superior product for one third the cost. So please pass on my thanks to your employee for this information.
I look forward to hearing from you in due course.
Dear Sirs,
Yesterday (the 8th of January 2005) I bought a three meter long Scart cable, thingie for £39.99 - as well as some other bits and bobs totalling £126.96 from your Basingstoke store. Please see a copy of the receipt, attached.
When I got home I attempted to open the packaging of the Scart cable using fingers, fingernails, teeth and various other body parts - all to no avail. The item seemed to be hermetically sealed in some type of bullet-proof plastic. Eventually, using a combination of pliers, knives, scissors, electric drill and a hammer I managed to remove the said article from its protective packaging. Unsurprisingly, the product was in mint condition but the packaging ended up looking like a fox on Boxing Day evening. I then had a cup of tea and a lie down to recover from my exertions.
When I linked up the cable to my Sky Box to a projector it wouldn’t work. My son then realised that we’d bought a “cable to Scart” rather than a “Scart to cable” (a common mistake I’m sure). Today I took the cable back to the store – but obviously the packaging was in a thousand pieces inside my vacuum cleaner. I had in mind to simply exchange the cable for the correct one, however there weren’t any correct ones available in the store so I asked for a refund.
I was somewhat surprised when the gentleman at customer services said I couldn’t have a refund unless the product was either with its original packaging or faulty. I explained to him my “packaging trauma” and pointed out that as a consumer I was acquiring the “product” not the “packaging” – which is primarily there for the good of the retailer. He then made some phone calls and I got the same message from his manager. I asked for the manager’s name so I could write a letter, but was told I couldn’t have it because of the “data protection act” – which was something of a surprise. Hence this letter is now addressed to you.
My point is this: If I chose to be a very naughty boy I could have broken the product in some way, said it was faulty and had a refund. Alternatively, I could have emptied the contents of my vacuum cleaner onto the till, along with the item. I chose not to, because I’m a fair minded and reasonable person.
In the light of the above, I was wondering whether your organisation might also be inclined to act in a similar (reasonable) fashion by offering me a refund on the product? After all, I have spent many thousands of Pounds in your store in recent years.
Lastly, I won’t now need to buy a three metre “Scart to cable” from you, because your employee recommended “Maplins Online”. As such, I’ve now ordered a FIVE metre cable from Maplins for just £11.99 – a superior product for one third the cost. So please pass on my thanks to your employee for this information.
I look forward to hearing from you in due course.
seems fine to me.
You haven't been rude or anything, so I say fair enough.
besides, what's the worst thing that can come of a letter? a Harsh reponse?
I know which sort of packaging you mean, how do they expect people to return it in the original packaging if it's so well sealed in the first place?
You haven't been rude or anything, so I say fair enough.
besides, what's the worst thing that can come of a letter? a Harsh reponse?
I know which sort of packaging you mean, how do they expect people to return it in the original packaging if it's so well sealed in the first place?
With that sort of packaging you wonder how a little old lady would manage!? Can't they just put some sort of tear-off strip round it?
Worst one I had was a TV aerial that was attached to card with vacuum sealed clear plastic - it had molded itself around all the cross pieces, holes and attachments, making it a job of hours to disentangle!
Worst one I had was a TV aerial that was attached to card with vacuum sealed clear plastic - it had molded itself around all the cross pieces, holes and attachments, making it a job of hours to disentangle!
The packaging thing is a pain, but - you /are/ being unreasonable.
I work in Argos and we get several people like you in daily, from things like bedding to televisions. What do you expect the store to do with it exactly? They can't resell it, and it would cost too much to be sent back to the factory so they can stick another box on it. So, do you expect every store to refund items that arn't suitable even though it will just end up being a deadweight loss. You have to remember if we did it wouldn't just be the honest people coming back, it would be the idiots who have used a camera on holiday etc. Therefore it is simply an unworkable practice and if stores did it the prices would be so much higher you wouldn't shop there in the first place.
I hope they don't give you the money back because that would be unfair on all the people that realise that they have made a mistake - not the store, and therfore suffer the loss themselves - which is fair.
Cheers,
Rob.
I work in Argos and we get several people like you in daily, from things like bedding to televisions. What do you expect the store to do with it exactly? They can't resell it, and it would cost too much to be sent back to the factory so they can stick another box on it. So, do you expect every store to refund items that arn't suitable even though it will just end up being a deadweight loss. You have to remember if we did it wouldn't just be the honest people coming back, it would be the idiots who have used a camera on holiday etc. Therefore it is simply an unworkable practice and if stores did it the prices would be so much higher you wouldn't shop there in the first place.
I hope they don't give you the money back because that would be unfair on all the people that realise that they have made a mistake - not the store, and therfore suffer the loss themselves - which is fair.
Cheers,
Rob.
Rob_F said:
The packaging thing is a pain, but - you /are/ being unreasonable.
I work in Argos and we get several people like you in daily, from things like bedding to televisions. What do you expect the store to do with it exactly? They can't resell it, and it would cost too much to be sent back to the factory so they can stick another box on it. So, do you expect every store to refund items that arn't suitable even though it will just end up being a deadweight loss. You have to remember if we did it wouldn't just be the honest people coming back, it would be the idiots who have used a camera on holiday etc. Therefore it is simply an unworkable practice and if stores did it the prices would be so much higher you wouldn't shop there in the first place.
I hope they don't give you the money back because that would be unfair on all the people that realise that they have made a mistake - not the store, and therfore suffer the loss themselves - which is fair.
Cheers,
Rob.
Interesting attitude - the difference, I think, between a "employee material" and a "director material". As a company owner, I know how much it costs to gain a customer and how easy it can be lose one in a competitive market. If the company in question don't act in what I consider to be reasonably, I'll simply take my custom to another retailer who are more client focussed. Think I'll avoid Argos though!!
>> Edited by srebbe64 on Sunday 9th January 16:12
srebbe64 said:
I bet it was one of those moulded heavy gauge rigid clear plastic packages with the really heavy seam welding all around the edge. Lethal trying to get into one. You have to destroy it to open it, so what are you supposed to do if you need to take it back?
Bingo!
Some sort of boxcutter or exacto style razor hobby knife. It's the only way...
ErnestM
srebbe64 said:
Interesting attitude - the difference, I think, between a "employee material" and a "director material".
Ooooh, arn't we full of ourselves?
The simple fact is your attitude is unfair, whether the company bowes into it or not doesn't matter. You expect the company to accept your loss from a mistake you made. This sort of "not my fault" attitude is what causes the ambulance chasing and so forth which is becoming, unfortunately, more and more common.
I don't intend on sticking around at Argos forever believe me, but the employees i work with certainly have a better understanding of the real world, and how the business actually runs then the senior management that pay visits that i've met do. When i'm in a leadership role i'll certainly not regard employees to have any less of a valid viewpoint than directors.
Cheers,
Rob.
>> Edited by Rob_F on Sunday 9th January 17:13
Rob_F said:
Interesting attitude - the difference, I think, between a "employee material" and a "director material".
Ooooh, arn't we full of ourselves?
The simple fact is your attitude is unfair, whether the company bowes into it or not doesn't matter. You expect the company to accept your loss from a mistake you made. This sort of "not my fault" attitude is what causes the ambulance chasing and so forth which is becoming, unfortunately, more and more common.
I don't intend on sticking around at Argos forever believe me, but the employees i work with certainly have a better understanding of the real world, and how the business actually runs then the senior management that pay visits that i've met do. When i'm in a leadership role i'll certainly not regard employees to have any less of a valid viewpoint than directors.
Cheers,
Rob.
>> Edited by Rob_F on Sunday 9th January 17:13
So let me understand your point of view Rob.
I buy a product that has been packaged in such a way that you have to break the packaging in order to get to it. I then discover it’s the wrong product but can’t get a refund because the packaging’s now broken. I could pretend the product’s faulty and get a refund, but decide that honesty is the best policy. I send a friendly letter to the HQ because they won’t give me the local manager’s name. Hmm, let me think, am I being unreasonable? No, don’t think so. To be compared to a proverbial “ambulance chaser” doesn’t make you look very bright, to be honest.
A little word of advice if you have aspirations to become a leader in the business world, Rob. You need to (hypothetically) continually put yourself in the customer’s position, and, from this perspective, you have to be perceived as being “better than your competitors”.
srebbe64 said:
I buy a product that has been packaged in such a way that you have to break the packaging in order to get to it. I then discover it’s the wrong product but can’t get a refund because the packaging’s now broken. I could pretend the product’s faulty and get a refund, but decide that honesty is the best policy.
Perhaps it is packaged in such a way to avoid it being faulty and therefore stopping any false claim.
Perhaps and I say this with all respect, if you were as you say honest, then you would just say " Bollocks I purchased the wrong one, now I will have to go and buy the right one." ??
srebbe64 said:
I buy a product that has been packaged in such a way that you have to break the packaging in order to get to it. I then discover it’s the wrong product but can’t get a refund because the packaging’s now broken. I could pretend the product’s faulty and get a refund, but decide that honesty is the best policy. I send a friendly letter to the HQ because they won’t give me the local manager’s name. Hmm, let me think, am I being unreasonable? No, don’t think so.
Yes! You are! You can't get away from the fact that you expect other people to pay for your mistake. Pretending the product is faulty has nothing to do with it, and nobody forced you to open the packaging in the first place.
You made a mistake, you bought the wrong product which you then put in a un-resalable state by opening, learn to accept it.
Cheers,
Rob.
I also agree with Rob, you do seem full of yourself. You dealt with a large company and in all reality your transaction was small. They do not know you personally and you get treated the same as every other customer.
From your above post I gather you own a company, you have to work hard to attract and keep your customers, you do this with personal service. You deal with the customer and the customer gets what they need. Now if the chief executive of DSG were to serve customers in every branch of thier companies brands prices would be astronomical. Thing is they don't and they employ people on minimum wage therefore they are CHEAP, that is why people go there and service is crap.
From your above post I gather you own a company, you have to work hard to attract and keep your customers, you do this with personal service. You deal with the customer and the customer gets what they need. Now if the chief executive of DSG were to serve customers in every branch of thier companies brands prices would be astronomical. Thing is they don't and they employ people on minimum wage therefore they are CHEAP, that is why people go there and service is crap.
Rob_F said:
I buy a product that has been packaged in such a way that you have to break the packaging in order to get to it. I then discover it’s the wrong product but can’t get a refund because the packaging’s now broken. I could pretend the product’s faulty and get a refund, but decide that honesty is the best policy. I send a friendly letter to the HQ because they won’t give me the local manager’s name. Hmm, let me think, am I being unreasonable? No, don’t think so.
Yes! You are! You can't get away from the fact that you expect other people to pay for your mistake. Pretending the product is faulty has nothing to do with it, and nobody forced you to open the packaging in the first place.
You made a mistake, you bought the wrong product which you then put in a un-resalable state by opening, learn to accept it.
Cheers,
Rob.
Honestly, when I hear this sort of attitude from “would-be business leaders” I feel quite encouraged actually. I run a successful business by providing “better than average service” to customers. I now lead a very comfortable life on the proceeds of this principle. As long as people with your sort of attitude are in positions of authority, I’ll carry on poaching your customers and making even more money. Suits me nicely!
So, in summary. Yes Rob, you’re absolutely right, the problem is definitely those awful customers and you should spend the rest of your career with the same attitude.
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