Car dealers dishonesty.
Discussion
This post is to put up instances of car dealer dishonesty, and in one case outright theft, that I have personally experienced, for which I was asked and promised I would do.
1. Took a Reliant Scimitar into a dealership for a differential oil seal to be replaced, and was told it would be ready in two days. I contacted them two days later and was told they were having trouble getting the parts. Two days later got the same storey from them, so decided to go there, to check for myself. On arrival my car, was in the workshop minus its rear axle, when I asked why they had taken the axle off to replace the diff nose oil seal, they looked shifty and did not want to give me an answer. Eventually they admitted, that they had repaired my axle and put it on another customers car FFS!. They then tried to fob me off with another (smaller earlier type) axle which may or may not have come from the other customers car, which I refused , as I wanted the same spec axle to be fitted to my car. I insisted they fit the correct axle to my car.
Several days later they told me the car was ready, and they had indeed fitted the correct axle, only this one was from a crashed car, and one of the axle tubes was bent, I left the car there and took them to court over their theft of my axle. They lost, and were required by the court to fit a new axle, but I lost also owing to some of the costs / time issues which were not recoverable.
2. Took a 2 week old XR3 to the dealership (it was the first XR3 they had ever supplied) for its first (1000 mile) courtesy service, and when booking it in, made it clear that the car was my brand new pride and joy, and that I hoped it would be looked after, whilst in the dealers hands. Dealer replied `We treat all our customers cars with the utmost care and respect'
Whilst waiting outside for a lift to work, my car came racing out of the dealers yard with four
`persons' (for persons read yobs in overalls) and screeched to a halt leaving two black tyre marks on the road. They then shot off down the road with the front wheels spinning up enough to create tyre smoke, and again leaving two trails of `my' brand new Pirelli tyres on the road.
I shot back inside and demanded know why my car was being used in that way by four yobs. The dealer said my car was in the workshop, so I asked him to show me. which he could not. He then turned very red, and said he would have words with the workshop manager. I got my car back, and it seemed ok, but I made it clear that any faults that showed up as a result of it its poor treatment, would have to be dealt with entirely at their expense.
3. Took a new jeep to the dealership for its first service, and on returning in the evening to pick it up, paid for the service and then asked where it was, as it was not on the forecourt, or in the workshop. No one there seemed to know where it had gone, and I had visions of it being stolen. Eventually they determined, that it had been parked in a pub car park down the road, because they needed space in the workshop. On getting to the car I found a large dent in the rear wing. I went straight back and confronted the service manager (this was the same man who walked around the vehicle with me that morning, when I dropped it off) who said, Oh yes! (wait for it!) we saw that and wondered if you wanted it repaired!!!!. I pointed out that the dent was not there when I dropped the car off
as we had BOTH examined the car before I left it with them, so the damage was entirely their responsibility. The car was repaired by them, But who would be happy with a having a new car damaged by the dealership which was supposed to look after it.
4. Had a throttle problem with a Scirocco, and dropped the car off at the dealers for the work to be carried out under warranty, on picking the car up, I got no more than 50 yards from the dealers and the problem started again. I went back and asked who had worked on the car, guess what? no one had! they had just started the engine, revved it a few times and could not re create the problem, and because it was warranty work, did no more to it. Took it to another VW dealership who immediately identified a problem with the vacuum advance machanism, and subsequently fixed it.
5. Took my Partners BMW to the dealership we bought it from, for a standard service, and on checking the bill it had an item listed as `special lubricant - doors bonnet and boot' for which they were charging nearly forty pounds. When I asked what the special lubricant was. the service manager said it was a special lubricant for BMW`s, I insisted on knowing what kind of lubricant was so `special' they were charging that amount for lubricating two doors, a bonnet and a boot. and he eventually admitted it was, wait for it! WD40. I asked him if he knew how much a can of WD40 cost, and then why he was charging enough for nearly fifteen cans of the stuff, for which he did not have a sound answer. I refused to pay for that bill item, and because he had been caught out shamelessly inflating the bill, he promised to leave a can of the `special lubricant' in the car next time it came in for work. I never went back there.
6. Took a another new Scirocco for `its' first service, and on inspecting the car when picking it up noticed a dent in the bonnet, and a corresponding dent in the top of the radiator, where a m*ng of a fitter had slammed the bonnet down whilst leaving a socket wrench on top of the radiator, Went straight back into the showroom, where the t
t of a service manager tried to make out that it was me who had done the damage, When I asked him why, as the car was just a few weeks old, I would need to be working under the bonnet of a brand new car, he did not have an answer. Fortunately the showroom was full of people looking at new cars, and my patients with f*cking lying dishonest car dealers was all used up, I started shouting at the f*cker, so the dealership director came out and bundled me into a side office, where he agreed to replace the bonnet and radiator, give me a courtesy car, and pay compensation for the event. Which I accepted. I never went back there, and was pleased to see that the dealership had shut down a few months later, I never knew the reason why, but I cold make a guess.
So if you wonder why I believe as a type, a lot (but not all) of car dealers are lying, dishonest, shysters, who would sell their mums if they could make a pound out of it, I hope the above gives you an idea of what brings me to this supposition.
1. Took a Reliant Scimitar into a dealership for a differential oil seal to be replaced, and was told it would be ready in two days. I contacted them two days later and was told they were having trouble getting the parts. Two days later got the same storey from them, so decided to go there, to check for myself. On arrival my car, was in the workshop minus its rear axle, when I asked why they had taken the axle off to replace the diff nose oil seal, they looked shifty and did not want to give me an answer. Eventually they admitted, that they had repaired my axle and put it on another customers car FFS!. They then tried to fob me off with another (smaller earlier type) axle which may or may not have come from the other customers car, which I refused , as I wanted the same spec axle to be fitted to my car. I insisted they fit the correct axle to my car.
Several days later they told me the car was ready, and they had indeed fitted the correct axle, only this one was from a crashed car, and one of the axle tubes was bent, I left the car there and took them to court over their theft of my axle. They lost, and were required by the court to fit a new axle, but I lost also owing to some of the costs / time issues which were not recoverable.
2. Took a 2 week old XR3 to the dealership (it was the first XR3 they had ever supplied) for its first (1000 mile) courtesy service, and when booking it in, made it clear that the car was my brand new pride and joy, and that I hoped it would be looked after, whilst in the dealers hands. Dealer replied `We treat all our customers cars with the utmost care and respect'
Whilst waiting outside for a lift to work, my car came racing out of the dealers yard with four
`persons' (for persons read yobs in overalls) and screeched to a halt leaving two black tyre marks on the road. They then shot off down the road with the front wheels spinning up enough to create tyre smoke, and again leaving two trails of `my' brand new Pirelli tyres on the road.
I shot back inside and demanded know why my car was being used in that way by four yobs. The dealer said my car was in the workshop, so I asked him to show me. which he could not. He then turned very red, and said he would have words with the workshop manager. I got my car back, and it seemed ok, but I made it clear that any faults that showed up as a result of it its poor treatment, would have to be dealt with entirely at their expense.
3. Took a new jeep to the dealership for its first service, and on returning in the evening to pick it up, paid for the service and then asked where it was, as it was not on the forecourt, or in the workshop. No one there seemed to know where it had gone, and I had visions of it being stolen. Eventually they determined, that it had been parked in a pub car park down the road, because they needed space in the workshop. On getting to the car I found a large dent in the rear wing. I went straight back and confronted the service manager (this was the same man who walked around the vehicle with me that morning, when I dropped it off) who said, Oh yes! (wait for it!) we saw that and wondered if you wanted it repaired!!!!. I pointed out that the dent was not there when I dropped the car off
as we had BOTH examined the car before I left it with them, so the damage was entirely their responsibility. The car was repaired by them, But who would be happy with a having a new car damaged by the dealership which was supposed to look after it.
4. Had a throttle problem with a Scirocco, and dropped the car off at the dealers for the work to be carried out under warranty, on picking the car up, I got no more than 50 yards from the dealers and the problem started again. I went back and asked who had worked on the car, guess what? no one had! they had just started the engine, revved it a few times and could not re create the problem, and because it was warranty work, did no more to it. Took it to another VW dealership who immediately identified a problem with the vacuum advance machanism, and subsequently fixed it.
5. Took my Partners BMW to the dealership we bought it from, for a standard service, and on checking the bill it had an item listed as `special lubricant - doors bonnet and boot' for which they were charging nearly forty pounds. When I asked what the special lubricant was. the service manager said it was a special lubricant for BMW`s, I insisted on knowing what kind of lubricant was so `special' they were charging that amount for lubricating two doors, a bonnet and a boot. and he eventually admitted it was, wait for it! WD40. I asked him if he knew how much a can of WD40 cost, and then why he was charging enough for nearly fifteen cans of the stuff, for which he did not have a sound answer. I refused to pay for that bill item, and because he had been caught out shamelessly inflating the bill, he promised to leave a can of the `special lubricant' in the car next time it came in for work. I never went back there.
6. Took a another new Scirocco for `its' first service, and on inspecting the car when picking it up noticed a dent in the bonnet, and a corresponding dent in the top of the radiator, where a m*ng of a fitter had slammed the bonnet down whilst leaving a socket wrench on top of the radiator, Went straight back into the showroom, where the t
t of a service manager tried to make out that it was me who had done the damage, When I asked him why, as the car was just a few weeks old, I would need to be working under the bonnet of a brand new car, he did not have an answer. Fortunately the showroom was full of people looking at new cars, and my patients with f*cking lying dishonest car dealers was all used up, I started shouting at the f*cker, so the dealership director came out and bundled me into a side office, where he agreed to replace the bonnet and radiator, give me a courtesy car, and pay compensation for the event. Which I accepted. I never went back there, and was pleased to see that the dealership had shut down a few months later, I never knew the reason why, but I cold make a guess.So if you wonder why I believe as a type, a lot (but not all) of car dealers are lying, dishonest, shysters, who would sell their mums if they could make a pound out of it, I hope the above gives you an idea of what brings me to this supposition.
I don't recall the exact details of the other thread, and can't be arsed to find it, however I thought it was talking about buying from a dealer as opposed to servicing by a dealer...
Also, 6 poor experiences dont mean that all who service cars are shiesters. I've had plenty of good experiences, but I also know that not all who service cars are good. Maybe you're just st at choosing them?!
Also, 6 poor experiences dont mean that all who service cars are shiesters. I've had plenty of good experiences, but I also know that not all who service cars are good. Maybe you're just s
t at choosing them?![quote=Adz The Rat]Yawn, we haven't had this thread for a few days.....[/quote
For your information I was obliging a request from another poster, and You are absolutely right, we have not had this thread for a few days. In fact we have not had it all. Your point? or are you a self appointed moderator who sees fit to bore everyone with THOUSANDS of `your' posts, but has the attention span of a goldfish, and gets bored by having to read more than a few words in someone else's
If you cannot cope with long posts the answer is simple, don't read them.
For your information I was obliging a request from another poster, and You are absolutely right, we have not had this thread for a few days. In fact we have not had it all. Your point? or are you a self appointed moderator who sees fit to bore everyone with THOUSANDS of `your' posts, but has the attention span of a goldfish, and gets bored by having to read more than a few words in someone else's
If you cannot cope with long posts the answer is simple, don't read them.
Meh, why not have a rant? Tbh 6 experiences is 6 too many. And yeah, in the grand scheme of things there are a lot of good dealers & mechanics out there but like with any other trade the bad ones give the good ones a terrible name.
Like you did with number 6 - give them enough rope and if after a gentle prod if they don't figure out what they have to do ramp up your anger. Rinse, repeat.
Like you did with number 6 - give them enough rope and if after a gentle prod if they don't figure out what they have to do ramp up your anger. Rinse, repeat.
The Moose said:
I don't recall the exact details of the other thread, and can't be arsed to find it, however I thought it was talking about buying from a dealer as opposed to servicing by a dealer...
Also, 6 poor experiences dont mean that all who service cars are shiesters. I've had plenty of good experiences, but I also know that not all who service cars are good. Maybe you're just st at choosing them?!
Explain exactly how you are going to tell the difference is service / quality of main dealers when a car is new, and you have not used them before? This is a genuine question for which the answer would be quite useful.Also, 6 poor experiences dont mean that all who service cars are shiesters. I've had plenty of good experiences, but I also know that not all who service cars are good. Maybe you're just s
t at choosing them?!My turn, my turn.
I went to a tyre place once, after a pair of the cheapest tyres they were advertising.
They took my tyres off before telling me they didn't have those ones in stock and convincing me to pay for a more expensive pair.
All tyre dealers are crooks and not to be trusted.
Oh, and it was in 1980, when I was 18. From memory I wanted the cross-ply remoulds for my Austin 1100 and ended up with cross plies.
I went to a tyre place once, after a pair of the cheapest tyres they were advertising.
They took my tyres off before telling me they didn't have those ones in stock and convincing me to pay for a more expensive pair.
All tyre dealers are crooks and not to be trusted.
Oh, and it was in 1980, when I was 18. From memory I wanted the cross-ply remoulds for my Austin 1100 and ended up with cross plies.
The Moose said:
I don't recall the exact details of the other thread, and can't be arsed to find it, however I thought it was talking about buying from a dealer as opposed to servicing by a dealer...
Also, 6 poor experiences dont mean that all who service cars are shiesters. I've had plenty of good experiences, but I also know that not all who service cars are good. Maybe you're just st at choosing them?!
I would love to see your face if you took your car to a main dealer for work, who replaced a major part with a piece of damaged junk from another car, Would you just say hey ho and put it down to (expensive) experience?Also, 6 poor experiences dont mean that all who service cars are shiesters. I've had plenty of good experiences, but I also know that not all who service cars are good. Maybe you're just s
t at choosing them?!Seventy said:
Waiting 30 odd years to have a rant is a very long time to wait. If you'd got it off your chest earlier I'm sure you'd have not wasted so much of your life.
Err. if you check, I think you will find that Piston heads and general gassing wasn't around thirty years ago, In fact I don't even think the internet has been around that long either.So no, I haven't wasted of of my life, thank you.
Pan Pan Pan said:
Like just about all car dealers, MB uses the ploy, that the car you want to trade in, is an absolute piece of worthless sh*t (no matter what it is!) whilst the very same car being sold to someone else a day later (and without having had anything done to it) is a top spec, fully serviced (LOL) piece of automotive treasure.
I wouldn't trust most car dealers words, any further than I could chuck them with both arms tied behind my back.
Can you actually back this up with any real life experience?
It was I that asked for real life experience, but I was more thinking on the lines of the experience you had had with MB and the ploy that he uses. I'd like to know what car you tried to buy and what you tried to trade in?
Like just about all car dealers, MB uses the ploy, that the car you want to trade in, is an absolute piece of worthless sh*t (no matter what it is!) whilst the very same car being sold to someone else a day later (and without having had anything done to it) is a top spec, fully serviced (LOL) piece of automotive treasure.
I wouldn't trust most car dealers words, any further than I could chuck them with both arms tied behind my back.
Can you actually back this up with any real life experience?
It was I that asked for real life experience, but I was more thinking on the lines of the experience you had had with MB and the ploy that he uses. I'd like to know what car you tried to buy and what you tried to trade in?
Pan Pan Pan said:
This post is to put up instances of car dealer dishonesty, and in one case outright theft, that I have personally experienced, for which I was asked and promised I would do.
1. Took a Reliant Scimitar into a dealership for a differential oil seal to be replaced, and was told it would be ready in two days. I contacted them two days later and was told they were having trouble getting the parts. Two days later got the same storey from them, so decided to go there, to check for myself. On arrival my car, was in the workshop minus its rear axle, when I asked why they had taken the axle off to replace the diff nose oil seal, they looked shifty and did not want to give me an answer. Eventually they admitted, that they had repaired my axle and put it on another customers car FFS!. They then tried to fob me off with another (smaller earlier type) axle which may or may not have come from the other customers car, which I refused , as I wanted the same spec axle to be fitted to my car. I insisted they fit the correct axle to my car.
Several days later they told me the car was ready, and they had indeed fitted the correct axle, only this one was from a crashed car, and one of the axle tubes was bent, I left the car there and took them to court over their theft of my axle. They lost, and were required by the court to fit a new axle, but I lost also owing to some of the costs / time issues which were not recoverable.
2. Took a 2 week old XR3 to the dealership (it was the first XR3 they had ever supplied) for its first (1000 mile) courtesy service, and when booking it in, made it clear that the car was my brand new pride and joy, and that I hoped it would be looked after, whilst in the dealers hands. Dealer replied `We treat all our customers cars with the utmost care and respect'
Whilst waiting outside for a lift to work, my car came racing out of the dealers yard with four
`persons' (for persons read yobs in overalls) and screeched to a halt leaving two black tyre marks on the road. They then shot off down the road with the front wheels spinning up enough to create tyre smoke, and again leaving two trails of `my' brand new Pirelli tyres on the road.
I shot back inside and demanded know why my car was being used in that way by four yobs. The dealer said my car was in the workshop, so I asked him to show me. which he could not. He then turned very red, and said he would have words with the workshop manager. I got my car back, and it seemed ok, but I made it clear that any faults that showed up as a result of it its poor treatment, would have to be dealt with entirely at their expense.
3. Took a new jeep to the dealership for its first service, and on returning in the evening to pick it up, paid for the service and then asked where it was, as it was not on the forecourt, or in the workshop. No one there seemed to know where it had gone, and I had visions of it being stolen. Eventually they determined, that it had been parked in a pub car park down the road, because they needed space in the workshop. On getting to the car I found a large dent in the rear wing. I went straight back and confronted the service manager (this was the same man who walked around the vehicle with me that morning, when I dropped it off) who said, Oh yes! (wait for it!) we saw that and wondered if you wanted it repaired!!!!. I pointed out that the dent was not there when I dropped the car off
as we had BOTH examined the car before I left it with them, so the damage was entirely their responsibility. The car was repaired by them, But who would be happy with a having a new car damaged by the dealership which was supposed to look after it.
4. Had a throttle problem with a Scirocco, and dropped the car off at the dealers for the work to be carried out under warranty, on picking the car up, I got no more than 50 yards from the dealers and the problem started again. I went back and asked who had worked on the car, guess what? no one had! they had just started the engine, revved it a few times and could not re create the problem, and because it was warranty work, did no more to it. Took it to another VW dealership who immediately identified a problem with the vacuum advance machanism, and subsequently fixed it.
5. Took my Partners BMW to the dealership we bought it from, for a standard service, and on checking the bill it had an item listed as `special lubricant - doors bonnet and boot' for which they were charging nearly forty pounds. When I asked what the special lubricant was. the service manager said it was a special lubricant for BMW`s, I insisted on knowing what kind of lubricant was so `special' they were charging that amount for lubricating two doors, a bonnet and a boot. and he eventually admitted it was, wait for it! WD40. I asked him if he knew how much a can of WD40 cost, and then why he was charging enough for nearly fifteen cans of the stuff, for which he did not have a sound answer. I refused to pay for that bill item, and because he had been caught out shamelessly inflating the bill, he promised to leave a can of the `special lubricant' in the car next time it came in for work. I never went back there.
6. Took a another new Scirocco for `its' first service, and on inspecting the car when picking it up noticed a dent in the bonnet, and a corresponding dent in the top of the radiator, where a m*ng of a fitter had slammed the bonnet down whilst leaving a socket wrench on top of the radiator, Went straight back into the showroom, where the tt of a service manager tried to make out that it was me who had done the damage, When I asked him why, as the car was just a few weeks old, I would need to be working under the bonnet of a brand new car, he did not have an answer. Fortunately the showroom was full of people looking at new cars, and my patients with f*cking lying dishonest car dealers was all used up, I started shouting at the f*cker, so the dealership director came out and bundled me into a side office, where he agreed to replace the bonnet and radiator, give me a courtesy car, and pay compensation for the event. Which I accepted. I never went back there, and was pleased to see that the dealership had shut down a few months later, I never knew the reason why, but I cold make a guess.
So if you wonder why I believe as a type, a lot (but not all) of car dealers are lying, dishonest, shysters, who would sell their mums if they could make a pound out of it, I hope the above gives you an idea of what brings me to this supposition.
Just in case...1. Took a Reliant Scimitar into a dealership for a differential oil seal to be replaced, and was told it would be ready in two days. I contacted them two days later and was told they were having trouble getting the parts. Two days later got the same storey from them, so decided to go there, to check for myself. On arrival my car, was in the workshop minus its rear axle, when I asked why they had taken the axle off to replace the diff nose oil seal, they looked shifty and did not want to give me an answer. Eventually they admitted, that they had repaired my axle and put it on another customers car FFS!. They then tried to fob me off with another (smaller earlier type) axle which may or may not have come from the other customers car, which I refused , as I wanted the same spec axle to be fitted to my car. I insisted they fit the correct axle to my car.
Several days later they told me the car was ready, and they had indeed fitted the correct axle, only this one was from a crashed car, and one of the axle tubes was bent, I left the car there and took them to court over their theft of my axle. They lost, and were required by the court to fit a new axle, but I lost also owing to some of the costs / time issues which were not recoverable.
2. Took a 2 week old XR3 to the dealership (it was the first XR3 they had ever supplied) for its first (1000 mile) courtesy service, and when booking it in, made it clear that the car was my brand new pride and joy, and that I hoped it would be looked after, whilst in the dealers hands. Dealer replied `We treat all our customers cars with the utmost care and respect'
Whilst waiting outside for a lift to work, my car came racing out of the dealers yard with four
`persons' (for persons read yobs in overalls) and screeched to a halt leaving two black tyre marks on the road. They then shot off down the road with the front wheels spinning up enough to create tyre smoke, and again leaving two trails of `my' brand new Pirelli tyres on the road.
I shot back inside and demanded know why my car was being used in that way by four yobs. The dealer said my car was in the workshop, so I asked him to show me. which he could not. He then turned very red, and said he would have words with the workshop manager. I got my car back, and it seemed ok, but I made it clear that any faults that showed up as a result of it its poor treatment, would have to be dealt with entirely at their expense.
3. Took a new jeep to the dealership for its first service, and on returning in the evening to pick it up, paid for the service and then asked where it was, as it was not on the forecourt, or in the workshop. No one there seemed to know where it had gone, and I had visions of it being stolen. Eventually they determined, that it had been parked in a pub car park down the road, because they needed space in the workshop. On getting to the car I found a large dent in the rear wing. I went straight back and confronted the service manager (this was the same man who walked around the vehicle with me that morning, when I dropped it off) who said, Oh yes! (wait for it!) we saw that and wondered if you wanted it repaired!!!!. I pointed out that the dent was not there when I dropped the car off
as we had BOTH examined the car before I left it with them, so the damage was entirely their responsibility. The car was repaired by them, But who would be happy with a having a new car damaged by the dealership which was supposed to look after it.
4. Had a throttle problem with a Scirocco, and dropped the car off at the dealers for the work to be carried out under warranty, on picking the car up, I got no more than 50 yards from the dealers and the problem started again. I went back and asked who had worked on the car, guess what? no one had! they had just started the engine, revved it a few times and could not re create the problem, and because it was warranty work, did no more to it. Took it to another VW dealership who immediately identified a problem with the vacuum advance machanism, and subsequently fixed it.
5. Took my Partners BMW to the dealership we bought it from, for a standard service, and on checking the bill it had an item listed as `special lubricant - doors bonnet and boot' for which they were charging nearly forty pounds. When I asked what the special lubricant was. the service manager said it was a special lubricant for BMW`s, I insisted on knowing what kind of lubricant was so `special' they were charging that amount for lubricating two doors, a bonnet and a boot. and he eventually admitted it was, wait for it! WD40. I asked him if he knew how much a can of WD40 cost, and then why he was charging enough for nearly fifteen cans of the stuff, for which he did not have a sound answer. I refused to pay for that bill item, and because he had been caught out shamelessly inflating the bill, he promised to leave a can of the `special lubricant' in the car next time it came in for work. I never went back there.
6. Took a another new Scirocco for `its' first service, and on inspecting the car when picking it up noticed a dent in the bonnet, and a corresponding dent in the top of the radiator, where a m*ng of a fitter had slammed the bonnet down whilst leaving a socket wrench on top of the radiator, Went straight back into the showroom, where the t
t of a service manager tried to make out that it was me who had done the damage, When I asked him why, as the car was just a few weeks old, I would need to be working under the bonnet of a brand new car, he did not have an answer. Fortunately the showroom was full of people looking at new cars, and my patients with f*cking lying dishonest car dealers was all used up, I started shouting at the f*cker, so the dealership director came out and bundled me into a side office, where he agreed to replace the bonnet and radiator, give me a courtesy car, and pay compensation for the event. Which I accepted. I never went back there, and was pleased to see that the dealership had shut down a few months later, I never knew the reason why, but I cold make a guess.So if you wonder why I believe as a type, a lot (but not all) of car dealers are lying, dishonest, shysters, who would sell their mums if they could make a pound out of it, I hope the above gives you an idea of what brings me to this supposition.
This could get very interesting.
Pan Pan Pan said:
surveyor said:
Pan Pan Pan said:
Strangely you don't get a service history with a new car.
You do if you take it to a garage....If you did, what would you get?
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