10mph plans for Norwich.
Discussion
Lib Dems!! Coming to a city near you soon. 
14 January 2005 01:30
First it was traffic bans and speed humps that encouraged us to get out of our cars or slow down.
Now radical plans to tackle congestion in Norwich will hand over swathes of the city centre to pedestrians and introduce 10mph speed limits in other central areas.
Norwich City Council's Lib Dem administration is backing the 10-year blueprint as the best way to cut congestion and pollution in the city centre.
But it is set on a collision course with Norfolk County Council, which already disagrees with City Hall's desire to shut off Westlegate to traffic and fears the measures could harm Norwich's status as a regional centre.
Under the draft City Centre Spatial Strategy, cars will be banned from Chapelfield East from 9am to 5pm, Exchange Street and St Peters Street in front of City Hall.
There will be 10mph limits on 33 roads from Tombland to Upper St Giles' and part of the city's kerb-crawling district in Ber Street.
And traffic will be slowed to 20mph in more than 20 places, including Rouen Road, Duke Street, St Stephen's, Prince of Wales Road and Magdalen Street.
Roads will be narrowed and more areas given over to pedestrians as the civic leaders – in keeping with their party's pro-Europe views – want to create a Continental-style city with spaces for street theatre, street cafés and outdoor concerts.
This comes in the same week as it emerged that Visit Norwich – a new group to boost tourism – is drawing up plans for a "landmark" London Eye- style monument to dominate the city skyline.
Judith Lubbock, the city council's Lib Dem transport spokeswoman, said the moves were part of a long-term view and would not happen at once.
"We don't feel that the future is really the motor car driving at 30mph through the city," she said. "If we could get speeds down and restrict access, it would make it a really first class environment for people to get around in.
"We will be showing off Norwich at its best and encouraging more people to visit."
City Hall wants to encourage developers to fund some of the changes to the landscape. Similar means have been used to pay for the changes taking place around St Stephen's and Red Lion Street to improve bus links.
But Adrian Gunson, the Conservative-run county council's Cabinet member for transport and planning, said it was unlikely his authority, which is responsible for roads, would dip its hand in its pocket.
"Where on earth the money is coming from I do not know," he said. "Some of it goes beyond what is reasonable or practical if we want Norwich to remain a major commercial and retail centre.
"It will increase congestion and there will be an adverse effect on pollution,"
Such schemes were only viable with the creation of a Norwich northern bypass, he added.
"I think this is far too all-embracing – what access roads to the city centre will be left as normal roads? I don't know of many cities that have got speed limits of 10 or 20mph – certainly not one that's a regional centre. It will make it very difficult for people to get in and out of Norwich."
The strategy first surfaced in October as part of a £5m plan to upgrade buildings, and councillors agreed to put it out to public consultation. The city council sent 200 copies of the document to 120 "key organisations".
An article also pops up on page 18 of the winter edition of the council's Citizen magazine. There is no mention of 10mph speed limits or road closures but lots of talk about "street furniture" and "open spaces".
This raises question marks about why a public consultation, due to end tomorrow, failed to mention directly the speed cuts and the scope of the traffic measures.
Mrs Lubbock admitted the early emphasis had been on improving public spaces but said the issue went hand in hand with traffic control.
link
14 January 2005 01:30
First it was traffic bans and speed humps that encouraged us to get out of our cars or slow down.
Now radical plans to tackle congestion in Norwich will hand over swathes of the city centre to pedestrians and introduce 10mph speed limits in other central areas.
Norwich City Council's Lib Dem administration is backing the 10-year blueprint as the best way to cut congestion and pollution in the city centre.
But it is set on a collision course with Norfolk County Council, which already disagrees with City Hall's desire to shut off Westlegate to traffic and fears the measures could harm Norwich's status as a regional centre.
Under the draft City Centre Spatial Strategy, cars will be banned from Chapelfield East from 9am to 5pm, Exchange Street and St Peters Street in front of City Hall.
There will be 10mph limits on 33 roads from Tombland to Upper St Giles' and part of the city's kerb-crawling district in Ber Street.
And traffic will be slowed to 20mph in more than 20 places, including Rouen Road, Duke Street, St Stephen's, Prince of Wales Road and Magdalen Street.
Roads will be narrowed and more areas given over to pedestrians as the civic leaders – in keeping with their party's pro-Europe views – want to create a Continental-style city with spaces for street theatre, street cafés and outdoor concerts.
This comes in the same week as it emerged that Visit Norwich – a new group to boost tourism – is drawing up plans for a "landmark" London Eye- style monument to dominate the city skyline.
Judith Lubbock, the city council's Lib Dem transport spokeswoman, said the moves were part of a long-term view and would not happen at once.
"We don't feel that the future is really the motor car driving at 30mph through the city," she said. "If we could get speeds down and restrict access, it would make it a really first class environment for people to get around in.
"We will be showing off Norwich at its best and encouraging more people to visit."
City Hall wants to encourage developers to fund some of the changes to the landscape. Similar means have been used to pay for the changes taking place around St Stephen's and Red Lion Street to improve bus links.
But Adrian Gunson, the Conservative-run county council's Cabinet member for transport and planning, said it was unlikely his authority, which is responsible for roads, would dip its hand in its pocket.
"Where on earth the money is coming from I do not know," he said. "Some of it goes beyond what is reasonable or practical if we want Norwich to remain a major commercial and retail centre.
"It will increase congestion and there will be an adverse effect on pollution,"
Such schemes were only viable with the creation of a Norwich northern bypass, he added.
"I think this is far too all-embracing – what access roads to the city centre will be left as normal roads? I don't know of many cities that have got speed limits of 10 or 20mph – certainly not one that's a regional centre. It will make it very difficult for people to get in and out of Norwich."
The strategy first surfaced in October as part of a £5m plan to upgrade buildings, and councillors agreed to put it out to public consultation. The city council sent 200 copies of the document to 120 "key organisations".
An article also pops up on page 18 of the winter edition of the council's Citizen magazine. There is no mention of 10mph speed limits or road closures but lots of talk about "street furniture" and "open spaces".
This raises question marks about why a public consultation, due to end tomorrow, failed to mention directly the speed cuts and the scope of the traffic measures.
Mrs Lubbock admitted the early emphasis had been on improving public spaces but said the issue went hand in hand with traffic control.
link
C C said:
There will be 10mph limits on 33 roads from Tombland to Upper St Giles' and part of the city's kerb-crawling district in Ber Street.
Sheer genius!! "No officer, I wasn't kerb crawling, I was keeping to the speed limit and had time to look at the pretty ladies as my speed was so low"
C C said:More nonsense from the Lib Demons. Why don't these cretins realise that outdoor urban air is already cleaner than the indoor air in our homes in the UK, and that to make it better they should ban diesel engined buses...car hatred pure and simple in sympathy with the Federal European Union of Socialist Anti-car States.
Lib Dems!! Coming to a city near you soon.
mutt k said:
There will be 10mph limits on 33 roads from Tombland to Upper St Giles' and part of the city's kerb-crawling district in Ber Street.
Sheer genius!! "No officer, I wasn't kerb crawling, I was keeping to the speed limit and had time to look at the pretty ladies as my speed was so low"
“pretty ladies”...
Been to Norwich recently??
C C said:
C C said:
There will be 10mph limits on 33 roads from Tombland to Upper St Giles' and part of the city's kerb-crawling district in Ber Street.
Sheer genius!! "No officer, I wasn't kerb crawling, I was keeping to the speed limit and had time to look at the pretty ladies as my speed was so low"
“pretty ladies”...
Been to Norwich recently??
"Sorry officer, I'm must have been driving with my beer glasses on"
[And no I am not condoning drink driving!]
I am stunned...you should see the f
g mess they have made of Norwich already.
You cant go more than 50 metres in any direction without being met by a set of traffic lights / pedestrian crossing / roundabout / speed humps / 20 mph zone / width restriction / and any money wasting traffic calming measure they can waste a bit more budget on...
In my opinion they are going to do nothing more than scare any potential investment away from the area. Theres a huge amount of development been ongoing in Norwich for several years now - it seems that these lental morons want to put a complete stop to any chance of the area becoming prosperous...
Now, wheres that estate agency site I was looking at....
g mess they have made of Norwich already. You cant go more than 50 metres in any direction without being met by a set of traffic lights / pedestrian crossing / roundabout / speed humps / 20 mph zone / width restriction / and any money wasting traffic calming measure they can waste a bit more budget on...
In my opinion they are going to do nothing more than scare any potential investment away from the area. Theres a huge amount of development been ongoing in Norwich for several years now - it seems that these lental morons want to put a complete stop to any chance of the area becoming prosperous...
Now, wheres that estate agency site I was looking at....
C C said:
Now radical plans to tackle congestion in Norwich will hand over swathes of the city centre to pedestrians and introduce 10mph speed limits in other central areas.
Norwich City Council's Lib Dem administration is backing the 10-year blueprint as the best way to cut congestion and pollution in the city centre.
Presumably they're worried about pollution caused by congestion, i.e. fumes from slow-moving vehicles not operating efficiently?
So how on earth is creating a "virtual" traffic jam of 10mph traffic going to change anything? If they want to cut pollution, slap in a ring road with a mandatory 50mph minimum limit!
C C said:
Judith Lubbock, the city council's Lib Dem transport spokeswoman, said the moves were part of a long-term view and would not happen at once.
"We don't feel that the future is really the motor car driving at 30mph through the city," she said. "If we could get speeds down and restrict access, it would make it a really first class environment for people to get around in.
"We will be showing off Norwich at its best and encouraging more people to visit."
How will people enjoy their visit if they are forced down cramped narrow streets at a snails pace, by the time they arrive it'll be time to leave again.
I hate this woman with every atom in my body.
How can they encourage people to visit when they don't want cars there? I pity the poor people of Norwich when they find out how much this folly is going to cost.
Perhaps we should have a 10MPH convoy in Norwich to demonstrate the reality to the residents. Bring the city to a grinding halt and wake the council up to the reality
Perhaps we should have a 10MPH convoy in Norwich to demonstrate the reality to the residents. Bring the city to a grinding halt and wake the council up to the reality
selmer said:
Create a continental-style city.
Fair enough, let's have some continental style public transport system which means you don't have to park your car 3 miles away and hang around for some shitty park&ride bus.
Last year the city council wanted to “REVAMP” Norwich’s historic covered marked with some sort Disney style hexagon stalls.
Fortunately public opinion and stall-holders managed to put a stop to it.
Lib Dem numpties said:
And people with red flags will have to walk in front of all cars, which will not be allowed to exceed 4mph. Or the driver, occupants and anyone else we feel worthy will be stoned to death. This will move our transport policy, forward, not backward, sideways and always twirling, twirling!!!
Well my speedometer doesn't start until 15 mph and doesn't reliably record speed till about 30 mph so unless I get out and push I can't see how this ridiculous measure is in any way enforceable.
Why is it that they complain about more and more cars on the roads, then see the solution is restricting where you can drive, filling free-flowing routes with slaloms, slowing everything down to walking pace, prioritising the few on the double-decker clatterbox and taking all the parking spaces away? Congestion? They bring it on themselves...
Why is it that they complain about more and more cars on the roads, then see the solution is restricting where you can drive, filling free-flowing routes with slaloms, slowing everything down to walking pace, prioritising the few on the double-decker clatterbox and taking all the parking spaces away? Congestion? They bring it on themselves...
Has anyone ever tried to drive at 10mph?
I have (see this thread) and it is bloody hard, I can tell you.
To save you trawling through the thread....
I have (see this thread) and it is bloody hard, I can tell you.
To save you trawling through the thread....
JonRB said:
I left the office at 17:45 today and tried to drive at 10mph for the whole time I was on-site.
It was a little difficult as the Corrado's speedo actually starts at 10mph, but I managed to creep along with the needle lifting just off the end-stop, so that was probably about 10mph.
By the time I had left the car part I had an impatient MPV driver up my chuff, about 20m later I had a nice little queue of cars behind me and the MPV driver was starting to lunge at me to get me to go faster and was looking at me as if I had grown an extra head or so, and by the time I got to the entrance / exit of the site I had a queue of about 10 or more extremely irritated drivers behind me.
The moment I passed the security gates to turn onto public roads I dialed in some revs, dropped the clutch and disappeared in a cloud of tyre smoke. MWUHAHAHAHAHAHHAAAAA!
Petty, but satisfying.
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