Discussion
I know the Lucas does/can runs the fuel side of things exceedingly well but ......... Joolz, top bloke or what,,,
Richard why The MBE ?
Ok I've just got some good info, the MBE system is as good as any, others do map it,
No reason not to go for MBE,
I was thinking emerald just so Joolz can map it but even he thinks the MBE is a good unit and used in hundreds of Vauxhalls for instance.
It is type approved also, Dom knows his stuff so I might just go MBE myself.
I'm also all ears on this thread so any other people with real life experience of the MBE on an RV engine would be good.
Richard why The MBE ?
Ok I've just got some good info, the MBE system is as good as any, others do map it,
No reason not to go for MBE,
I was thinking emerald just so Joolz can map it but even he thinks the MBE is a good unit and used in hundreds of Vauxhalls for instance.
It is type approved also, Dom knows his stuff so I might just go MBE myself.
I'm also all ears on this thread so any other people with real life experience of the MBE on an RV engine would be good.
Hi All,
Thanks for the comments so far.
Alun, I'm inclined to stick with Dom at present as he knows my car & engine well (during previous ownership) and as I would like some more general thoughts / input on mechanicals I believe he has the most practical experience & knowledge of the Rotrex supercharged RV8 installation. This then potentially leads me onto the MBE system, which if it is as good as any other the idea of tying up a couple of items together makes financial sense in my circumstances (anyone with their own business may know what I mean).
I may have no need to actually change anything (still soldiering on and waving the flag !), and have no preference for any alternative engine management system out there, just seems to make sense to explore the option at the moment.
Any more thoughts or experiences would be most welcome
Thanks for the comments so far.
Alun, I'm inclined to stick with Dom at present as he knows my car & engine well (during previous ownership) and as I would like some more general thoughts / input on mechanicals I believe he has the most practical experience & knowledge of the Rotrex supercharged RV8 installation. This then potentially leads me onto the MBE system, which if it is as good as any other the idea of tying up a couple of items together makes financial sense in my circumstances (anyone with their own business may know what I mean).
I may have no need to actually change anything (still soldiering on and waving the flag !), and have no preference for any alternative engine management system out there, just seems to make sense to explore the option at the moment.
Any more thoughts or experiences would be most welcome
I'm now convinced the MBE is a good bit of kit,
I like continuity and Doms done all the work on my car so as I want riggers and service done it makes sence to have the MBE installed at the same time,,, another small fortune but the car will be sound for years to come,,
Goodluck Richard,, self employed, cash flow , Tell me about it Richard, pita.
I like continuity and Doms done all the work on my car so as I want riggers and service done it makes sence to have the MBE installed at the same time,,, another small fortune but the car will be sound for years to come,,
Goodluck Richard,, self employed, cash flow , Tell me about it Richard, pita.
I do not have any experience with the MBE but I have done quite a bit of research on ECUs and spoken to a numbers of owners and professionals.
As most people will know I am a big supporter of the 14CUX, it is a very capable system and sophisticated for it's time. I think for most owners it is certainly worth sticking with this system and for those how want a little extra then I can personally recommend the services of Mark Adams at Tornado systems to remap your car on the rolling road. Mark Adams combined with a few goodies from ACT you will have a very capable and compliant car with good drivability and more performance. I have most of the ACT mods mapped by Mark the end result is fantastic.
However for those of us who like to modify beyond the well known bolt on mods I think aftermarket is the way forward, the 14CUX is very accurate on the fueling side of things but it does lack mappable ignition. I have decided upon an MBE system from TVR Power for my car hopefully to be fitted this winter if funds allow, the reason for this I am looking down the route of John Eales ITBs which will not run on the 14CUX. The reason I am going for an MBE ECU is because I want a fully type approved system designed for a road car, what I do not want is an ECU designed for race applications as from other peoples experience I know passing emissions for MOTs can be challenging and sometimes race ECUs are difficult to map to be compliant for normal road driving where you want a car to behave in traffic etc. I also like the fact the MBE systems have been selected by Noble and Caterham for their road cars, no doubt they have done their research. I also like the fact the MBE as an OBDII interface and uses standard DTCs which can be read with a standard code reader - handy if you need to troubleshoot as with other ECUs the only way you can diagnose is a laptop often with USB to RS323 adapter and the ECU software loaded on. Dom has showed me one of the looms they have the new MBE systems and it looks very well made, one of the big plus points for me on TVR Power is they both install and map the system so they are ultimately responsible for the end result, with many of the other systems 1 person installs it and then another maps it so if you don't get the right result there is possibility the blame will be passed around.
I will be paying extra for the MBE9A9 version with Power fit to the Cerbera as it has dual wideband lambda support and various other options which I will probably never use but always good to have the option. With regards to Jason at TVR Power he is one the most talented mappers in the UK so more than happy to go with him. There are plenty of other mappers who can map MBE so you are not tied into TVR Power for mapping, although I wouldn't personally go anywhere else it is always good to know you have options.
If you want to speak to someone who has an MBE ECU installed by TVR Power on an RV8 car drop Hoover a line, very nice fellow and I am sure he would be more than happy to discuss his experiences:
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/profile.asp?mem...
As most people will know I am a big supporter of the 14CUX, it is a very capable system and sophisticated for it's time. I think for most owners it is certainly worth sticking with this system and for those how want a little extra then I can personally recommend the services of Mark Adams at Tornado systems to remap your car on the rolling road. Mark Adams combined with a few goodies from ACT you will have a very capable and compliant car with good drivability and more performance. I have most of the ACT mods mapped by Mark the end result is fantastic.
However for those of us who like to modify beyond the well known bolt on mods I think aftermarket is the way forward, the 14CUX is very accurate on the fueling side of things but it does lack mappable ignition. I have decided upon an MBE system from TVR Power for my car hopefully to be fitted this winter if funds allow, the reason for this I am looking down the route of John Eales ITBs which will not run on the 14CUX. The reason I am going for an MBE ECU is because I want a fully type approved system designed for a road car, what I do not want is an ECU designed for race applications as from other peoples experience I know passing emissions for MOTs can be challenging and sometimes race ECUs are difficult to map to be compliant for normal road driving where you want a car to behave in traffic etc. I also like the fact the MBE systems have been selected by Noble and Caterham for their road cars, no doubt they have done their research. I also like the fact the MBE as an OBDII interface and uses standard DTCs which can be read with a standard code reader - handy if you need to troubleshoot as with other ECUs the only way you can diagnose is a laptop often with USB to RS323 adapter and the ECU software loaded on. Dom has showed me one of the looms they have the new MBE systems and it looks very well made, one of the big plus points for me on TVR Power is they both install and map the system so they are ultimately responsible for the end result, with many of the other systems 1 person installs it and then another maps it so if you don't get the right result there is possibility the blame will be passed around.
I will be paying extra for the MBE9A9 version with Power fit to the Cerbera as it has dual wideband lambda support and various other options which I will probably never use but always good to have the option. With regards to Jason at TVR Power he is one the most talented mappers in the UK so more than happy to go with him. There are plenty of other mappers who can map MBE so you are not tied into TVR Power for mapping, although I wouldn't personally go anywhere else it is always good to know you have options.
If you want to speak to someone who has an MBE ECU installed by TVR Power on an RV8 car drop Hoover a line, very nice fellow and I am sure he would be more than happy to discuss his experiences:
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/profile.asp?mem...
Given you've had MA sort the fuelling on the 14CUX and given it is now pretty much open source for other players, would it not make more sense to just add a mappable standalone ignition module like an Omex and go wasted spark? Wouldn't be too quick to fix things that aren't bust but definitely a good move to ditch the distributor.
Knew you'd come 'round
Knew you'd come 'round
Thanks again for your thoughts and replies Matt & Gary. I have been thinking long and hard about this matter and have strongly considered a stand alone ignition only Omex or similar. As mentioned earlier I am also a big fan of sticking with the 14CUX but if I do change part of the management system I am conscious that the Lucas system is now a fairly old system that was not designed (as far as I know) to cope with what I am expecting of it in both fuelling and ignition.
I am hoping to utilise more of my cars potential next year and will hopefully soon have the budget to improve things further and may also need some mechanical improvements which are beyond my skill set so will try to tie a few things up together.
Glad you had a good trip to Le Mans & back Gary and sorry I didn't get chance to chat to you at Bedford Matt, maybe next time !
I am hoping to utilise more of my cars potential next year and will hopefully soon have the budget to improve things further and may also need some mechanical improvements which are beyond my skill set so will try to tie a few things up together.
Glad you had a good trip to Le Mans & back Gary and sorry I didn't get chance to chat to you at Bedford Matt, maybe next time !
Hi Richard, yes sorry I missed you, I had no idea you were at Bedford, were you there in the Chim?
I also thought long and hard about the OMEX200 stand alone ignition unit and I know a couple of people who have this and are very pleased with it. It is certainly a great solution if you want to keep the 14CUX.
The issue for me is that my existing rover loom has proved to be a bit unreliable over the years and has failed 2 times already, both resulting in a breakdown and both requiring many hours of labour to fix. If I am going to replace the loom I am kind of thinking I may as well swap out the ECU as well. I am not keen on the idea of splicing yet another ECU into my loom and I am not completely sold on the idea of having two ECUs to map.
If you do really want to keep the 14CUX John Eales does a modern loom for it and could probably build one to incorporate the OMEX. I believe the standard TVR one had a load of Range Rover stuff on it which is not required on a TVR. The JE one looks very simple which is what you want:
http://www.johnealesroverv8.co.uk/25.html
I also thought long and hard about the OMEX200 stand alone ignition unit and I know a couple of people who have this and are very pleased with it. It is certainly a great solution if you want to keep the 14CUX.
The issue for me is that my existing rover loom has proved to be a bit unreliable over the years and has failed 2 times already, both resulting in a breakdown and both requiring many hours of labour to fix. If I am going to replace the loom I am kind of thinking I may as well swap out the ECU as well. I am not keen on the idea of splicing yet another ECU into my loom and I am not completely sold on the idea of having two ECUs to map.
If you do really want to keep the 14CUX John Eales does a modern loom for it and could probably build one to incorporate the OMEX. I believe the standard TVR one had a load of Range Rover stuff on it which is not required on a TVR. The JE one looks very simple which is what you want:
http://www.johnealesroverv8.co.uk/25.html
Pupp said:
Given you've had MA sort the fuelling on the 14CUX and given it is now pretty much open source for other players, would it not make more sense to just add a mappable standalone ignition module like an Omex and go wasted spark? Wouldn't be too quick to fix things that aren't bust but definitely a good move to ditch the distributor.
Knew you'd come 'round
I run my 14 CUX WITH AN OMEX 200 works very well for me.Knew you'd come 'round
MPoxon said:
Hi Richard, yes sorry I missed you, I had no idea you were at Bedford, were you there in the Chim?
I also thought long and hard about the OMEX200 stand alone ignition unit and I know a couple of people who have this and are very pleased with it. It is certainly a great solution if you want to keep the 14CUX.
The issue for me is that my existing rover loom has proved to be a bit unreliable over the years and has failed 2 times already, both resulting in a breakdown and both requiring many hours of labour to fix. If I am going to replace the loom I am kind of thinking I may as well swap out the ECU as well. I am not keen on the idea of splicing yet another ECU into my loom and I am not completely sold on the idea of having two ECUs to map.
If you do really want to keep the 14CUX John Eales does a modern loom for it and could probably build one to incorporate the OMEX. I believe the standard TVR one had a load of Range Rover stuff on it which is not required on a TVR. The JE one looks very simple which is what you want:
http://www.johnealesroverv8.co.uk/25.html
I was in my Chimaera but parked in the car park adjacent to the car trailers & transporters, only came to spectate for a couple of hours as I'm only 20 minutes or so from Bedford. Thanks for the thoughts (and yours Bluebottle), it seems as though our thought proccesses are very similar. I'd rather also ditch the AFM if I'm going to change so that would make my decision I think.I also thought long and hard about the OMEX200 stand alone ignition unit and I know a couple of people who have this and are very pleased with it. It is certainly a great solution if you want to keep the 14CUX.
The issue for me is that my existing rover loom has proved to be a bit unreliable over the years and has failed 2 times already, both resulting in a breakdown and both requiring many hours of labour to fix. If I am going to replace the loom I am kind of thinking I may as well swap out the ECU as well. I am not keen on the idea of splicing yet another ECU into my loom and I am not completely sold on the idea of having two ECUs to map.
If you do really want to keep the 14CUX John Eales does a modern loom for it and could probably build one to incorporate the OMEX. I believe the standard TVR one had a load of Range Rover stuff on it which is not required on a TVR. The JE one looks very simple which is what you want:
http://www.johnealesroverv8.co.uk/25.html
Hi Richard, we had our car converted to MBE when Dom rebuilt the engine around the supercharger late last year. We went with the bigger 9A9 MBE as it had the capability of running the water injection thus saving a lot of money on a stand alone water injection controller. It also gave us knock sensing. Jason made us a new loom and did all the mapping and I'm very happy with it. The engine is smooth, reliable, powerful (about 425bhp), economical on a run (100 miles on less than one third of a tank on a motorway) and has a lovely tickover and perfect control of it's own temperature via the driver for the fans. Despite not having an intercooler there's never been any hint of pinking, the road manners are impeccable as the car is just as happy doing 20-30mph through towns as it is when blasting along A roads and so far it's never missed a beat. The only side which could be improved is the cold start (in our map, not the MBE generally) but to be fair we've not let Jason have the car back to work on as we wanted to get our touring season underway. The cold start isn't too bad though, a touch of throttle is all it takes. All in all highly recommended for an SC Chim (ours is a 4.6) and Jason is a nice bloke to boot.
I spoke with Jason the other week and I'm going for the MBE and new loom.
I live about twenty mins away from Powers so it makes sence.
After driving Peters 5.5,,,, if I can get close to 300bhp and a good torque figure from my 4.6 then I'll be happy, I'd need to re think the whole top end to get better power so I think I'm going for reliability and a good solid motor to start with.
Getting the chassis, shocks, and brakes upto spec will offer me far more time!
Goodluck with it Richard....
I live about twenty mins away from Powers so it makes sence.
After driving Peters 5.5,,,, if I can get close to 300bhp and a good torque figure from my 4.6 then I'll be happy, I'd need to re think the whole top end to get better power so I think I'm going for reliability and a good solid motor to start with.
Getting the chassis, shocks, and brakes upto spec will offer me far more time!
Goodluck with it Richard....
I spoke with Jason the other week and I'm going for the MBE and new loom.
I live about twenty mins away from Powers so it makes sence.
After driving Peters 5.5,,,, if I can get close to 300bhp and a good torque figure from my 4.6 then I'll be happy, I'd need to re think the whole top end to get better power so I think I'm going for reliability and a good solid motor to start with.
Getting the chassis, shocks, and brakes upto spec will offer me far more time!
Goodluck with it Richard....
I live about twenty mins away from Powers so it makes sence.
After driving Peters 5.5,,,, if I can get close to 300bhp and a good torque figure from my 4.6 then I'll be happy, I'd need to re think the whole top end to get better power so I think I'm going for reliability and a good solid motor to start with.
Getting the chassis, shocks, and brakes upto spec will offer me far more time!
Goodluck with it Richard....
Gassing Station | Chimaera | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff