Charged with driving without due care, need advice!!
Discussion
Hi all,
Pretty new to the PH forum but often browsing the classifieds!!
Anyway, recently I was charged for driving without due care and attention, which I think was completely unfair and unjustified.
So what happened. I was towing (legally) a big generator behind a Landrover D4, when I turned in to a small round about at no more that 10mph, as I came round the corner the generator and trailer tipped over on the the pavement. I was going so slowly that I was stationary by the time it hit the floor. No one else was involved and no one was around to witness. We called a recovery company who arrived 40 mins after the accident, they informed me that a police unit was on the way as they needed to briefly close the road as they craned the genny on to their low loader. The recovery lads started prepping the scene and unleashed the genny from the trailer, the ratchet straps were cut so the trailer was now free, car and trailer were driven round the corner and the genny remained off the road. An hour after the initial incident the cops turned up. Firstly he said that I would have been towing over the weight limit (he hadn't seen what car I was towing with at this point) once we established that it was all within the law, he then tried to charge me with towing an unsafe load, which when we showed him that the trailer and genny were firmly connected together, he then decided to charge me with due care. Surely as he arrived an hour after the incident with no evidence of how I was driving at all he hasn't got any grounds to charge me?
What do I do now? I sure as hell don't want the 3 points and fixed penalty, will it have to go to court? Or will a carefully written letter make them think twice about it? I'm sure if some one at the station looked in to this they would see they haven't sufficient eveidence to successfully charge me. And if I did end up going to court it's going to cost both me and them. Any help would be greatly appreciated, and if anyone has the linguistic skills to help out with a letter that would be much appreciated.
regards Rob
Pretty new to the PH forum but often browsing the classifieds!!
Anyway, recently I was charged for driving without due care and attention, which I think was completely unfair and unjustified.
So what happened. I was towing (legally) a big generator behind a Landrover D4, when I turned in to a small round about at no more that 10mph, as I came round the corner the generator and trailer tipped over on the the pavement. I was going so slowly that I was stationary by the time it hit the floor. No one else was involved and no one was around to witness. We called a recovery company who arrived 40 mins after the accident, they informed me that a police unit was on the way as they needed to briefly close the road as they craned the genny on to their low loader. The recovery lads started prepping the scene and unleashed the genny from the trailer, the ratchet straps were cut so the trailer was now free, car and trailer were driven round the corner and the genny remained off the road. An hour after the initial incident the cops turned up. Firstly he said that I would have been towing over the weight limit (he hadn't seen what car I was towing with at this point) once we established that it was all within the law, he then tried to charge me with towing an unsafe load, which when we showed him that the trailer and genny were firmly connected together, he then decided to charge me with due care. Surely as he arrived an hour after the incident with no evidence of how I was driving at all he hasn't got any grounds to charge me?
What do I do now? I sure as hell don't want the 3 points and fixed penalty, will it have to go to court? Or will a carefully written letter make them think twice about it? I'm sure if some one at the station looked in to this they would see they haven't sufficient eveidence to successfully charge me. And if I did end up going to court it's going to cost both me and them. Any help would be greatly appreciated, and if anyone has the linguistic skills to help out with a letter that would be much appreciated.
regards Rob
Merrix said:
Surely as he arrived an hour after the incident with no evidence of how I was driving at all he hasn't got any grounds to charge me?
You were going round a roundabout, carefully and with all due care, when your trailer just happened to trip over its own feet and have a little lie down on the pavement, requiring the road to be closed so the load could be cut off the trailer and craned onto the recovery low-loader...Basic physics says that either the load was massively top-heavy or there was some fairly substantial contribution from centrifugal force involved.
So... take your pick. Unsafe load or driving like a muppet. Could always be "both", but "neither" seems somewhat unlikely, don'cha think...?
If you're being offered an FPN, you've got a choice. You can accept it, effectively pleading guilty. Or you can turn it down, and opt for court - where you plead not guilty, and explain the circumstances to the nice magistrate. Good luck with that...
Just be bloody thankful there wasn't a pedestrian in the way.
I'm with everyone else. Either the load was too top heavy and should have been counterweighted, wasn't secured adequately, or you were going too fast. TBH, 10 mph is not fast, so I wonder what would have happened if you had been travelling on a straight line at 30mph, and had to swerve. Probably would have taken your Landrover with it! So I think it's justified to charge you. Sorry - not what you wanted to hear!
sherbertdip said:
I would have thought by the very fact that your load turned over you were going too fast for the roundabout hence driving without due care and attention.
Should you not think you've got off lightly in so much as there weren't any pedestrians squashed?
It doesn't always work like that, slower can often be worse than fast depending on circumstances, type of trailer, road and a few other factors that we are all unaware of except the OP. The problem is that the police often like to stick you on for anything they can find instead of saying we have no evidence as to what occurred but sShould you not think you've got off lightly in so much as there weren't any pedestrians squashed?
t happens lesson learned.jagracer said:
t doesn't always work like that, slower can often be worse than fast depending on circumstances, type of trailer, road and a few other factors that we are all unaware of except the OP. The problem is that the police often like to stick you on for anything they can find instead of saying we have no evidence as to what occurred but st happens lesson learned.
So, IYHO, it's perfectly possible for a correctly loaded trailer to just have a little lie-down on the pavement through absolutely no fault whatsoever of the careful and responsible driver who was bimbling around the roundabout at not much more than a jogging pace?t happens lesson learned.Would you care to explain in a bit more detail, because I have to admit that I'm struggling to understand how...
If it is as you say then just opt for the court hearing as it is up to them to prove guilt.
It would probably be dropped before the court date as many of these types of cases are from what I have read.
A solicitor should be your first stop though.
It would probably be dropped before the court date as many of these types of cases are from what I have read.
A solicitor should be your first stop though.
Edited by NoNeed on Saturday 13th June 20:20
ruggedscotty said:
Fraid that you are guilty as charged your load was unsafe - just need to accept it Im afraid.....
As they say if you were pulling this and you had to swerve or the like it would very likely have toppled you.
Then he wasn't guilty as charged was he otherwise the charge would be one for an unsafe load.As they say if you were pulling this and you had to swerve or the like it would very likely have toppled you.
TooMany2cvs said:
So, IYHO, it's perfectly possible for a correctly loaded trailer to just have a little lie-down on the pavement through absolutely no fault whatsoever of the careful and responsible driver who was bimbling around the roundabout at not much more than a jogging pace?
Would you care to explain in a bit more detail, because I have to admit that I'm struggling to understand how...
Nope, read my post as I didn't say that, I said that it's possible for a trailer to roll over at slow speed when turning, I don't know any of the factors in the OPs case.Would you care to explain in a bit more detail, because I have to admit that I'm struggling to understand how...
Where does simple human error come into play? I'm thinking about all of the accidents I've seen over the years on tv - on many occasion the police have taken no further action even although human error has been the cause? At what point does an officer decide that driving without due care and attention is the most obvious course of action?
jagracer said:
TooMany2cvs said:
So, IYHO, it's perfectly possible for a correctly loaded trailer to just have a little lie-down on the pavement through absolutely no fault whatsoever of the careful and responsible driver who was bimbling around the roundabout at not much more than a jogging pace?
Would you care to explain in a bit more detail, because I have to admit that I'm struggling to understand how...
Nope, read my post as I didn't say that, I said that it's possible for a trailer to roll over at slow speed when turning...Would you care to explain in a bit more detail, because I have to admit that I'm struggling to understand how...
As the generator needed to be cut free from the trailer I don't see insecure load. Unless it had slid to one side despite any restraints causing the tipping - you may find this of interest: http://www.soe.org.uk/discussion-forum/thread/?thr...
That the trailer & contents ended up on its side suggests that you were travelling at too high a speed for the road conditions or for the manoeuvre you were making. Hence the DWDC&A.
His time of arrival is irrelevant.
If you disagree with being reported for DWDC&A then opt for a court appearance & plead NG. Worth taking advice from a solicitor that specialises in Road traffic matters.
ETA Consideration could also have been given to using the trailer in a dangerous condition if the way it was loaded was such as to make it unstable.
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1988/52/part/I...
Could have been an interesting investigation had anyone else been involved.
That the trailer & contents ended up on its side suggests that you were travelling at too high a speed for the road conditions or for the manoeuvre you were making. Hence the DWDC&A.
His time of arrival is irrelevant.
If you disagree with being reported for DWDC&A then opt for a court appearance & plead NG. Worth taking advice from a solicitor that specialises in Road traffic matters.
ETA Consideration could also have been given to using the trailer in a dangerous condition if the way it was loaded was such as to make it unstable.
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1988/52/part/I...
Could have been an interesting investigation had anyone else been involved.
Edited by paintman on Saturday 13th June 23:34
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