New member with a few questions - Ignition System
Discussion
Afternoon all,
I have been a lurking in the background of the PH forums for many years and the info and advice has been invaluable in keeping my pride and joys on the road.
I've recently purchased a lovely Chimaera 500, i say recently it was last summer but apart from a blast to the Nurburgring I didn't really have much time to enjoy it last year. The car has been stored from September 2014 when the MOT ran out until now and I am going through the process of recommissioning so that I can try to grab a few trips before summer is over again.
I've got a list of jobs that need doing and have searched through the discussions on here picking out the info I need on varies task so thank you all for that its been very useful. I do have a question around the ignition system of the car that that I wondered if you would mind pointing me the right direction.
Id like to beef up the starting components. Are there any suggestions for upgraded parts that will give the big lump the kick it needs. Is there an upgraded starter or coil I could buy for instance.
Any help on this would be much appreciated.
Andy
I have been a lurking in the background of the PH forums for many years and the info and advice has been invaluable in keeping my pride and joys on the road.
I've recently purchased a lovely Chimaera 500, i say recently it was last summer but apart from a blast to the Nurburgring I didn't really have much time to enjoy it last year. The car has been stored from September 2014 when the MOT ran out until now and I am going through the process of recommissioning so that I can try to grab a few trips before summer is over again.
I've got a list of jobs that need doing and have searched through the discussions on here picking out the info I need on varies task so thank you all for that its been very useful. I do have a question around the ignition system of the car that that I wondered if you would mind pointing me the right direction.
Id like to beef up the starting components. Are there any suggestions for upgraded parts that will give the big lump the kick it needs. Is there an upgraded starter or coil I could buy for instance.
Any help on this would be much appreciated.
Andy
Edited by alfaandy81 on Sunday 21st June 15:11
Edited by alfaandy81 on Sunday 21st June 15:27
Obviously a new starter will be better than an old one, BUT.....
The usual problem with these cars is that the main thick cable from the battery to the starter passes over a very hot clutch bell housing and so gets regularly fryings, which turns it brittle and increases its resistance. So the first thing to do is get this cable replaced with a new length. Don't just remove it and then try desperately to make the new one follow the same path. Instead, tie a piece of string firmly to one end, pull on the other end, and let the string follow the cable you are removing, so that it is there to pull the new cable through.
My car was never a bad starter, but recently I had my battery moved to the boot and changed for a gel type battery:
My genius of a TVR guy, rather than put in a length of cable back to the passenger footwell area, instead fed the new live cable from the + terminal of the new battery, straight down to the chassis rail and ran it along the driver's side chassis rail straight to the starter. The old "battery to starter" cable then became the main feed to everything else, by using the over-the-clutch cable in reverse. Simples. My battery now turns over the starter like a whirling dervish.
The usual problem with these cars is that the main thick cable from the battery to the starter passes over a very hot clutch bell housing and so gets regularly fryings, which turns it brittle and increases its resistance. So the first thing to do is get this cable replaced with a new length. Don't just remove it and then try desperately to make the new one follow the same path. Instead, tie a piece of string firmly to one end, pull on the other end, and let the string follow the cable you are removing, so that it is there to pull the new cable through.
My car was never a bad starter, but recently I had my battery moved to the boot and changed for a gel type battery:
My genius of a TVR guy, rather than put in a length of cable back to the passenger footwell area, instead fed the new live cable from the + terminal of the new battery, straight down to the chassis rail and ran it along the driver's side chassis rail straight to the starter. The old "battery to starter" cable then became the main feed to everything else, by using the over-the-clutch cable in reverse. Simples. My battery now turns over the starter like a whirling dervish.
Starting power is dramatically improved with replacing and upgrading the main positive cable, I ran a new one through some flexible electrical conduit across the back of the engine away from the major heat and down to the starter area.
Will probably outlast the car, I added a larger negative from battery to engine too.
Will probably outlast the car, I added a larger negative from battery to engine too.
I recall one of my only failures on my 500 10 years ago now was a starter motor. As it was recovered it ended up having a generic rover supplier item fitted (partco I think) against my preferred choices, which I assumed wouldn't last very long, as my mantra was and always has been to replace original with upgraded parts.
Since then, however, it has always worked perfectly with the same turnkey strength as when it was new, despite the heat it suffers near the engine/manifold and the lack of heat shield I intended to fit but never did.
So I guess what I'm saying is a standard part should be fine without the need to upgrade, just keep battery tip top ( I use trickle charger) along with all the ignition components & it should be fine. Don't forget an ignition amplifier as a service part as most indies won't replace this in a service (about £40.00 5 mins to fit).
Since then, however, it has always worked perfectly with the same turnkey strength as when it was new, despite the heat it suffers near the engine/manifold and the lack of heat shield I intended to fit but never did.
So I guess what I'm saying is a standard part should be fine without the need to upgrade, just keep battery tip top ( I use trickle charger) along with all the ignition components & it should be fine. Don't forget an ignition amplifier as a service part as most indies won't replace this in a service (about £40.00 5 mins to fit).
Thanks for the pointers, much appreciated. Sounds like first step is to check this main cable and see what state it is in.
Interestingly it has now developed a warm start issue. From cold the car will start fine but now cutting after a minute or so and refusing to start again until cooled down? same wire do you think or something else.
Email sent to order a hot start kit this morning
Interestingly it has now developed a warm start issue. From cold the car will start fine but now cutting after a minute or so and refusing to start again until cooled down? same wire do you think or something else.
Email sent to order a hot start kit this morning
I am not saying that this is your issue, but mine did that (it took three or four minutes to become warm enough not to be able to hold any idle) when the stepper motor became temperature sensitive. A used genuine replacement solved the problem, but it took me weeks to get to that point.
In your case, can you stop it stalling by use of the right foot? Or is it stalling regardless?
The car not restarting when warm....how long do you need to leave it before it will restart?
In your case, can you stop it stalling by use of the right foot? Or is it stalling regardless?
The car not restarting when warm....how long do you need to leave it before it will restart?
alfaandy81 said:
Thanks, i must have completely got the wrong end of the stick with that then. I thought it solved the issues of cars stalling mid flow and then not starting which is kind of what mine was doing.
Any ideas what mine could be then or things i should check?
Thanks
The whole ECU and tick over control is quite complex but there are some simple things you can check. Firstly make sure your plugs are not sooted up- this could be a sign of it running richer than it should be, and an over rich mixture will make the car stall and difficult to restart. TVR plugs tend to run pretty black, but the insulator in the middle should not be jet black- dark brown is better. ECU wise, a faulty temp sensor, or failing AFM can over fuel the engine. You can try unplugging the stepper motor when the engine is idling OK, so this locks the stepper in this position. If the idle is still erratic or it stalls again, its not a stepper motor fault. Dirty stepper motors get blamed for all sorts of idle issues, but are only about 50% responsible, but its worth giving a clean anyway. Also check the base idle setting when hot.Any ideas what mine could be then or things i should check?
Thanks
Ive put a fair bit here:
http://www.g33.co.uk/fuel_injection.htm
Edited by blitzracing on Friday 26th June 15:47
Beefing up the stater cable is only part of there fix (which I've just done by the way).
Two types of problem;
1. Turn the key and nowt happens (e.g. lights do not dim)
->Not enough pd over the solenoid coil to fire it
I think this is what is called the 'hot start problem'. There are two fixes:
One is to bypass the starter circuit on the immobiliser and/or the key switch (but this only masks the real problem).
Correct fix is to replace the (probably knackered) immobiliser and also fit an external relay to take the solenoid coil current off the immobiliser.
2. Turn the key, starter tries to turn engine over but can't or only very slowly
Not enough pd over the stater.
Check engine earth leads and beef up the main stater and battery earth leads or knackered or low battery charge.
Two types of problem;
1. Turn the key and nowt happens (e.g. lights do not dim)
->Not enough pd over the solenoid coil to fire it
I think this is what is called the 'hot start problem'. There are two fixes:
One is to bypass the starter circuit on the immobiliser and/or the key switch (but this only masks the real problem).
Correct fix is to replace the (probably knackered) immobiliser and also fit an external relay to take the solenoid coil current off the immobiliser.
2. Turn the key, starter tries to turn engine over but can't or only very slowly
Not enough pd over the stater.
Check engine earth leads and beef up the main stater and battery earth leads or knackered or low battery charge.
I always do wonder why the hot start issue & similar problems seems to affect only certain cars and not others, often of the same vinatge.
Personally I've never had this issue, however, my META was upgraded to v2 just prior to purchasing it 10 years ago, it has crossed my mind whether the retro fit included the hot start solution?
Personally I've never had this issue, however, my META was upgraded to v2 just prior to purchasing it 10 years ago, it has crossed my mind whether the retro fit included the hot start solution?
Andy JB said:
I always do wonder why the hot start issue & similar problems seems to affect only certain cars and not others, often of the same vinatge.
Personally I've never had this issue, however, my META was upgraded to v2 just prior to purchasing it 10 years ago, it has crossed my mind whether the retro fit included the hot start solution?
I am told that Personally I've never had this issue, however, my META was upgraded to v2 just prior to purchasing it 10 years ago, it has crossed my mind whether the retro fit included the hot start solution?
1. newer fitted systems have the wiring the right way round, so don't suffer for this reason.
2. once the incorrectly wired relay is knackered, it is knackered, if you see what i mean.
3. If the hot start kit was fitted before the relay was knackered then everything will always be ok
4. It can depend on how much the car has been used.
Gassing Station | Chimaera | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff