Permitted development rights
Discussion
Not sure if this is in the right section, but it does relate to law, albeit planning law.
Our house is currently a U shape which we are considering making oblong by filling the void of the U. It would be a single story and same construction as the rest of the house, and would not infringe any permitted development restrictions
Knowing diddly-squat about planning rights I called the council who said I should complete their questionnaire, which I did.
The first part of the house was built in 1870 and it was extended twice, in 1970 and 1990 or thereabouts, and is set in a pretty decent sized plot.
Today I get a call from an extremely unpleasant woman from the planning department demanding that I identify and apportion the three builds. As she had the sketches in front of her I explain that it would be easier for me to explain where the lines, approximately, ran. Nope not good enough, must be in writing. Ok said I and asked her a question about the timeline for permitted development rights as I was under the impression that they were related to a percentage increase of the original house (I now know that it related to the size of the plot) She became quite obnoxious at this point and it should be said unhelpful.
I now understand (I think) without her help, that the rights are dependant on the size of the original house/plot in 1948. So three questions arise:
1) Why was she so interested in the "lines"
2) I have no idea how much land the house had when it was built, but now, I could fit the house into our plot half a dozen times and still not exceed 50 per cent of the plot. If however the original house only had a pocket handkerchief garden back in 1948, would that stymie my development rights? and,
3) If so is there anything I can do about that as it seems daft.
Thanks
Our house is currently a U shape which we are considering making oblong by filling the void of the U. It would be a single story and same construction as the rest of the house, and would not infringe any permitted development restrictions
Knowing diddly-squat about planning rights I called the council who said I should complete their questionnaire, which I did.
The first part of the house was built in 1870 and it was extended twice, in 1970 and 1990 or thereabouts, and is set in a pretty decent sized plot.
Today I get a call from an extremely unpleasant woman from the planning department demanding that I identify and apportion the three builds. As she had the sketches in front of her I explain that it would be easier for me to explain where the lines, approximately, ran. Nope not good enough, must be in writing. Ok said I and asked her a question about the timeline for permitted development rights as I was under the impression that they were related to a percentage increase of the original house (I now know that it related to the size of the plot) She became quite obnoxious at this point and it should be said unhelpful.
I now understand (I think) without her help, that the rights are dependant on the size of the original house/plot in 1948. So three questions arise:
1) Why was she so interested in the "lines"
2) I have no idea how much land the house had when it was built, but now, I could fit the house into our plot half a dozen times and still not exceed 50 per cent of the plot. If however the original house only had a pocket handkerchief garden back in 1948, would that stymie my development rights? and,
3) If so is there anything I can do about that as it seems daft.
Thanks
Was the 1990 extension done with or without planning permission and obviously a planning application. Assuming a planning application was made '90 the local council should still have this on record and you can request for a small fee a copy of planning application.
Your council may still hold the 1970's planning application for the first extension.
The application should contain an outline existing plot drawing showing the then extents of the property. Moreover the land registry records will cover historical plot boundaries.
Your council may still hold the 1970's planning application for the first extension.
The application should contain an outline existing plot drawing showing the then extents of the property. Moreover the land registry records will cover historical plot boundaries.
Involving the council was probably your first mistake 
.
No, seriously, you shouldn't have done that
.
Planning departments do not exist to help people with planning, they exist to meet mandated government targets for shuffling paperwork and they will prioritise this over getting a sensible outcome every time.
I can't answer all your questions as I've had more involvement with PD on auxiliary buildings rather than extensions of the residential building but I may be able to clarify a couple of points.
1948 is the magic year because that's when the original framework for the current planning law was enacted.
Most borough councils have a local policy as to how much a house can be extended over it's original (1948) size but these percentages are just guidelines for the planning officers to work to, they are not statutory and they will be regularly ignored by the planning committee. Also, these limits are only applicable to planning applications and not to PD rights which are generally statutory.
The area of the plot has statutory relevance in regard to PD rights because they are restricted to building on less than 50% of the free area on the plot, this applies to extensions and auxiliary buildings but they are applied to the current plot size so it doesn't sound like there would be a problem for you in this.
The size of an extension under PD rights is mostly defined by it's actual size rather than by comparison with the original building or the plot, it is also important to look at which part of the house is being extended (front, back etc) and how close it is to the plot boundaries and any neighbours. This means that your previous extensions may be restrictive if you were applying for planning permission to extend but very likely will not matter if you are looking to use PD rights.
There's a guide HERE that will give some more detail as to exactly what is allowed.
HTH!
.No, seriously, you shouldn't have done that
. Planning departments do not exist to help people with planning, they exist to meet mandated government targets for shuffling paperwork and they will prioritise this over getting a sensible outcome every time.
I can't answer all your questions as I've had more involvement with PD on auxiliary buildings rather than extensions of the residential building but I may be able to clarify a couple of points.
1948 is the magic year because that's when the original framework for the current planning law was enacted.
Most borough councils have a local policy as to how much a house can be extended over it's original (1948) size but these percentages are just guidelines for the planning officers to work to, they are not statutory and they will be regularly ignored by the planning committee. Also, these limits are only applicable to planning applications and not to PD rights which are generally statutory.
The area of the plot has statutory relevance in regard to PD rights because they are restricted to building on less than 50% of the free area on the plot, this applies to extensions and auxiliary buildings but they are applied to the current plot size so it doesn't sound like there would be a problem for you in this.
The size of an extension under PD rights is mostly defined by it's actual size rather than by comparison with the original building or the plot, it is also important to look at which part of the house is being extended (front, back etc) and how close it is to the plot boundaries and any neighbours. This means that your previous extensions may be restrictive if you were applying for planning permission to extend but very likely will not matter if you are looking to use PD rights.
There's a guide HERE that will give some more detail as to exactly what is allowed.
HTH!
Steve H said:
Involving the council was probably your first mistake .
No, seriously, you shouldn't have done that.
Planning departments do not exist to help people with planning, they exist to meet mandated government targets for shuffling paperwork and they will prioritise this over getting a sensible outcome every time.
I can't answer all your questions as I've had more involvement with PD on auxiliary buildings rather than extensions of the residential building but I may be able to clarify a couple of points.
1948 is the magic year because that's when the original framework for the current planning law was enacted.
Most borough councils have a local policy as to how much a house can be extended over it's original (1948) size but these percentages are just guidelines for the planning officers to work to, they are not statutory and they will be regularly ignored by the planning committee. Also, these limits are only applicable to planning applications and not to PD rights which are generally statutory.
The area of the plot has statutory relevance in regard to PD rights because they are restricted to building on less than 50% of the free area on the plot, this applies to extensions and auxiliary buildings but they are applied to the current plot size so it doesn't sound like there would be a problem for you in this.
The size of an extension under PD rights is mostly defined by it's actual size rather than by comparison with the original building or the plot, it is also important to look at which part of the house is being extended (front, back etc) and how close it is to the plot boundaries and any neighbours. This means that your previous extensions may be restrictive if you were applying for planning permission to extend but very likely will not matter if you are looking to use PD rights.
There's a guide HERE that will give some more detail as to exactly what is allowed.
HTH!
Thanks, that confirms my new, but not got before entanglement with planning department, knowledge. Two friends remarked casually that I shouldn't bother with them....they were so right!.No, seriously, you shouldn't have done that
. Planning departments do not exist to help people with planning, they exist to meet mandated government targets for shuffling paperwork and they will prioritise this over getting a sensible outcome every time.
I can't answer all your questions as I've had more involvement with PD on auxiliary buildings rather than extensions of the residential building but I may be able to clarify a couple of points.
1948 is the magic year because that's when the original framework for the current planning law was enacted.
Most borough councils have a local policy as to how much a house can be extended over it's original (1948) size but these percentages are just guidelines for the planning officers to work to, they are not statutory and they will be regularly ignored by the planning committee. Also, these limits are only applicable to planning applications and not to PD rights which are generally statutory.
The area of the plot has statutory relevance in regard to PD rights because they are restricted to building on less than 50% of the free area on the plot, this applies to extensions and auxiliary buildings but they are applied to the current plot size so it doesn't sound like there would be a problem for you in this.
The size of an extension under PD rights is mostly defined by it's actual size rather than by comparison with the original building or the plot, it is also important to look at which part of the house is being extended (front, back etc) and how close it is to the plot boundaries and any neighbours. This means that your previous extensions may be restrictive if you were applying for planning permission to extend but very likely will not matter if you are looking to use PD rights.
There's a guide HERE that will give some more detail as to exactly what is allowed.
HTH!
b0rk said:
Was the 1990 extension done with or without planning permission and obviously a planning application. Assuming a planning application was made '90 the local council should still have this on record and you can request for a small fee a copy of planning application.
Your council may still hold the 1970's planning application for the first extension.
The application should contain an outline existing plot drawing showing the then extents of the property. Moreover the land registry records will cover historical plot boundaries.
See Steve's post the historic plot boundaries seems not to be an issue. I know that at least the second extension had planning permission, but it was larger and would have fallen foul of PD restrictions with regard to size & shape etc. Current proposed one doesn't.Your council may still hold the 1970's planning application for the first extension.
The application should contain an outline existing plot drawing showing the then extents of the property. Moreover the land registry records will cover historical plot boundaries.
Looks like, subject to any insanity the local planning department comes up with, I'm home and dry.
Thanks both...
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