Car Sales Agents/Brokers - legal rights?
Discussion
As in, a person, advertising as a trader with company name on all the usual outlets including his own company website.
They photograph your car, deal with all the sales enquiries, road tests it with the buyer and sells it on your behalf, at your property, then you pay a commission.
Most of these companies appear to be calling it a 'private sale' however according to several business advertising disclosure orders and the sale of goods act,
state this is more likely to be a 'trader' and therefore has to stand over the vehicle like any other car dealer as opposed to a private seller.
This seller or broker/agent chap is then responsible if something goes wrong, or for instance was mis sold?
Anyone shed any light on this? Been trawling the net for hours now and it seems to be a fairly new/unheard of thing so can find v.little info.
They photograph your car, deal with all the sales enquiries, road tests it with the buyer and sells it on your behalf, at your property, then you pay a commission.
Most of these companies appear to be calling it a 'private sale' however according to several business advertising disclosure orders and the sale of goods act,
state this is more likely to be a 'trader' and therefore has to stand over the vehicle like any other car dealer as opposed to a private seller.
This seller or broker/agent chap is then responsible if something goes wrong, or for instance was mis sold?
Anyone shed any light on this? Been trawling the net for hours now and it seems to be a fairly new/unheard of thing so can find v.little info.
A number of potential things
civil issues
1) if the trader is an agent for a private seller then it is still a private sale and SOGA doesn;t apply
However, is the trader making it clear the car is not his stock and he is merely selling it for someone else? If not the buyer may be able to argue they thought they were buying from a car trader and a court may agree.
criminal
2) if the trader is not making it clear he is an agent and it is a private sale and the buyer will not have the same rights as if buying from a trader then he could be comitting an offence ofmisleading omission udner the consuemr protection from unfair trading regulations 2008
3) any lies the trader tells to sell the car on to earn a comission could constitue an offence under the above regualtions (becuase he wil lstill be classed as a tarder for operating his car selling service)
Basically as long as the trader is open and honest about the fact he is an agent for a private seller i dont see why it cannot continue as a private sale. a buyer will expect certain things when buying from a trader (such as SOGA rights) so it should be made clear to them they are not contratcing with a trader.
civil issues
1) if the trader is an agent for a private seller then it is still a private sale and SOGA doesn;t apply
However, is the trader making it clear the car is not his stock and he is merely selling it for someone else? If not the buyer may be able to argue they thought they were buying from a car trader and a court may agree.
criminal
2) if the trader is not making it clear he is an agent and it is a private sale and the buyer will not have the same rights as if buying from a trader then he could be comitting an offence ofmisleading omission udner the consuemr protection from unfair trading regulations 2008
3) any lies the trader tells to sell the car on to earn a comission could constitue an offence under the above regualtions (becuase he wil lstill be classed as a tarder for operating his car selling service)
Basically as long as the trader is open and honest about the fact he is an agent for a private seller i dont see why it cannot continue as a private sale. a buyer will expect certain things when buying from a trader (such as SOGA rights) so it should be made clear to them they are not contratcing with a trader.
Essentially... A vehicle was purchased via this trader/agent very recently. HPI clear, car collected and paid for. Buyer sent off V5, has come back from holiday to find a letter in the mail saying car is subject to a VIC check and cannot be driven or issued with a new V5.
Another HPI has been carried out and while the buyer was on holiday (a week after collecting the car) it is now recorded a Cat C insurance write off. Was advertised as HPI clear, and informed never been damaged bar one scratch (smart repair) on a door. That information was gathered from both the trader and the actual owner of the vehicle at collection/payment.
We're talking about a 17k+ car here too, so a substantial valuation issue.
Interesting situation...
Another HPI has been carried out and while the buyer was on holiday (a week after collecting the car) it is now recorded a Cat C insurance write off. Was advertised as HPI clear, and informed never been damaged bar one scratch (smart repair) on a door. That information was gathered from both the trader and the actual owner of the vehicle at collection/payment.
We're talking about a 17k+ car here too, so a substantial valuation issue.
Interesting situation...
I believe there are 3 major questions here.
Did the agent have any knowledge of the HPI status?
If he has said that the car was checked and all clear then does he have any proof?
Did the seller provide the agent with false information which he has acted on in good faith?
doesn't sound like something that will be quickly sorted out
Did the agent have any knowledge of the HPI status?
If he has said that the car was checked and all clear then does he have any proof?
Did the seller provide the agent with false information which he has acted on in good faith?
doesn't sound like something that will be quickly sorted out
It made no difference hiding behind it being sold for a customer the dealer has the same liability as selling his own stock and he will be fully aware of this and as a dealer he is the professional and should have known the car has a bad history - get your money back ASAP from dealer.
rallycross said:
It made no difference hiding behind it being sold for a customer the dealer has the same liability as selling his own stock and he will be fully aware of this and as a dealer he is the professional and should have known the car has a bad history - get your money back ASAP from dealer.
What basis do you believe it's impossible for a car dealer to act as a broker rather than directly selling a car?The OPs story is that is's sold from the owner's house, with the owner present to comment on the car's history and advertised as a private sale, this sound very different to a car dealer 'selling it for a friend' from his premises type scenario which you will find most internet advice saying the dealer can't do that will be based on
Owner was present, as in, in the house but it was the trader acting as seller who went through all history, road test and price negotiation.
From what I have read online and particularly the business advertising disclosure order 1977, if advertising on his or someone else's behalf it is still a trade sale.
Either way the fact the car clearly had some sort of shunt or damage and an insurance claim going on against it at the time of viewing which either the trader or actual owner did not disclose is an issue.
Meaning, even if it was a private or trade sale it is misleading information.
The buyer was not made aware of this and simply told it was HPI clear, and small scratch on a door was repaired.
From what I have read online and particularly the business advertising disclosure order 1977, if advertising on his or someone else's behalf it is still a trade sale.
Either way the fact the car clearly had some sort of shunt or damage and an insurance claim going on against it at the time of viewing which either the trader or actual owner did not disclose is an issue.
Meaning, even if it was a private or trade sale it is misleading information.
The buyer was not made aware of this and simply told it was HPI clear, and small scratch on a door was repaired.
Presumably there are a few routes to go down...
HPI - if the prospective buyer did the initial HPI (rather than just being told it was all clear), then doesn't the HPI come with insurance (provided the raft of conditiions were met)?
Misrepresentation - in a private sale you have this to rely on. If the buyer was told no accidents (barring scratch) and it clearly had a big one then it's probably fair to say they seller knew about it and lied.
Trade sale - there may some way of it being a trade sale with a trader involved, but I think it's unlikely.
So I'd talk to the HPI company and (for a 17k value) probably get a solicitor involved to go down the misrepresentation route (assuming the seller doesn't just capitulate and give money back).
BErt
HPI - if the prospective buyer did the initial HPI (rather than just being told it was all clear), then doesn't the HPI come with insurance (provided the raft of conditiions were met)?
Misrepresentation - in a private sale you have this to rely on. If the buyer was told no accidents (barring scratch) and it clearly had a big one then it's probably fair to say they seller knew about it and lied.
Trade sale - there may some way of it being a trade sale with a trader involved, but I think it's unlikely.
So I'd talk to the HPI company and (for a 17k value) probably get a solicitor involved to go down the misrepresentation route (assuming the seller doesn't just capitulate and give money back).
BErt
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