PPP (People for Proper Policing)
Discussion
gh0st said:
It will be interesting to hear the BiB's take on this...
Can't see anything they'd disagree with.
The problem is that ACPO et al are a force unto themselves. I doubt they know anything about "policing" in the way our resident BiB do i.e. being Policemen.
Same in my line of work ; seen "inspectors" and "advisors" backed against a wall in terror faced with a difficult child (hugely tempting to look the other way) ; and our local head of Social Services Children's department was (i) stupefyingly incompetent with children (ii) ignorant and (iii) probably clinically mad, literally.
Problem is, "good cops" don't get promoted ; or if they do, not to high enough levels, fast enough.
The system rewards people who play the system, not who understand policing. I think there's something of people who can't do the job know it and spend their time politicking and brown nosing their way up the ladder.
I was watching that "Judge John Deed" thing ..
he got zapped by a speed cam in one episode whilst charging off to rescue his girlfriend from the clutches of his rival
But..overall - programme ist very entertaining, watchable, mit insight into law und legal system (even though it usually has a too happy court case outcome - which ist not reality - this ist where it loses plot a bit...und judges are usually not so
) but there are digs at the system and the governnment - and whoever wrote it ist getting a dig at the government trying to control the judiciary. Quite like this programme as light entertainment.
One line deliverd by our heroic judge in the Thursday drama rang very true:
"This government ist only in power by virtue of a minority of a politically apathetic public!"
Und politically correct and ambitious muppets of cops, teachers, und so weiter are the ones who wag their tails und adopt the smarmy bottom licking positions to get up the ladder - und become puppets mit long noses! .....
he got zapped by a speed cam in one episode whilst charging off to rescue his girlfriend from the clutches of his rival But..overall - programme ist very entertaining, watchable, mit insight into law und legal system (even though it usually has a too happy court case outcome - which ist not reality - this ist where it loses plot a bit...und judges are usually not so
) but there are digs at the system and the governnment - and whoever wrote it ist getting a dig at the government trying to control the judiciary. Quite like this programme as light entertainment. One line deliverd by our heroic judge in the Thursday drama rang very true:
"This government ist only in power by virtue of a minority of a politically apathetic public!"
Und politically correct and ambitious muppets of cops, teachers, und so weiter are the ones who wag their tails und adopt the smarmy bottom licking positions to get up the ladder - und become puppets mit long noses! .....
WildCat said:
I was watching that "Judge John Deed" thing ..
But..overall - programme ist very entertaining, watchable, mit insight into law und legal system (even though it usually has a too happy court case outcome - which ist not reality - this ist where it loses plot a bit...und judges are usually not so
One line deliverd by our heroic judge in the Thursday drama rang very true:
"This government ist only in power by virtue of a minority of a politically apathetic public!"
Und politically correct and ambitious muppets of cops, teachers, und so weiter are the ones who wag their tails und adopt the smarmy bottom licking positions to get up the ladder - und become puppets mit long noses! .....
Wildy I have to say that this is the kind of programme that comes up from time to time and demonstrates why British Television can still produce the best drama in the world.
Martin Shaw was simply born to play this part, he is utterly superb.
And you're absolutely right, it makes powerful and totally pertinent comment on the corruptions of the system of justice, particularly the destructive political influences.
What comes across most powerfully for me is the amount of physical and mental effort that Shaw, as a High Court judge, has to put in just to avoid corruptive influences and to ensure that justice is not only done, but is seen to be done in a public forum such as the Court.
What a great pity we can't get more people of his calibre on the bench.
I understand he is based on a real life judge.
I don't agree with you about some of the outcomes though, I have seen some pretty sticky endings.
I think AXA PPP Healthcare might possibly have something to say about the use of "PPP". 
IOLAIRE said:
I was watching that "Judge John Deed" thing ..
But..overall - programme ist very entertaining, watchable, mit insight into law und legal system (even though it usually has a too happy court case outcome - which ist not reality - this ist where it loses plot a bit...und judges are usually not so
One line deliverd by our heroic judge in the Thursday drama rang very true:
"This government ist only in power by virtue of a minority of a politically apathetic public!"
Und politically correct and ambitious muppets of cops, teachers, und so weiter are the ones who wag their tails und adopt the smarmy bottom licking positions to get up the ladder - und become puppets mit long noses! .....
Wildy I have to say that this is the kind of programme that comes up from time to time and demonstrates why British Television can still produce the best drama in the world.
Martin Shaw was simply born to play this part, he is utterly superb.
And you're absolutely right, it makes powerful and totally pertinent comment on the corruptions of the system of justice, particularly the destructive political influences.
What comes across most powerfully for me is the amount of physical and mental effort that Shaw, as a High Court judge, has to put in just to avoid corruptive influences and to ensure that justice is not only done, but is seen to be done in a public forum such as the Court.
What a great pity we can't get more people of his calibre on the bench.
I understand he is based on a real life judge.
I don't agree with you about some of the outcomes though, I have seen some pretty sticky endings.
Yes it is an amusing programme, particularly this weeks rant about erosion of liberty being allowed by the apathetic and indolent.
G F Newman the series author has a fair track record of writing excellent drama which exposes corruption within such as the criminal justice system and pointing out why the current Govt are such a set of manipulative idiots.
Funnily enough he was turned down as a script writer for Z cars (for suggesting a plot where John Watt took a bribe) but his first success iirc was with the Law and Order series for the beeb.
There are still scenes from that series that shock me today, eg the prison cell where a prisoner was seriously assaulted with truncheons up his :cough: rear end.
To be frank Newman went too far in Law and Order with his "all coppers are bar stewards" approach.
However age has tempered him and Deed is an excellent series. He reckons that Deed's popularity is because "Judge John Deed is the kind of judge you would hope to appear in front of, were you ever to go up the steps. He appeals to most people because he pursues justice regardless of personal risk and a sense of justice is one of the highest of human aspirations. Deed speaks out against all the petty rules and bureaucracy that frustrates us all but that most of us don’t speak out against."
On a lighter note someone observed on Steve Wright's R2 show that he knows he's getting old because he looks in the mirror and Judge Deed is looking back at him. Geezer sat in the car with me at the time commented "He thinks he's got problems, I look in the mirror and see Donald Sinden" PMSL at that one as its so accurate, you have to know the guy, real old crusty but salt of the earth.
Flat in Fifth said:
WildCat said:
I was watching that "Judge John Deed" thing ..
But..overall - programme ist very entertaining, watchable, mit insight into law und legal system (even though it usually has a too happy court case outcome - which ist not reality - this ist where it loses plot a bit...und judges are usually not so
One line deliverd by our heroic judge in the Thursday drama rang very true:
"This government ist only in power by virtue of a minority of a politically apathetic public!"
Und politically correct and ambitious muppets of cops, teachers, und so weiter are the ones who wag their tails und adopt the smarmy bottom licking positions to get up the ladder - und become puppets mit long noses! .....
Wildy I have to say that this is the kind of programme that comes up from time to time and demonstrates why British Television can still produce the best drama in the world.
Martin Shaw was simply born to play this part, he is utterly superb.
And you're absolutely right, it makes powerful and totally pertinent comment on the corruptions of the system of justice, particularly the destructive political influences.
What comes across most powerfully for me is the amount of physical and mental effort that Shaw, as a High Court judge, has to put in just to avoid corruptive influences and to ensure that justice is not only done, but is seen to be done in a public forum such as the Court.
What a great pity we can't get more people of his calibre on the bench.
I understand he is based on a real life judge.
I don't agree with you about some of the outcomes though, I have seen some pretty sticky endings.
Yes it is an amusing programme, particularly this weeks rant about erosion of liberty being allowed by the apathetic and indolent.
G F Newman the series author has a fair track record of writing excellent drama which exposes corruption within such as the criminal justice system and pointing out why the current Govt are such a set of manipulative idiots.
Funnily enough he was turned down as a script writer for Z cars (for suggesting a plot where John Watt took a bribe) but his first success iirc was with the Law and Order series for the beeb.
There are still scenes from that series that shock me today, eg the prison cell where a prisoner was seriously assaulted with truncheons up his :cough: rear end.
To be frank Newman went too far in Law and Order with his "all coppers are bar stewards" approach.
However age has tempered him and Deed is an excellent series. He reckons that Deed's popularity is because "Judge John Deed is the kind of judge you would hope to appear in front of, were you ever to go up the steps. He appeals to most people because he pursues justice regardless of personal risk and a sense of justice is one of the highest of human aspirations. Deed speaks out against all the petty rules and bureaucracy that frustrates us all but that most of us don’t speak out against."
On a lighter note someone observed on Steve Wright's R2 show that he knows he's getting old because he looks in the mirror and Judge Deed is looking back at him. Geezer sat in the car with me at the time commented "He thinks he's got problems, I look in the mirror and see Donald Sinden" PMSL at that one as its so accurate, you have to know the guy, real old crusty but salt of the earth.
My God FiF, you've really got the nostalgic juices flowing now, Z Cars, with Jock and Fancy Smith, Watt, and Lynch. and the magic penny whistle theme tune!
And the white Zephyr Zodiacs!
A lot of these actors went on to greater things, particularly guys like Brian Blessed.
I agree with you about Law and Order though, I actually found it offensive and thought it did a great deal of harm to the public image of the police in a way that was unjustified.
The thing is FiF, there was so much morality and justice in these early cop shows, and sadly that is what is lacking in so many modern programmes.
Call me an old softy, but I love HEARTBEAT!
IOLAIRE said:
My God FiF, you've really got the nostalgic juices flowing now, Z Cars, with Jock and Fancy Smith, Watt, and Lynch. and the magic penny whistle theme tune!
And the white Zephyr Zodiacs!
One of my fave programmes when I were a lad.
I still have my toy Z-car - bit battered - but I still have it!
[quote=IOLAIRE}
The thing is FiF, there was so much morality and justice in these early cop shows, and sadly that is what is lacking in so many modern programmes.
Call me an old softy, but I love HEARTBEAT![/quote]
I agree - and I like Heart beat as well. Wildy thinks the only good thing about is the 60s music - the scenery =- but shame about the plot!
She's hard to please! (Except when ...
) )JonRB said:
I think AXA PPP Healthcare might possibly have something to say about the use of "PPP".
Doubt it predates Unix's Point-to-Point Protocol.
havoc said:
Seems to be the case in all walks of life now:
- Those who brown-nose and play office-politics...get promoted;
- Those who quietly do a good job...get overlooked;
- Those who try and change things without playing the system first...get shafted.
Sad effect of "Human Resources".
We used to interview people by (whilst watching closely for safety obviously), throwing them a football and sending them out to play/chat ; or suddenly start swearing at them in the interview to see if they panicked. Sounds a bit bizarre, but worked.
These days you have to ask them if they understand the Childrens Act 1989 (for example). Incompetents know the answers off pat. Potentially excellent people who don't know ; you can train them. Farcical.
I bet the same applies in the Force
"Please explain who racially motivated profiling can empower the system dynamics of crime-related management statistics"
Mr incompetent-bull*****er BA (Failed) can fluently answer these questions all day
(all you do is read the question out in a different order. "The system dynamics empower racially motivated profiling by motivating racial differentials in an dynamic crime-related manner".)
Can he motivate and lead his men ? No chance. Can he sort out the kind of "yobbo squad" Gone wrote about ? Of course not.
autismuk said:Not sure. According to AXA's website PPP "was conceived in 1938" although it wasn't until 1962 that they changed their trading name from 'Hospital Services Plan' to 'Private Patients Plan'.
I think AXA PPP Healthcare might possibly have something to say about the use of "PPP".
IOLAIRE said:
The thing is FiF, there was so much morality and justice in these early cop shows, and sadly that is what is lacking in so many modern programmes.
Call me an old softy, but I love HEARTBEAT!
Chanced upon an old episode of Z cars a few weeks back. How right you are with that observation. Fancy and Jock with a bit of old fashioned policing nicked the TR4 driver who was driving like a prat and then told them porkies.
Plus the absent minded old timer caught shoplifting was dealt with sympathetically and you just knew the result was that he'd never err again.
Mind you there was still a gaffer in the shape of Charlie Barlow who was more fixated on one particular irrelevancy rather than the main job in hand. Nowt changes it seems.
Heartbeat country ahh yes, N York Moors and Whitby always going to be have greater photogenic potential than the other end of the county.
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